BY Vertue of an Ordinance of Parl. of the 15. of this instant Oc­tober, authorizing us, We do constitute and appoint you, Sir T. Whatton, Sir Rob. King, Sir John Clatworthy, and Sir Robert Meredith. Knights, and Rich. Salwey Esq Commissioners to treat with the Lord of Ormond, for and concerning the delivery of the Sword, the City of Dublin, and all other Garrisons and Holds in his power. And you or any three of you have hereby power to treat with the said L. of Ormond, concerning the premises, and to agree & con­clude with him concerning the same, acoording to such instructions as are delivered unto you.

Copia vera

IT is this day Ordered by the Commons assembled in Parlia­ment, That it be referred to the Members of both Houses, that are of the Committee of both Kingdomes, to consider of these Letters, and to receive the Addresses of the Commissioners from Ireland, and their Prop [...]sitions, and to view and consider of their Instructions, and the Members of this House that are of the Committee of both Kingdomes, or any four of them, have po­wer to meet this Afternoon at two of the clock in Darby-house for the purposes aforesaid, and haue power to report tomorrow, if they shall see occasion; And the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland, Mr. Hollis, Sir John Clotworthy, and Sir Iohn Temple, have power, and are desired to be present at the meeting of this Committee.

Mr. Na. Fi [...]es, Sir W. Lewis, and Mr. Rob. Goodwyn are added to this Committee.

THE Lords and Commons assembled in Parliament, do de­clare, that they resolve to proceed upon the second way of Overture, made by the Earl of Ormond, and will appoint some way of treating with him for his Retirement, and will imploy such as they shall think fit in the Trust of that Kingdome.

Vera Copia,

ORdered by the Lords and Commons in Parliament assem­bled, That the whole Affaire concerning Ireland, in respect of the secresie and expedition thereunto necessary, be referred back to the former Committee, And the Committee hath po­wer to give Instructions to such as they shall imploy for the pursuance and transaction of that Affaire, and to Order the For­c [...]s that shall go thither, and to dispose of the Ammunition, and other Provisions for the Service of Ireland, as they shall judge best for the Publique Service, and are to meet this Afternoon, and so from time to time as they shall see cause.

Vera Copia,

Instructions for Sir Tho. Wharton, Sir Rob. King, Sir John Clot­worthy, Sir Rob. Meredith, Knights, and Rich. Salwey, Esq concerning the Lord of Ormond.

YOu are to declare to the L. of Ormond, the E. of Roscommon, and the rest of those that signed the Instructions to Sir Ger­rard Lowther, Sir Francis Willoughby, and Sir Panl Davies, That the Parliament will take into their Care and Protection the Pro­testants of Ireland. If the L. of Ormond do within foure dayes de­liver up the Swo [...]d, render all the Garrisons, and other Com­mands to the pleasure of the Parliament, Then you, or any three of you, are to give these ensuing Conditions.

[Page 4] 1. That the L. of Ormond shall enjoy his estate without mole­station or disturbance from the Parl. And shall have indempni­ty against all debts contracted by reason of any Goods, Money, Debts, or Victuals taken up by vertue of any Warrants signed by him and the Councel, from any person, for the maintenance and support of the Armies, or any of the Garrisons, now under his Command.

2. That he shall be protected in his Person and Goods for the space of 12 moneths against all Suits, Arrests, Molestation, or Disturbance from any person whatsoever, for any Debts owing by him to any person whatsoever before the Rebellion there.

3. That the L. of Ormond, and all such Noblemen, Gentlemen, and Officers, as shall be desirous to go with him, or by them­selves, into any other place out of that Kingdom, shall have free Passes for themselves, their Families, Goods, & travelling Arms, and a competent number of servants sutable to their respective Qualities.

4. That the L. of Ormond shall have 5000. l. paid him in Eng­land or Ireland, in such manner as shall seeme best to the Com­missioners now sent: And shall have also 2000. l. per annum for 5 yeares, And if the Warre shall longer continue in such man­ner, as he cannot receive 2000. l. per annum, out of his owne E­state, That then he shall have the said Pension of 2000. l. per annum still continued, untill he can receive so much out of his own estate.

5. That the L. of Ormond shall have liberty to come and live here in England, With the like liberty that others have, he sub­mitting to all Ordinances of Parliament. And for the time of 12 moneths shall not be pressed to any Oaths, he ingaging his honour to do nothing in the mean time, that shall be disservice to the Parliament.

Vera Copia

VVE find in the Instructions delivered in by you unto us, That you are to declare unto us, and the rest that signed the Instructions to Sir Gerard Lowther, &c. That the Parl. will take into their Gare and Protection the Protestants of Ireland. We desire to know, whether by these words. viz. [That the Parl. will take into their Gare and Protection the Protestants of Ireland] All the Protestants of Ireland are to enjoy their Laws, Liberties, Estates, and Imployments, without molestation or di­sturbance from the Parliament of England.

VVEE find by the Instructions delivered in by you unto us, these words, viz. If the Lord of Ormond doe within 4 dayes deliver up the Sword, render all the Garrisons and other Commands to the pleasure of the Parliament, then &c. Wee de­sire to know when the said foure dayes shall be understood to begin, and to what Person or Persons, and to whose use the said Sword, Garrisons and other Commands, are desired to be deli­vered up, or rendred.

TO your Lordships first Paper of the 15 of Novem. we return this Answer; That we are required by the Paper of Instru­ctions delivered to your Lordship, to declare to your Lordship, the E. of Roscomon, and the rest that signed the Instructions to Sir Gerard Lowther, &c. That the Parliament will take into their Care and Protection the Protestants of Ireland. But desire to be excused from giving a particular explatation of those words in that Paper, being not directed so to do, yet conceive there ought to be no doubt of a fair interpretation thereof.

ALthough we question not a fair interpretation, yet in mat­ters so highly importing the safety and subsistence of the [...] [Page 6]stants of this Kingdome, we may not leave them to the uncer­tainty of future interpretation: and therefore we cannot re [...] satisfied without clearer assurance in their behalf, then we fi [...]de either in the Instruction delivered unto us by you this d [...]y (whereof we desire an Explanation) or the Answer given y [...] you to our first Paper.

TO your Lordships second Paper of the 15. of November, we return this Answer: That the four dayes appointed for the Treaty with your Lordship (within which time we are to bring our Debates to a conclusion) we understand did begin this 15. of Novemb. 1646. at 9 in the morning, And we who are appointed Commissioners by Authority from the Parl. of England, are to receive from your Lordship (if the Treaty succeed) the Sword, and Garrisons under your Command, for the use of the Parlia­ment of England, in order to the preservation of the Protestants in the Kingdom of Ireland.

VVEE desire to know, whether your Lordship rests satis­fied in all the particulars of the Paper of Instructions de­livered to you by us this day, saving that which concernes the Protestants, as is expressed in your Lordships third Paper.

VVE hold it not fit to declare our sense concening the par­ticulars of the paper of Instruction, delivered by you to us which concern our self, untill assurance be first given for the safety and subsistence of the Protestants of this Kingdome, which we desire may be hastened for the bringing of this Trea­ty to a speedy and good conclusion.

FOrasmuch as your Lordship in your third paper of the fifteenth of this instant doth expresse; That you cannot rest satisfied without clearer assurance on the behalfe of the Prote­stants [Page 7]of Ireland then you find either in the instructions deli­vered to you by us this day, or in our answers to your Lord­ship touching the explanation thereof, as was in your first pa­per desired. And whereas your Lordship in your fourth, in answer to our third, hath signified, that you hold it not fit to declare your sense concerning the particulars of the paper of Instructions, which concern your selfe, untill assurance be first given for the safety and subsistance of the Protestants of the kingdom of Ireland; to the end nothing may be wanting on our parts, to bring this Treaty to a speedy & happy conclusion, we hold it fit to declare, That by an additional Instruction (which we night not sooner impart) we are enabled to give to such Protestants (not having been in the Irish rebellion) as we con­dition withall, assurance of security to their persons, and to their estates and goods, that they have in Ireland, and that they may live quietly and securely under the protection of the Par­liament, and their Forces, either within England, Ireland, or Wales, and that they shall enjoy those their estates and goods, without any molestation or question faom the Parliament, as any others doe, who have not offended the Parliament, they submitting to all Ordinances of Parliament; and if any of them have any lands or estates in England, they are to com­pound for the same at the rate of two yeares profit, as they were before the beginning of these troubles, They submitting to all ordinances of Parliament.

BEfore we make answer to your fourth paper of the fifteenth of November, we hold it needfull to have an authentick co­py of the additionall Instruction therein mentioned, being for the security of the Protestant-Subjects of this Kingdome. And we desire authentick copies of such other additionall Instructi­ons as you have, in regard your commission is limited by, and hath relation to your instructions.

TO your Lordships fifth paper of the fifteenth of November, we return this answer, That to the end nothing may be [Page 8]wanting on our parts, conducing to the security of the Prote­stants of Ireland, according to the Instructions given us by au­thority of Parliament; and that we may accordingly put a speedy conclusion to this Treaty, we doe for your Lordships more ample satisfaction (though we hold, not our selves obli­ged thereunto) herewith freely deliver your Lordship an Au­thentick copy of the additionall Instructions: But we must desire to be excused from giving any further answer to the said paper, untill we receive your Loadships positive answer upon the papers already given in, hoping it will be believed, That as we have not hitherto, so we shall not for the future offer any thing, unto which we are not warranted by our Instructions.

