The First Discourse: Between two Gentlemen, the one of Pro­vence, the other of Paris, &c.

YOU will not deny, Sir, but 'tis my fate to surprize you. I cannot imagine this second Enterview less surprizing than the former. A years absence had given you hope, you were rid of a troublesome Companion; But he is come again.

Persons of your Merit and charming Conversation are not to be call'd [Page 2]troublesom: Surprizes of this kind are al­ways agreeable. But where have you been since our last sight of you?

Soon after our second Discourse, I had advice by Letter of urgent affairs hasten'd me into Provence, where I spent near a twelve-month: But my business in Provence could not make me so forget the Charms of Paris, but I am come again to take a second taste of the pleasures of it, though perhaps to your trouble: I have found again my Hugonot Gentleman, who hath staid all this while at Paris, and pro­bably takes more delight in it than I.

I perceive, he hath not fail'd to en­tertain you afresh with the state of his Re­ligion, the Subject he was so full of the last year. And generally, the Gentlemen of his perswasion, when at liberty, can hard­ly speak of any thing else, every day af­fording them new matter of Discourse.

I confess, my Hugonot never meets me, but he speaks to me of it; and with such Triumph and Joy, as if he had stopt your mouth and mine; and that we had nothing to answer the Reasons he brought to prove, That the Conduct now used against the Hugonots, is not only contrary to the Rules of Morality, and that Inte­grity we ought to practise in observing our [Page 3]promises, but destructive of