The Additionall Instruction concerning the Protestants of Ireland.

YOu, or any three of you, may give to such Protestants, (not ha­ving been in the Irish Rebellion) as you condition with all, assu­rance of security to their persons, and to their estates and goods, that they have in Ireland; and that they may live quietly, and se­curely under the protection of the Parliament, and their Forces, either within England, Ireland, or Wales: And you may like­wise assure them, that they shall enjoy those their estates and goods without any molestation, or question from the Parliament, as any others doe, who have not affended the Parliament: They submit­ting to all Ordinances of Parliament. And if any of them have any Lands or Estates in England, they are to compound for the same at the rate of two yeares profit, as they were before the be­ginning of these troubles, They submitting to all Ordinances of Parliament.

Copia vera

VVHereas we have been info [...]med, that the Armies of the Rebels lye neare this [...]iti [...], and may probably make some speedy attempt upon the same: we hold it our du­ty for the preservation thereof, and of he Protestants therein, to declare, that if your Lordship apprehend such danger to be, and that any Supplies of Men and Ammunition which wee have brought with us, may prevent the same: we are rea [...]y to give all such assistance, as may be thought expedient, during the time the p [...]es [...]nt Treaty c [...]n [...]i [...]u [...]s with you Lordship, and are willing to give such Cantion as may be expected from us, That no other use sha [...]l be made of the same, then is herein ex­pressed, and sha [...]l expect the like from your Lordship. As also, that such Men and Ammunition as we shall bring a-shore for the purposes aforesaid, be (if the Treaty succeed not) retur­ned us back again.

UPon consideration had of your fourth. Paper of the fif­teenth of this moneth, and the first paper of the sixteenth of this in n [...]th and he Copy of the Additionall Instruction sent unto us therewith, before we can deliver any positive an­swer to your papers, we hold it necessary to be satisfied in the following particulars.

First, whereas you expresse in that paper of the fifteenth, as followeth, viz. we are enabled to [...]ive to such Protestants not having been in the Irish rebellion, as we condition withall, as­surance of security to their persons, and the [...]estater and goods, that they have in Ireland: we desire you to declare whether those words, viz. [such Protestants not having been in the I­rish rebellion] you intend to exempt those Protestants, or any of them, who have had a hand in making the cessation, or the late peace, or who have done any thing by occasion, or in Pur­suance thereof.

Secondly, whether by these words, viz. we are enabled to give such Protestants as we condition withall, assurance; you [Page 10]intend that every particular Protestant shall come, and make his conditions with you; or whether all the Protestants of this Kingdome, are not to be included within the present trea­ty, and to partake of the agreement which shall be made.

Thirdly, whether by those words, Submitting to Ordinan­ces of Parliamen, it be intended that they shall submit to all, a [...]d every the Ordinances already made, and which hereafter shall be made by the Parliament of England.

Fourthly, we find nothing in the Com [...]ission, nor in any of the Instructions delivered by you to us for the continuance of the Judges and Ministers of the Civil List, and O [...]ficers of the Martiall List in their respective imployments, nor any answer given by you unto us in any of your pap [...]rs unto that particu­lar and herein we desire to be satisfied, as a matter wherein their being and livelihood doth depend.

TO the first and second parcicular of your Lordships first pa­per of the 16. November we answet, that we shall not ex­empt any Protestants of Ireland, though th [...]y have of late con­sented or submitted either to the cessation of Armes, or the peace concluded with the Irish rebels so as they submit to the Parliament wi [...]hin twenty dayes after our sending to them.

To the third particular, your Lordship hath an authentick copie of the Instruction, wherein those words [submitting to al [...] Ordinance of Parliament] are expressed, of which we have no explanation.

To the fourth particular, concerning the continuation or dis­placing of the Judges an▪ Ministers of the Civill List in their imployments we are not instructed therein; but for the Offi­cers of the Martiall List, we have power by our Instructions, and doe intend accordingly to imploy such of them as shall be found fit for the service.

Having thus endeavoured to give your Lordship all possible satisfaction, we do again desire your Lordships positive answer to our papers formeny given in, it being too manifest, how grest mischief may befall the Protestants of this Kingdom, and the service with which we are entrusted, should not our De­bates be brought to a speedy conclusion.

We are not satisfied with your answer to our first Paper, of the 16. of Novemb. to which we take these following excepti­ons for the present.

First, we desired by our said paper to know of you, whether you intended to exempt the Protestants, or any of them, who have had a hand in making the cessation, or late peace, &c. to which you make this answer,

That you wil not exempt any Protestants of Ireland though they have of late consented, or submitted, either to the cessati­on or the peace concluded with the Irish rebels, so as they sub­mit to the Parliament within twenty dayes after your sending unto them; within which words, no provision is made either for those who had a hand in the making thereof, or did upon the first making thereof submit thereunto. And besides, no pro­vision is made for any, but such as you shall send unto, so that it will rest in your power, to whom you will send, and when; wherein there is no certainty.

Secondly, we desired by our said paper, to know of you, whe­ther you intended that every particular Protestant shall come, and make his conditions with you; or whether all the Prote­stā [...]s of this kingdom are not to be included within the present Treaty, and to partake of the agreement to be made, to which no cleare answer is given.

And whereas you desire our positive answer to your papers formerly given, [...]it being, as you say, too manifest how great mischiefe may befall the Protestants of this kingdome, and the seruice with which you are intrusted, if your debates should should not be brought to a speedy conclusion. We desire you for the same reasons, to set down fully and clearly how far the propositions which we sent to the Parliament by our Com­missioners, are assented unto; and upon view and consideration thereof, we shall speedily give our positive answer.

IN answer to your Lordships second paper of the 16. of No­vember, and for clearing (so farre as possibly lyes in us) the Exceptions therein taken to our answer unto your Lordships first paper of the same date. We herewith deliver all the In­structions [Page 12]which we have received, that do (as we conceive) in any kind whatsoever, relate thereunto; and if yet [...]te shall re­main with your Lordship any doub [...] concerning those parti­culars, we shall represent the same (if the Tr [...]acy do succeed) to those that imployed us, with the best advantage for the Pro­testan [...]s of this Kingdome. Further satisfaction then this, we suppose cannot be expected from us.

As to the other part of your Lordships paper, wherein you would have us set down fully and clearly, [...]ow far the propo­sitions which you sent to the Parliament by your Commissio­ners, are assen [...]ed unto, we cannot answer your Lordships de­sire therein, neither those propositions, nor copies of them be­ing delivered unto us.

We therefore earnestly desire your Lordship to accept of the conditions offered in our former papers, and to give us a speedy resolution therein.

Instructions for Sir Thomas Wharton, Sir Robert King, Sir John Clotworthy, and Sir Rob. Meredith, Knights: and Richard Salwey Esquire, imployed to the Lord of Ormond, and others at Dublin▪

You may receive any Protestant who hath not been in the Irish rebellion, though he hath of late consented or submitted, either to the cessation of A mes, or the peace concluded with the Irish reb [...]ls, so as they submit to the Pa [...]liament within twenty dayes after your sending for them.

You, or any three of you, have power hereby to give protection to [...]uch as will come under contribution, and to give them the best safeguard you can, by the countenan [...]e of the Forces serving under the Parliament.

You, or any three of you, may give to such Protestants (not having been in the Irish [...]ebellion) as you condition withall, assu­rance of security to their persons, and to their estates and goods, that they have in Ireland, and that t [...]ey may live quietly and se­curely under the protection o [...] the Parliament, and their Forces, either within England, Ireland, or Wales; and you may likewise [Page 13]assure them, that they shall enjoy those their Estates and Goods, without any molestation, or question from the Parliament, as any others doe, who have not offended the Parliament, they submitting to all Ordinances of Parliament; ann if any of them have any Lands or Estates in England, they are to compound for the same at the rate of two yeares profit, as they were before the beginning of these troubles, they submitting to all Ordinances of Parliament.

IN your third paper of the 16. of November, are these words, viz. That for the Officers of the Martiall List, we have power by our Intructions, and [...]o intend accordingly to imploy such of them as shall be found fit for the service. A Copy of which Instruction, we desire, that we may the better judge how farre the security and future subsistence of the said Officers is there­by provided for.

In answer to your Lordships first paper of the 17. of this Moneth, wee herein deliver a Copy of the Instructions therein desired.

YOu, or any three of you, are to imploy such of the Officers now under the Lord of O [...]mond, as you shall thinke fit; and where you displace any, you are to place other Officers, if they be necessary; or otherwise to see their Commands sufficiently discharged, untill the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland take further order.

Copia vera

BY our second paper of the 16. of November, wee desired you for the bringing of the present debates to a speedy dy conclusion, to set down fully and clearly, how farre the pro­positions [Page 14]positions, which we sent to the Parliament by our Commissio­ners, are assenced unto; and we did by our said paper declare, that upon view and consideration thereof, we would speedily give our positive answer; to which by our first paper of the 17. of November you say, that you cannot answer our desire therein, neither those propositions nor copies of them being delivered unto you. We think fit to declare unto you, that our Commissioners delivered our Propositions and Instructions to the Committee of both Houses, and that they took Copies thereof, and that our Commissioners doe by their letters of the 16. of October 1646, certifie us by the command of the said Committee, that with the succours, there would also ar­riue here certain Commissioners to bee sent from the Parlia­ment to treat with us, upon the particulars contained in the Propositions and Instructions sent to the Parliament from us, Copies of which Propositions and Instructions we are rea­dy to send unto you, if that you shall desire the same. And we again desire you to declare fully and clearly how far you have power, and will assent to our said Propositions, or whether we shall give our positive answer to the papers already delivered by you, taking it for granted, that you have no further, or other Instructions, then what you have delivered us.

TO your Lordships second paper of the 17. of November, (wherein you again desire us to declare fully and clearly, how farre we have power, and will assent to the Propositions sent to the Parliament by your Commissioners) we can return no other answer then we have already done in our two first papers of the 16. and 17. of Novemb. in the later of which we declare, we have not those propositions nor copies of them, nor we think it expedient upon this occasion to receive the same from your Lordship, yet we desire the want of those Proposi­tions may not be conceived the only reason of our forbearance, of giving further answer to your Lordships paper; but hold it our duty to insist upon your Lordships positive answer to the papers already given in.

If you shall positively declate, that you have no power or instructions to enlarge your selves beyond what is expressed in your former papers, we will then give a positive answer to those papers.

We cannot more largely or positively expresse the power and extent of our instructions, we have then already done, but doe again in pursuance of our instructions, desire your Lordsh [...]p [...] answer to the papers given in.

We did not by our third paper o [...] the 17. of November, desire to know whether you could more largely or positively express th [...] power & intent of your instructions then you had formerly done: But we expressed, that if you would positively declare you had no power or instructions to en­large your selves beyond what is express [...]d in your former papers, wee would then give a positive answer to those papers, which by your answer thereunto you have neither affirmed nor denied; And therefore we forbear to give a positive answer to your said papers, till we be satisfied in that particular.

Having taken into consideration your Lordships last paper of the 17. of Novemb. we return you this answer, that wea hold not fit positively to de­clare, whether wee have any power or instruction to enlarge our selves be­yond what is expressed in our former paper, nor doewe conceive it ought to be expected from us, for that (to omit other reasons) wee have fre­quently declared, that we are (according to our instructions to receive your Lordships positive answer upon the papers already given in, which we now again desire from your Lordship.

In the Copy of some of the Instructions delivered by you unto us, it is thus expressed, That if the Lord of Ormond do within 4 dayes deliver up the sword, render up all the Garcisons, and other Commands to the plea­sure of the Parliament, then you, or any three of you, are to give these en­suing Conditions, &c.

[Page 16] And in your second paper of the 15. of Novemb, 1646. you expresse your selves amongst other things, as followeth, viz. Wee, who are appointed Commissioners by authority from the Parl. of England, are to receive from your Lordship (if the treaty succeed) the Sword, and Garrisons under your Command, for the use of the Parl. of England; To which, and your other pa­pers, before we can make answer, we desire to know whether you have his Majesties Direction and Command unto us, for our so doing.

To your Lordships first paper of the 18. of this moneth, we answer that we have not his Maj. direction and command unto your Lordship, for deli­vering up the Sword, rendring up all the Garrisons and Commands to the pleasure of the Parliament.

The papers delivered by you unto us, whereunto you desire our positive answer, gave occasion vnto us to take into consideration, aswell the Propo­sitions and Instructions signed by us alone, and sent by our Commissioners to be presented to the Parliament of England, as also the Propositions and Instructions signed by us, and the Councell of this Kingdome, and other Propositions and Instructions signed by the said Councell a-part, and sent by our said Commissioners to be in like sort presented: all which Proposi­tions and Instructions they delivered to the Committee of both honses, ap­pointed to consider thereof, who took Copies of the said Propositions and Instructions, Copies of which Propositions signed by us alone, we think fit to insert herein, viz.

• THat the said Lord Lieutenant will prosecute the Warre against the Irish Rebels, as vigorously as he shall be thereunto enabled by the Pari. of Eng­land, and that he will faithfully serve the Crown of England therein.
• 2 That whilst he hath the Government of this Kingdom, and the Command of the Armies therein, none of the Supplies of Men, Money, Arms, Munition, Victuals, or any other provisions of what kind or nature soever, which shall by the PARLIAMENT of ENGLAND be sent over, or joyned with the Forces already under his Command, nor any other Forces that shall be under his Command, shall in any wise be imployed either within this Kingdome, or out of it, but by the expresse direction of the said Parliament of England.
• 3 That he will not upon any Command, or by vertue of any power or autho­rity whatsoever, enter into any Treaty with the said Irish Rebels, or conclude [Page]any Peace or Cessation with them without the consent and expresse Command of the King and Parliament of England.
• 4. He will ingage himself to the true performance of all these things by Oath, or by any other meanes that can be proposed to a man of Honour and Consci­ence.

26 Septemb. 1646.

Ormond.

Now forasmuch, as we do not find by our papers, that any one of the said Propositions, which haue been transmi [...]ed from hence, is assented unto by the Parl. of England, though we have pressed you by severall papers, to know how farre they were assented unto; And for that it appeareth unto us by those papers, that no Copies of the said Propositions or Instructions were delivered unto you and that when we upon that signification did offer unto you copies of both, you did not think it expedient upon this occasion to re­ceive the same from us, And for that by the papers and copies of Instructi­ons delivered by you unto us, We find [...]o security offered to any of the Pro­testants, but to such as you shall condition withall, and who shall submit to all Ordinances of Parliament, whereas we expected that all should bee in­cluded and provided for, in and by the present Treaty, and what those con­ditions o [...] Ordinances of Parliament are, you doe not ascertaine by any of your papers: And for that it doth not appear unto us by any the Instru­ctions, whereof you have delivered copies unto us, that you have power to secure any other of his Majesties Subjects, who have constantly adhered to the Government here since the 22 of October, 1641. in their persons and e­states. And for that the Officers of his Majesties Army here, and the Judges and Ministers of the Civil List, have no assurance given them for their con­tinuance in their respective imployments, your expression as unto them being as follo weth, viz. Concerning the continuation and displacing of the Judges and Ministers of the civill List in their imployments, we are not instructed therein; but for the Officers of the Martiall List, we have power by our Instructions, and do intend accordingly to imploy such of them, as shall be found fit for the service, which giveth no assurance unto any one of the Martiall List, and leaveth the Civill List without any security, & taketh no notice of the poore distressed Clergy of the Kingdom. In all which par­ticulars (being contained in our Propositions and Instructions) we did hopr that the Parl. of England would have giuen us satisfaction, which being not yet done for any thing made known by you to us, and for that you have by your paper of the 18. of Novemb. 1646. declared unto us, that you have not his Maj. direction and command unto us, for delivering up the Sword, ren­dring up all the Garrisons and Commands to the pleasure of the Parlia­ment, which you by your second paper of the 15. of Novemb. 1646. desire to be rendred unto you, to the use of the Parliament; without any relation [Page]in your said paper to the King, we hold it not consistent with our Duty to his Majesty, to part with so great a Trust committed to our charge, in man­ner as by your papers is desired, without his Maj. expresse and positive Di­rections, and therefore may not assent thereunto.

Whereas we did, together with our first paper of the 16. of Novemb. de­liver in to your Lordship an authentique copy of the additionall instruction concerning the Protestants of Ireland, unto which your Lordship hath ta­ken severall exceptions; we think good for your satisfaction therein, now to declare, that we intend that all Protestants whatsoever of the Kingdome of Ireland (not having been in the Irish Rebellion) shall be included in this treaty, and receive the full benefit expres [...]n the said instruction: And that the conditions implyed in that instruction to be imposed on them, shall be understood, as followeth, viz. Whereas it is said, they shall enjoy those their Estates and Goods without any molestation or question from the Parl. as nay others do, who have not offended the Parl. they submitting to all Ordinances of Parl. By all Ordinances of Parl. we only intend such Or­dinances (whether already made, or to be made) as all others do submit un­to, who never offended the Parliament; And whereas liberty is given to compound for such estates, as any of them shall have in England they sub­mitting to all Ordinances of Parl. By all Ordinances of Parl. wee intend, only such as all persons now compounding in England do submit unto, pro­vided that all those that are thus admitted [...]o their composition do effectu­ally prosecute the same within 6 moneths after the publication of this Ar­ticles.

And whereas in the fourth Article of the first paper delivered in to your Lordship, offer is made of 5000. l. in money, and 2000. l. per annum, to bee paid your Lordship in manner, as is expressed in the said Article, we now hold it fit to declare, that if it shall be more to your Lordships satisfaction and content, we have power given us, and shall accordingly grant, what you desired in the 6. Article of your Lordships additionall instructions sent to the Par. according as is in the paper herewith delivered in, expressed.

And we lustly hold it fit to make known unto your Lordship, that power is also given to us, to agree for allowances to be paid to other persons, by constam pension during the Warre of Ireland, not exceeding the summe of 2000. l. per annum, which pensions are to continue, till they can receive the like benefit by their own estates.

We do now particularly declare to your Lordship (and sooner according to our instructions we could not) that wee have no power to enlage our elves, beyond what we have expressed. And do therefore now again, intreat our Lordships positive answer upon the whole, which we must the rather [Page 19]desire may be expedited, for that we are (according to our instructions) to bring our debates to a conclusion within 4 dayes at the furthest, after the beginning of the treaty, which will end to morrow at 9 of the clock in the morning, and we have no authority to prolong the same.

A Copy of the Paper mentioned in the former.

Sixthly, in regard that my whole fortune is now in the possession, or with­in the power of the Rebels, so as I can make no manner of use of i [...]; As also for that I have not only at my own charge, in some sort, maintained the honour and dignity of my place, since the 21. of Ian. 1643, which was the day whereon I was sworn his Maj. Lieutenant, but likewise contributed in a considerable portion to the maintenance of the Army & Garrisons now under my Command. And lastly, for that by meanes thereof, I am utterly unable to discharge the debts I have contracted for my own support, whilst I imployed my own to feed the Army, or to pay the wages due to the Ser­vant, which I was necessitated to entertain, in respect of the place I held; For these reasons, I desire it may be humbly offered to the noblenesse & ho­nour of the Parl. That to free me from the clamor of Creditors, to pay my servants their wages, and to transport and maintain my self and my family, in some sort befitting the condition of a Gentleman; The Parl. will be plea­sed to disburse the sum of 13000. l. 877. l. 14. s. 9. d. be paid to such as I shall appoint upon Bills of Exchange, accepted by sufficient men in France, or Holland, to wit, the one half upon sight, and at 6 moneths the oeher halfe thereof, which is lesse then the just sum I have disbursed for the mainte­nance of the Garrisons of Dublin, Dundalke, Newry, Narrow-water, Green-Castle, and Carlingford, not accompting my own expence, nor the many o­ther smaller disbursments spent meerly for the good of the said Garrisons; And that I may be secured against any molestation, by reason of the en­gagements, I have at any time entred info, for the publique service since the beginning of this Rebellion.

Vpon consideration had of your 3. paper of the 18. of Novem. as also of your former papers, and the copies of such instructions, as you delivered un­to us, we find no satisfaction given by you in these following particulars.

First, we do not find that you have power to secure any of his Maj. Ro­man Catholike Subjects in their persons and estates, who haue constantly ad­hered to the Government here, since the 22. of October, 1641 of whom wee conceive care out to be had in the present treaty.

Secondly, you have declared unto us, that you have no instruction concer­ning [Page 20]the continuation or displacing of the Judges, and Ministers of the Ci­vill List in their imployment and your instruction as unto the Martiall List (whereof you gave us a Copy) is as followeth, viz. You or any three of you are to imploy such of the Officers now under the L [...]of Ormond, as you shall think fit, and where you displace any, you are to place other Officers, if they be necessarie, or otherwise to see their Commands sufficiently di [...]charged, untill the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland taketh further order; which may give more occasion of fear unto the Officers of being displaced, then hope of continuance in their respective imployments, and there is not as much as mention made of the poore distressed Clergie of the Kingdome in any the papers or instructions delivered to you by us.

Thirdly, the Protesta [...]ts of the Kingdom, who are to be included in the present treatie, are, as you declare in the last paper delivered by you to us, to submit themselves to all Ordinances of Parl. whether already made, or to be made; Amongst which (as we are intormed) are some which require the Covenant to be generally taken, and others which lay Mu [...]cts upon those, who shall use the Book of Common-prayer, which forme of Service, and no other, is by a Law of force in this Kingdome, commanded upon a penaltie to be used; And in our instructions sent by our Commissioners, we desire that neither the one nor the other might be pressed untill settlement by Parliament.

And for us to agree upon this treatie to all future ordinances which shal be made by the Parliament, before it be known what those ordinances are, we conceive may be of dangerous consequence to the whole Kingdom, and not agreeable with the rules of prudence in us.

Fourthly, whereas by a speciall instruction signed by us apart, we did di­rect our said Commissioners, as followeth, viz. If you find the Parl. ready & willing forthwith effectually to take into their care and protection his Maj. Protestant Subjects within the quarters under my command, and those that have adhered to them from the 22. of October, 1641. according to the purport of the instructions signed by me and the Councell, and that my continuance in the Government, shal be the only let thereunto, you are then in such case to let them know, that I will surrender my place of Lieutenant and deliver all the Holds in my power to such as the Parliament shall ap­point upon these conditions.

First, that they procure his Maj. directions for the doing therof, &c. which was the first and fundamentall condition of all that was propounded by us upon this Overture, which was to be Precedent, and without which, no­thing as unto the delivery up of the Government was to be expected from us.

[Page 21] Upon consideration of all which, and of the Oath taken by us, upon our first entrance into this great trust reposed in us, the tenour whereof doth ensue in these words, viz.

You shall swear, that you shall faithfully and truly to your power serve our Soveraign Lord the Kings Majestie, in the roome and authority of Lord Lieutenant, and chiefe Governour of this his Realm of Ireland, you shall maintain and defend the Lawes of God and the Christian Faith, You shall to your power, not only keep his Maj. peace amongst his People, but also maintain his Officers and Ministers in the execution and administration of Justice, You shall defend his Maj. Castles, Garrisons, Dominions People, & Subjects of this Realm, and represse his Rebels and Enemies, You shall not consent to the damage, and disher [...]zon of his Maj. his Heires nor Successors neither shall you suffer the right of the Crown to be destroyed by any way, but shall let it to your power, and if you cannot let the same; You shal certifie his Maj. cleerly and expresly thereof, You shall give your true and faithfull for the Kings Majesties profit, and his Highnesse councel? You shal conceal and keep, All other things for the preservation of his Maj. Realm of Ireland, the peace amongst his People, and execu [...]ion of his Justice, accor­ding to his Maj: Lawes, Usages and Customes of this his Highnesse Realm, you shall performe, and do to your power: So God you helpe, and by the Contents of this Book.

And for that our Commissioners have by their Letters certified us, that they were commanded by the Committee of both houses to forbeare the delivering unto the Scottish Commissioners the duplicate of the Letters, which we and the Councel had written to his Maj. and delivered to our Commissioners, advertising his Maj. thereby of our addresse to the Parlia­ment, with direction to deliver them to the Scottish Commissioners, to be sent to the King▪ untill the pleasure of the two houses should bee made known; which restraint, doth as yet for any thing made known unto us, lye still upon them.

And for that if we should deliver up the Sword in manner as is desired, the present Parl. of this Kingdom (which is the hope of the remaining Prote­stants here) would be at an end; for all which reasons, we may not part with the trust committed to our charge, in manner as by your papers is desired, without his Majesties expresse and positive direction, and therefore may not assent thereunto.

If your Lordship continue unsatisfied concerning the papers already de­livered in, or any of them, as is implyed by the Exceptions taken thereun­to, [Page 23]and expressed in your last paper of the 18 of November, we are ready to offer such conside [...]a [...]ions to your Lordship by way of Answer thereunto, as we hope, may give your Lordship satisfaction therein; and this we desire, may be done by conference, if your Lordship shall thinke fit, for that the shortnesse of time will not give opportunity to commit it to writing.

Although the Conference desired by you in your paper of this days date was within half an hour of the expiration o [...] the time limitted for this trea­ty: A [...]d although you have positively declared in your 3. paper of the 18. of Novemb. 1646. That you have no power to [...]nlarge your selves, [...]r the tim [...] beyond what you have expressed, yet to manif [...]st to [...]he world, h [...]w desirous we are to receive satisfaction in those necessary exceptions by us taken to your papers given in upon this Treaty, which may being the same to a happy conclusion, we are ready to entertain the Conference desired by your said first paper of this dayes date.

Whereas we received a large paper from your Lordship of the 18. of Novemb. wherin you declared, you could not assent to deliver up th [...] sword, render all the Garrisons, and other Commands to the pleasure of the Pa [...]l, as was desired by us in papers formerly given in [...]o your Lordship, together with your particular Exceptions to the same.

And whereas, we did immediatly thereupon offer unto your Lorpship, such further [...]onditions of inlargement to the former, as we were instru­cted unto for your more ample satisfaction in complying wi [...]h the desires of the Parliament, in order to the preservation of the Protestants of the Kingdom of Ireland.

And whereas your Lordship signified to us, that it then being late, & the paper given in by us of great importance, you would return answer there­unto the next morning.

And whereas, wee did this morning deliver to your Lordship a paper, declaring, That if your Lordship continued unsatisfied concerning the Pa­pers by us given in, or any of them, as was expressed by the Exceptions ta­ken thereunto, we were ready to offer such consideraaions to your Lord­ship as we hoped might give satisfaction, which we desired might be done by conference, for that the shortnesse of time would not permit it in wri­ting.

[Page 23] And having received another paper from your Lordship of the 19. of Novemb. containing your refusall to deliver up the Sword. &c. up­on the Conditions offered in our first and later papers, your Lordship did signifie by your second paper of the 19. That you were ready to hear, what we coul [...] further offer by way of Conference, as was desi­red; which was by us performed accordingly.

We do therefore now desire to know, if your Lordship do still insist upon your refusall, on the grounds expressed in your papers. And if so, we make known to your Lordship, that we shall for our own exone­ration, commit to writing the summe of what we delivered in Con­ference and give your Lordship a copy thereof; to the end, the up­rightnesse of our proceedings in the transaction of this Treaty with your Lordship may in all things appear, although that happy successe, which we desired, be not attained thereby,

Forasmuch as, what was delivered upon the Conference, cannot be made use of by us, as binding unto you, unlesse it be reduced to wri­ting and signed by you, which when you shall have reduced the same to writing, and given us a Copy thereof, signed by you; We shall then declare unto you, whether or no, we will rest satisfied therewith, or shall upon the whole matter insist upon our refusall.

Whereas upon Thursday morning the 14 of Novemb. in our Con­ference with your Lordship, wee did endeavour to offer such conside­rations, as might give satisfaction to your Exceptions taken by our papers given in; And whereas, we did at the same time also desire to know, whether or no your Lordship had received satisfaction to all, or any of your said Exceptions, or whether you would still insist upon your refusall, whereupon your Lordship by your third Paper of he 19. of Novemb. returned answer, That what was delivered upon the Conference cannot be made use of by your Lordship, as binding unto us; unlesse it be reduced to writing, and signed by us, and that when we shall have reduced the same to writing, and given you a coyy ther­of signed by us, your Lordship will then declare unto us, whether or [Page 24]no, you will rest satisfied therewith, or shall upon the whole matter insist upon your refusall. Wee have therefore accordingly exprest in writing the summe of what was delivered in Conference, which wee offer to your Lordship, as followeth.

You [...] Lordships first Exception is.

Except. 1. That none of the Propositions (of the first way of Overture) which were transmitted by your Lordship to the Parliament are assented unto.

To which we answer.

Answ. 1. That an Ordinance of Parliament of the 15. of October, 1646. [...]ontaining the Declaration of both Houses to proceed upon the second way of Overture made by your Lordship, was by us delivered to your Lordship.

2 That Declaration was made by the Parliament, before such time as Sir Francis Willong [...]by returned from London, from whom your Lordship might be informed thereof.

3 Your Lordship presuming (before your Commissioners came from London) that the Parl. might not accept of those Propositions, did by Additionall Instructions, declare, you would not insist there­upon, and accordingly gave them liberty to recede from the same, and to propound a second way of Overture, which the Parliament did pro­ceed upon, and appointed a way of Treating with you; of which, your Commissioners did advertise your Lordship by Direction of the Com­mittee of Parliament, appointed to consider of the said Propositions. And

4 If your Lordship observe, how far that second way of Overture is accepted and granted by the Parliament in the Proposition by us given in; you may happily find, not onely full and positive satisfaction to the most of what your Lordship asked, but in some particulars also, more ample offers made, then was by your Lordship desired therein; which then the world shall consider, together with the grounds and principles held forth by your Lordship (inviting the Dispatch of Sup­plies [...]o this Place) we are confident, the Parliament will be abundant­ly justified therein: yet over and above all this, we continue to declare that in every particular we will go to the utmost limits of [...]ur Instru­ctions, and where any thing seemes doubtfull to your Lordship, or too short; we shall (if the Treatie succeed) represent it to those that em; ploy us, in the best manner we can for your Lordships full satisfaction.

[Page 25] And this wee desire may be applyed to every Exception taken by your Lordship.

Except. 2. That we have no power to secure any of his Majesties Ro­mane Catholike Subjects in their persons and estates, who have constantly adhered to the Government here since the 22. of October, 1641. Of whom, you conceive, care ought to be had in the present Treaty.

Answ. 1, Those that by Authority of Parliament gave power to us to treat, did not, for ought we can perceive, take cognizance of any of the Romane Catholikes of Ireland, that did adhere to the Government of this Kingdome against the Irish Rebels.

2 If any such be, it's probable the number is not considerable; and if they have done nothing against the Parliament, they need not any speciall security, but may expect as much as others, that have in like manner demeaned themselves, although they be of the Protestant Re­ligion.

3 Power is given (as by an Instruction delivered in the 16. of Nov. is exprest) to protect such as will come under Contribution, and to give them safeguard by the countenance of the Forces serving under the Parliament; According to which, they are to be protected in their persons and estates, aswell from the violence of the souldiers under the Parliament, as of the Enemy; And this to be extended unto all, with­out distinction of Offence, or Religion.

4 If any thing more can be reasonably offered, in the behalfe of such Papists as have adhered to the present Government, and not beene in the Irish Rebellion; it shall be also recommended back by us to those that imployed us, in the best manner we can for your Lordships satis­faction.

Except. 3. That no assurance is given, that the Judges and Ministers of the Civill and Martiall List shall be continuod in their places and em­ployments, &c.

Answ. 1. Nothing is given us in charge, nor hath any thing been expressed by us concerning the removall of the Judges, and Ministers of the Civill List, nor any of them.

2 In cases of like nature, it hath not been known, that persons so qualified, have been continued and established by Treaty, nor was it [Page 26](to [...]ur knowledge) ever heretofore insisted on by any whomsoever.

3. If it must be presumed that they have offended the Parliament, yet assurance is given (and otherwise they can need none) for security to their persones, with injoyment of there goods and estates in the Kingdom of Ireland, as if they had not offended, and have liberty to compound for their Estates, [...]s any of them have in England, and such Composition not to exceed two years value.

Concerning the Officers of the Martiall List.

We answer.

Answ. 1. We have expressed, That we will continue and imploy all such Officers, whomsoever as shall be found fit for the Service: And as we have not hitherro taken up a resolution (if the Treaty sh [...]o [...]ld succed) to displace any. so we doe declare. that it must be an extraordinary cause that should induce us to it, and we understand the words of our Instruction ( viz. You are to imploy such of the Officers, &c.) doth so direct us, and therefore connot give, as your Lordship expresseth. more occasion of feare unto the Officers of being displaced, then hope of continuance in their respective imployments.

2. As we beleeve, no president can be show; so it is obvious, the inconvenience would be very great, to article for, and establish by Treaty, any Officers of the Military List, though our resolution be to continue the same.

3. The same assurance and benefit, as is declared in our third answer to your Lordships objections concerning the Civill List, is also to be extended in like manner to the Officers of the Martiall List, according to our Instructions.

In which also, the Clergie of this Kingdome mentioned by your Lordship, may respectively receive advantage, concerning whom we are not instructed: Yet.

We desice it may be rememcred, that power is given us to agree for Pensions, to such as we shhll thinke fit, to the value of two [...]o [...] ­stand pounds per annum, which we are ready to assertain unto such of the Civill and Martiall List, as also of the distressed Clergy, as shal be thought meet to extend it to, in such way as may give best satis­faction, according to our Instruction.

Except. 4. That great inconveniency may happen to all the Protestants of Ireland, who are to be included in this Treaty, if they should therby conclude themselves to submit to all the Ordinances of Parliament.

[Page 27] Answ. 1. We have declared, &c. That their submitting to all Ordinances of Parliament, is to be understood no other­wise then as all others doe, who have alwayes adhered to, and never offended the Parliament.

2. We know of no Ordinance of Parliament, that requires the Covenant to be taken in the Kingdome of Ireland.

3. We are no wayes instructed to suppresse the Book of Common Prayer, or impose the Directory, though your Lordships represented in your own Instructions, that the Di­rectory might be used here.

4. It may also be considered, That your Lordship made O­verture of submitting to the Direction of both Houses of Par­liament, (and that exclusively to any one wha [...]soever) as to the ordering and disposing of the Army, &c. If they should accept of your Overture, which could not be understood o­therwise to be done, but by Ordinances of Parliament, as to them from time to time should seeme meet.

Exception. 5. Lastly, That the Kings direction for the Delivery up of the Government is not obteined, and that your Com­missioners were commanded to forbeare the delivering unto the S [...]ch Commissioner, the duplicate of the Letters which your Lordship and the Councell had written to His Ma­jesty concerning the same.

Answ. 1. Wee are very confident, what the Committee of both houses did therein, was by direction of the Parlia­ment.

2. Your Commissioners did declare, that if supplyes were not instantly dispatched, you would take it for granted none would bee sent, and therefore must be necessitated to think of some other course for your Preservation, as by the Lawes of God and Nature became you, and therefore it could not be imagined (the necessity being so great, under which your Lordship then was, according to the representation thereof made to the Parliament) that you would refuse such Supplies from the Parliament, in manner as they directed till your Letter should be from thence sent to Newcastle, and an an­swer thereof returned to your Lordship, which would not un­doubtedly [Page 28]have taken up much more time, then the extremity of your Condition here, according to the foresaid representa­tion, could possibly admit of; And information was given that an addresse to the King was also made by your Lordship ano­t [...]er way, and we have not yet understo [...]d by your Lordship that he hath inhibited you to proceed and conclude with us.

But more especially we desire it may be considered by your Lordship that in your letter to the King (mentioned in your exceptions) your Lordships expressions are full, to proceed with the Parliament up [...]n the overture made to them in the Propositions, not onely without desiring answer, but without expecting consent or direction from his Majesty before such time as you would conclude the same, and your Lordship doth onely give an accompt of your Resolutions, his Majesty un­consulted with, as already fix't with exp [...]ctation onely of a benigne construction from his Majesty thereupon; And that not onely from the consideration of necessity, but (as we con­ceive of your Lordships du [...]y also, as the case the [...] stood, (no lesse then a Kingdome lying at the Stake) to make your ap­plication in such manner to the Parliament.

3. May it not also be consid [...]red, what reason the Parlia­ment had to conceive your Lordship intended, not so to insist on the Kings direction as with u [...] it you would not conclude, when they observed that by those Propositions from your Lordship, a Copy whereof you have delivered us, you offered (if they should accept thereof (to put your present Army and Forces, called by your Lordship his Majesties Army, (Not­withstanding any interest you apprehended the King had therein) under the sole direction of both Houses of Parliament. And yet in those Propositions we finde no mention made of consent or direction to be first had from the King, which was believed your Lordship then, as at this time also, might the better do, for that by act of Parliament, the mannaging of the Wa [...] of Ireland is established in both Houses of Parliament a­lone.

4. It may be considered, that however many eases of this [Page 29]nature in the late troubles in England have happened, where Persons under great obligations to the King, have frequently surrend [...]ed to the Parliament, Garisons and Forces, which they received by command from his Majesty, as in particular that of Oxford (where remained not onely the Duke of Yorke and his Majesties Councell, but also the Sword, the great and lesser Seales with other Ensignes of the Regall Power, (and al [...] these) without first having any explicite direction from the King to deliver up the same.

5. When we also consider how passionately it was represen­ted to the Parliament by your Lordship, of how great impor­tance the City and Castle of Dublin (together with the Gari­sons under your Command) were in order to the recovery of the Kingdome of Ireland, the preservation of the Protestant Religion, together with all the Protestants therein, as also how undoubtedly all must miscarry, if Supplies did not timely come; We cannot but wonder that in case of so high concernment, and so great necessity (the spilling of the blood of so many thousand Protestants being unavoidable) according to the grounds and representations offered by your Lordship to the Parliament, the danger whereof remaines the same, for ought hath occurred to us, granted also by the losse of many Garisons since, and will be perfected by your rejecting the Supplies (with so much expedi­tion and Charge sent hither by the Parliament) that yet the Kings consent should be so insisted on, as that neither the pre­servation of the said Protestant Religion, nor the blood of thousands of Protestants, nor any of the fore-mentioned Conside­rations should pu [...]chase a Dispensation therein.

6. And whereas your Lordships Oath is objected: It appeares to us to be penn'd with speciall caution and relation to such a time of necessity as this; and is rather (as we conceive) sull­filled by consent to, then refusall of the conditions offered to your Lordship, unto which also, we believe that respect was had, when those Resolutions were taken up expressed in the fore-mentioned Letter to the King.

Wee hold it our Duty to deale thus cleerly and freely with your Lordship; that (if it were possible) we might give satis­faction [Page 30]thereby, However our consciences doe acquit us, that we have done our utmost therein, and do [...] conceive that those that imployed us, will be abundantly acquitted in the sight of God and Man, as having done what could be expected from them, and unto whom (for any neglect in this affaire) the guilt of Blood we are confident shall not be imputed in that day wherein in­quisition shall be made for the same.

VVE [...] have considered the paper wherein you expressed the summe of what was delivered by you in the Con­ference with us; to which we make return.

Our first exception was, Not that none of the Propositions of the first way of Overture, which were transmitted by us to the Parliament, are assented unto, as in that paper is expressed, but that none of the Propositions which were transmited, whe­ther you look to the first way of Overture (as you are pleased to tearm it) or the second way of Overure, are assented vnto. And to the end that this may be the better understood, we hold it ne­cessary to declare, that some of the Propositions which were transmitted by us from hence, were signed by us a part, wherein we did undertake the prosecution of the Warre, as vigorously a­gainst the Rebels, as wee should bee thereunto enabled by the Parliament; which Propositions are expressed at large in our se­cond paper of November 18. 1646. and these seem onely to have relation to Our selfe.

There were other Propositions signed by Us and the Coun­cell, wherein not onely Our selfe, but all others of this King­dome, as well of the Souldiery, as others of his Majesties Prote­ [...] subjects of this Kingdome, and their ad [...]e [...]ents are respe­ [...] concerned, the said Propositions importing no [...]e [...]e then the preservation of them in their persons, estates, and imploy­ments.

[Page 27] And there were Instructions signed by us, and delivered to our Commissioners, authorizing them, that if they did finde the Parl. willing and ready to take into their care and pro­tection his Maj. subjects, within the quarters now under our Command, and those that have adhered to them since the 22 of October 1641. according to the purport of the Instructi­ons signed by us and the Councel, and that our continuance in the Government should be the only let thereunto, that then our said Commissioners should let them know, that we would surrender our place of Lieutenant, and deliver up all the Holds in our power, to such as the Parl. should appoint upon certain conditions, whereof the first and principall is, that they should procure his Maj. directions for our so doing which offer made by us, is in the Ordinance of parl delivered by you to us, and by you in your paper of the 19. of Novem. 1646. called our second way of Overture wherupon you say the parl. did proceed, which you say, Sir Francis Willoughby upon his return from London might have informed us: That sir F. Willoughby might have told us we know not; wee are sure he did never tell us of the resolution said by you to bee taken by the Parl. for proceeding in that, you call, the second way of Overture, nor did hee bring with him (for ought known to vs) any copy of the Order of the 15 of Obtob. de­claring, that Resolution, nor was it mentioned by our Com­missioners in any of their Letters, though we received seve­rall, as wel by the said Sir Fran. Willoughby, as by others of dates subsequent to the said Order.

But on the contrary, Sir Gerrard Lowther, and Sir Paul Davies, did by their Letter of the 6. of Novemb. after sir Fr. Willoughbies departure from London, certifie us, that Sir Ro­bert King and the rest were sent hither to treat with us (as they heard) for surrendring Duhlin, and other places under Comand to which they were not called, but were altogether strangers to their transactions there concerning that Treaty, and that they did not know any thing of their commission, authority, or instructions, or how far they extended.

But though the Parl. did lay hold of this called our second [Page 28]way of Overture, yet the propositions which were signed by us and the Councel, wherein all his Mai. Protestant Sub­jects of this Kingdom as well of the Souldiery as others, & such as have adhered unto them, were a like concerned with us, were not to be passed over, for whether we did continue in the Government, according to the first way of Overture, or part with it (termed by you the second way of Overture, it was our main care and desire, that they should be secured in their persons, estates, and employments, which is not yet done to our satisfaction.

And in that which concerneth our selfe, the principal thing which in his Maj. direction and allowance for the rendring up of the Government, which was to precede and warrant all that we did propound to be done by us herein, is yet wan­ting, which we desire you to represent to those who imploy­ed you in the best manner you may.

Exception 2.

Our second Exception is, that you have no power to se­cure any of his Maj. Romane Catholique Subjects in their persons and estates, who have constantly adhered to the Go­vernment here, since the 22. of Octob. 1541. of whom wee conceive care ought to be had in this present Treaty. To this you give these Answers.

First that those who by authority of Parl. gave power to you to treat, did not take cognizance of any of the Romane Catholiques in Ireland, that did adhere to the Government of this Kingdom against the Irish Rebels; which answer doth not satisfie us, but doth enforce the Exception, for their not taking cognizance of them, is the ground and cause of the Exception.

Your second answer is, That (if any such be) it is probable the number is not considerable; And if they have done no­thing against the Pari [...] they need not any speciall security, but may expect as much as others, that have in like manner demeaned themselves, although they be of the Protestant [Page 29]Religion; which answer doth not satisfie, but giveth us more cause to insist upon the exception, because you say, it is pro­bable that the number of them is not considerable, whereas we who have been upon the place know it to be otherwise both in number & quality of persons.

And since his Maj. Protestant Subjects, who have served against the Rebels here, and done nothing against the Parl. are offered to be secured in their persons and estates, they may by the same rule of Justice expect the like assurance, & the greater regard ought to be of them, for that their Reli­gion being made the pretence of the Rebellion, they do not­withstanding adhere to his Maj. protestant Subiects against the Rebels, who are of that Religion.

Your third answer, viz. Power is given (as by an instru­ction delivered in the 16▪ of Novemb. is exprest) to protect such as will come under contribution, & to give them safe­guard by the countenance of the Forces serving under the Parl. according to which they are to be protected in their persons and estates, as well from the violence of the soldiers under the Parliament, as of the Enemy, and this to be exten­ded unto all, without distinction of Offence or Religion; which Answer doth not satisfie us, for the said instruction looketh rather to the Rebels who are to be brought under contribution, then to those who have continued good Sub­iects, and there [...]n there is no assurance given unto them for their ēstate, as is in the same instruction to his Majesties Protestant Subjects for their Estates.

Your fourth answer is, If any thing can be reasonably offered in the behalfe of such Papists, as have adhered to the present Government, and not been in the Irish Rebellion, it shall be also recommended back by you, to those, who im­ployed you, in the best manner you can to out satisfaction; The latter part of which answer, being the best part there­of we desire may be pursued, for the first part thereof doth inforce the Exception, it being made a doubt whether any thing can be reasonably offered for such Papists as have ad­hered to the present Government, and not been in the Irish [Page 30]Rebellion, whereas nothing in reason can be offered against such, but that they should be secured in their persons and e­states.

Our third Exception is, That no assurance is given, that the Judges and Ministers of the Civill and Martiall List, shall be continued in their places and imployments, which is answered by you, as followeth:

First, nothing is given us in charge, nor hath any thing been expressed by us concerning the removall of the Judges and Ministers of the Civill List, nor of any of them, which answer doth not satisfie us: for we desire by our Proposi­tion, to have an assurance for the continuing them in their respective imployments, which is not yet assented unto.

Your second answer is, That in cases of like nature, it hath not been known, that persons so qualified have been conti­nued and estiblished by Treaty, nor was it to your know­ledge, ever heretofore insisted upon by any whomsoever; which answer doth not satisfie us, for though you might shew, that the contrary hath been done in like cases (as we beleeve you cannot) yet, even for that cause, we have the more reason to insist upon it.

Your third answer is, If it must be presumed, that they have offended the Parliament, yet assurance is given (and otherwise they can need none) for security to their persons, with enjoyment of their goods and estates in the Kingdome of Ireland, as if they had not offended, and have liberty to compound for the estates any of them have in England, and such Composition not to exceed two yeares value: We are not satisfied with this your answer, for there is nothing here to assure them the continuance in their imployments, and our Proposition made in their behalfe for their conti­nuance in their imployments, cannot presume cannot pre­sume a guilt; and it is no reason to say, that if they be not guilty, they need desire this assurance, for the Judges doe well understand, that abundans cautela non nocet, and if it must be presumed that they have offended the Parliament, [Page 31]there is the more reason to insist on the Proposition for the continuing of them in their respective imployments, they having been dispoyled of all their estates.

To your expression whereby you would satisfie us con­cerning the continuing in imployment the Officers now un­der our Command, viz. That as you have not yet taken up a resolution (if the Treaty should succeed) to displace a­ny: so you declare, it must be an extraordinary cause that must induce you to it, wee easily beleeve, that as it is too early for you to declare a resolution to turne them out of their imployments, (though such a resolution were taken up by you) till you possest of the power to do it; so you may judge such a declaration, not to be the readiest way, to at­taine to that power by Treaty from us, which We are con­fident, is the only way whereby you will at this time at­tempt it, but when by that meanes you should be invested in that Power, the questiou is, whether you would not then understand that the Concurrence of some of the Marriāll List with us in the conclusion of the Cessations and peace here, the actuall Service of some others in His Majesties Armies in England, and the obedience given by all to some Commands, that may have been displeasing to the two Houses of Parliament in England, to be extraordinary and sufficient causes for their removeall, wherein, if you shall declare negatively, wee shall rest satisfied as to that particular, not could our Demand of having them secured in their respective imployments, be understood to reach to a forgivenesse of such Crimes in future as may merit dis­placing; for which we confesse, we can no more alleadge a president, then we beleeve you can, that ever the sword was demanded to be delivered by the Chiefe Governour of this Kingdome, to Commissioners of the Parliament of England, without the Command of the King.

[Page 33] Exception 4.

Our fourth exception being as followeth, viz. That great inconvenience may happen to all the Protestants of Ireland, who are to be included in this treaty, if they should thereby conclude themselves to submit to all Ordinances of Parliawent, is answered by you as followeth;

Answer 1.

Your first Answer is, we have declared▪ that their submitting to all Ordinances of Parliament is to bee understood, no otherwise then as all others doe, who have alwayes adhered to, and never offended the Par­liament; with which answer we are not satisfied, it be­ing no more, then that we are to submit to all the Or­dinances of Parliament; to which, those who are of the Parliament party submit, as the Covenant, the Di­rectory, the abolishing of the Booke of Common-prayer, &c.

A [...]swer 2.

Your second answer is, we know of no Ordinance of Parliament that requireth the Covenant to be taken in the Kingdome of Ireland, with which answer wee are not satified, for we know that it hath been prest in all parts of the Kingdome, where the Parliament hath prevailed, as in the Provinces of Munster, Vlster, and Connaught, there being some Ministers not long since employed into Vlster, who went from Town to Town, and from City to City, pressing the Covenant, [Page 35]whereupon many Protestants did acquit their Com­mands and habitations in those parts, rather then they would subiect themselves to it, and if the same was done without an Ordinance of Parliament, we have the more reason to insist, that his Maiesties Subiects may be secured against so violent and unwaranted pressures upon their Consciences.

And if you know no Ordinances of Parliament which requireth the Covenant to be taken in the Kingdome of Ireland, you may the better undertake that it shall not be pressed; and if you bee not instructed to sup­presse the Book of Common prayer, or impose tho Directory, you may the better condescend to what is desired concerning both, so far as is expressed in our instructions.

Answer 4.

Your fourth answer is, It may also be considered, that your Lordship made Overture of submitting to the Direction of both houses of Parliament (and that ex­clusively to any other whatsoever) as to to the orde­ring and disposing of the Army, &c. if they should ac­cept of your Overture, which could not be understood otherwise to be done, but by Ordinances of Parl, as to them from time to time should seeme meet.

VVe are not satisfied with this your Answer, the strength of your reason being thus;

That we did submit to the direction of both Hou­ses of Parliament for the ordering of the Army, &c. therefore no inconvenience can happen to the Prote­stants in Ireland, who are to be included in this Trea­ty, if they should thereby conclude themselves to sub­mit [Page 34]to all Ordinances of the Parliament of England, which sure is no good Consequence, from one parti­cular to conclude a generall; And if you would de­clare that by submitting to all Ordinances of Parlia­ment, were onely intended such Ordinances as con­cerne the ordering and disposing of the Army, though that offer of Ours was in case that way of accommo­dation, which is waved by the Parliament, were laid hold of (of any thing wherein we therefore conceive no use should be made in this Treaty, since that way laid aside) yet such a declaration would, as that point give satisfaction

The fifth exception is, That the Kings Direction for the delivery up of the Government is not obtained and that our Commissioners were commanded to for­beare the delivering unto the Scottish Commissioners, the Duplicate of the Letters, which Wee and the Councell had written to his Majesty concerning the same; To which you make these Answers, viz.

That our Commissioners did declare, That if Sup­plies were not instantly dispatched, that We would take it for granted, that none would be sent, which was the ground of hastning the said Supplies, whereas the words of our Instructions wero, That if within a reasonable time after landing of our Commissioners; they did not advertise us, that those things we desired were on the way hither, or at least a considerable proportion of Money and Muniti­on, and probable hope of the rest speedily after, that then wee would take it for granted, not that no Sup­plies would come. but that our Propositions were reje­cted there, which strongly implyed, and so was intended, that if we understood Supplies were on the way, we might [Page 39]then take it for granted, our propositions were accepted, which also we had cause to believe, for that our Commissioners by command of the Committee, before whom they were heard, signifyed to us, their message was cheerfully accepted, whereof the sending of Sup­plies was but a part; nor can it be reasonably objected to us, that we refuse those Supplies, since none of the Conditions wherein we ex­pressed our willingnes to receive them, is offered to us in manner as was desired, especially that fundamentall one, of procuring the Kings Command for delivering up the Sword, and Garrisons, which be­ing the way fixed on by the Parliament, we much wonder, was not endeavoured (as well it might have been, and an answer had) be­fore you came from London, and if it had been obtained, there had been no need of sending it to us till your arrivall, and if it had been refused, the Parliament in their great wisdome and knowledge of the duty of one so highly trusted, would have found some other ex­pedient to extend their assistance and protection to the Protestants, other then such as must blemish our honour and fidelity to all Poste­rity, nor is it a sufficient discharge to us, that his Majesty hath not inhibited us to proceed and conclude with you, his expresse com­mand, being in this case absolutely necessary. And as for the supposi­tions and inferences, which you make out of the Letters writ by us to his Majey, and both houses of Parliament; as that it could not be imagined, the necessities being so great, under which we then were; that we would refuse such supplies from the Parliament in manner as they directed, till our letter should be from hence sent to New castle, and answer thereof returned to us: And that the Parlia­ment had no reason to conceive, that we intended so to insist on the Kings direction, as without it we would not conclude, &c. As also considering how passionately we represented to the Parliament, the importance of the City and Castle of Dublin, &c. and how undoubt­edly all must miscarry, if Supplies did not speedily come, that yet the Kings consent should be so insisted upon, as none of the fore­mentioned considerations should purchase a dispensation therein: And to induce us thereunto, you propose unto us examples of the delivering up of other Garrisons and Forces in England, as in par­ticular, that of Oxford, &c. without having any explicite dire­ction from the King to deliver up the same. We conceive the case of Oxford to be different from this; For Sir Thomas Fairfax, to whom the City of Oxford was rendred, (after some time of formall Singe, and the shedding of blood on both fides) was not invited [Page 40]thither by those within to defend and relieve it against the expected attempts of another enemy; as those Forces now here with you were (upon certain Conditions) by us, but his comming before Ox­ford was unsent for, openly and declaredly to take by force of Armes that City: In the case of Oxford also, we have seen his Majesties Command, directed to the Governour for the rendring thereof, which if you can produce to us for the giving up of these Garrisons, with the E [...]sig [...]es of Royalty belonging to the Crown of this King­dome, we will in like sort readily obey the same, notwithstanding some other disparity in the cases. And if the instructions we gave our Commissioners be looked into, Copies whereof were delive­red by them to the Committee of both houses, all these suspitions, in­ferences, and Arguments will vanish, it being a certain and true rule, that no inference nor application is to be made contrary to that which is exprest, as our instructions were in this particular; for our first and principall instruction was, That we would surrender our place of Lievtenant. &c. to such as the Parliament should appoint, upon these following conditions.

First, that they procure his Majesties direction for the doing there­of, &c. But further to cleere it, in our seventh and last instruction delivered unto our Commissioners, whereof the said Committee had likewise a Coppy, it is further given in charge unto them in this manner: viz. If in the mean time whilest they take these Propositi­ons and the rest into their considerations, and till they have procu­red his M [...]j [...]sties direction as aforesaid, the Parliament be pleased to send over such Supplyes, as may relieve the Garrisons from ruine, through want, or by the hostile attempts of the Rebels, the same shall be well husbanded for them, and imployed only to those ends, both which instructions leave no place for inference or implication to be made contrary to expresse instructions. If the Parliament hath procured his Majesties direction, the condition is performed, but if that be not done, the Forces notwithstanding may be received and imployed in the present service, and [...]o all those inconveniencies may be prevented, which are feared: But if nothing that we can do can give satisfaction, but to deliver up the Sword, render all the Garrisons, and other Commands to the pleasure of the Parliament, which we are bound by Oath to preserve and keep for His Majesty, before we do receive His direction therein, We doubt not but we shall be acquit herein, before God and men, if we insist upon the refusall of that which we cannot do without the violation of our Oath to God and the King.

[Page 41] To sum me up in briefe those particulars wherein we are not sa­tisfyed by any of your Papers, nor by any thing which was delivered in the Conference.

First, you have shewed us no direction from his Majesty to deli­ver the Sword, &c. which you say you have not procured.

Secondly, you have not offered assurance to the Papists of this Kingdome, who have adhered to his Majesties government since the 22. of October 1641. for their estates, which is confessed by you.

Thirdly, you have not undertaken, that the Covenant shall not be pressed, nor that the Book of Common-prayer shall not be suppressed.

Fourthly, you have given no assurance either for the continuance of the Judger and Officers of the Civill List, or the Officers of the Martiall in their respective imployments, or the Cleargy in their respective Rights, and incumbencies.

Fiftly, you have given us no satisfaction in that great and main Objection touching the present Parliament, which would be dis­solved, if that we should deliver the Sword in manner as is desired, The Papers do cleere none of these particulars, and nothing was delivered positively in the Conference which doth any wayes en­large the former Papers. We know that in matters of so high and great concernment, you will go to the utmost Limits of your instructions, and that in these things which seem doubtfull to us, you will (if any expedient can be found for the continuing the Treaty) represent them to those who employed you, in the best manner you can, for Our satisfaction; according to the promise made by you in your last Paper, for which we doe returne you thankes in the behalfe of all His Majesties Protestant Sub­jects, and those who have faithfully adhered to them. And for that full satisfaction cannot be given to us without your fur­ther Application to the Parliament, for enlarging your powers. We being resolved to leave no meanes unattempted, that may con­duce to the preservation of his Majesties Protestant Subjects in this Kingdome, and the Rights of the Crowne of England, and to the end the Forces brought hither by you, may be employed to those good ends, whilest His Majesties pleasure by us, and that of the Parliament by you is sought, do offer these following Pro­positions.

• First, that the Officers and Souldiers, sent hither by the Parlia­ment [Page 42]of England be put into one, or more convenient Garrisons, and be commanded by their Respective Officers, who are to re­ceive Orders from Us and the Governours of the places where they shall be Garison'd, and to be subject to the Lawes Martiall now in force in this Kingdome.
• Secondly, We desire, towards the keeping of the Army now under our Command for six weekes three thousand pounds, wher­of two parts in money, and a third part in victualls.
• Thirdly, That there be an ingagement from you to us on the be­halfe of the Parliament, that the Officers and Souldiers which are to be Garrisoned, as in the first Proposition is mentioned, shall do no Act prejudiciall to the present Government here; And that in case we shall not at or before the expiration of the said six weeks agree, that they shall remove from those places out of our quarters, at such time as we shall direct.
• Fourthly, We shall engage Our selfe unto you, that the said Of­ficers and Souldiers, shall quietly and peaceably be permitted by Us to remove with their Armes, Provisions and other things belong­ing unto them to Shipboard, or to such other places out of Our quarters, as you Sir Robert Meredith, Sir Thomas Wharton. Sir Robert King, and Sir John Clotworthy, Knights, and Richard Salwey Esquire, or any three of you shall direct: And to these Our Propositions We desire your speedy Answer.

HAving received your Lordships papers of the 21. of November, and in them your returne to what was first delivered in-confe­rence, and afterwards for your Lordships satisfaction put in writing, and signed by us.

And whereas in those papers, your Lordship desires a coppy of the Instruction, whereby power is given us to agree for Pensions to the value of two thousand pounds per annum We have the light fit (that nothing may be wanting on our parts) herewith to deliver you a Coppy of the said Instruction.

And however upon perusall of your Lordships paper of the 21. of November, we find little cause to beleeve, satisfaction will be re­ceived by your Lordship, as hath been andeavoured to be given by Us. Yet foras [...]eh at your third paper of the 19. of November d [...]d express, that when you should receive in writing signed by us, what war delivered in Conference to your Lordship, you would then de­clare [Page 43]unto us, whether or no you would rest satlsfied therewith, or upon the whole matter insist upon your refusall, we desire your Lord­ship speedily to give us your positive answer accordingly.

And withall, we hold it fit to declare, that as we conceive the grounds of satisfaction offered by us, doe remaine unanswered by you Lordship, and particularly touching the Kings consent and di­rection (which you call maine and fundamentall) we having made it appeare that your Lordships Overture to the Parliament, was, to put all your Forces and Garrisons under their sole Command (the King unconsulted with at all therein) so we no wayes thinke fit (though our Instructions should therein anthorize us) to accept of the Propositions mentioned in the latter end of your papers, as an ex­pedient to continue any longer.

It yet your Lordship continue to refuse what we have offered, we can onely give account thereof to those that imployed us, and must leave it to the world to judge, whether those Exceptions, taken and insisted on by your Lordship, be consonant to those grounds and principles held forth in your Overture made to the Parliament, by which they were induced to send Succours hither, or whether all the particulars (so farre insisted on by your Lordship, that it app [...]ar [...]s not to us, you will recede from any one thereof) be of equall con­cernment to that hazard, yea (according to your Lordships owne representation) that Certainty of losse, not of a Kingdome only, but of Thousands of Protestants, and together with them, the Protestant Relig [...]on also.

All which, by the great care and pious endeavours of the Parlia­ment of England, might have been (through the blessing of God) pre­vented, if what we have oftered (and doe yet offer) in their names he not by your Lordship refused.

A Copie of the Instruction mentioned in the former Paper.

YOu, or any Three of you, have also hereby power given you to a­gree for such allowances to be paid to others by constans Pension, during the Warre of Ireland. (for the better and more fir me car­rying on of this Worke) as shall not exceed in the whole, the su [...]me of Two Thousand Pounds per-annum, to all other persons, beside the [Page 44]Two Thousand pounds per annum, to the Lord of Ormonde: And those pensions to continue till they can receive the like benefit by their owne Estates.

Signed as the rest of the Instructions.

Vera Copia

WHereas by your paper of the 22. of Nov. 1646. You affirme that you made it appeare that our Overture to the Parlia­ment was to put our Forces & Garrisons under their sole Command the King not consulted withal therin, we doe positively affirme, that you neither have nor can make it appear, that we made Overture to the Parliament, to put all our Forces and Garrisons under their sole Command, the King unconsulted; for whatsoever hath been offer­ed by us unto the Parliament by our Prop sitions and Instructions, We are constant thereunto, and still ready to performe.

HAving received your Lordships paper of the 22. of November (which we conceive needs no reply) we desire to know whe­ther your Lordships will returne any further answer to our first pa­per of this dayes date.

VVEE may not returne other Answer, then Wee have done in Our former papers, untill Wee have Consulted His Majesty, and received His Direction therein.

VVE having heard nothing from you since We sent Our last paper, We desire to know whether We shall understand this Treaty to be at an end for the present, that if neither Our Pro­positions. sent by Us to the Parliament of England, nor the Proposi­tions Wee sent unto you for the stay of your men, be assented unto, in manner as is Propounded, We may consider what further course [Page 45]to take for the preservation of His Majesties Subjects and the Rights of the Crowne.

IN Answer to your Lordships paper of the 23. of November Wee returne; That Wee continue assured there is no other way ac­cording to the representation made by your Lordship to the Parlia­ment, of preserving the Protestants of the Kingdome of Ireland, nor of the Rights thereof relating to the Kingdome of England, but by accepting the the Overtures made by us to your Lordship ac­cording to Our Papers delivered in; Your Lordship insisting upon a positive refusall thereof, we understand the Treaty to be at an end; And as for the offers lately made by your Lordship to us, we refer our selves to our Answer already given thereunto, and can in no wise accept of the same.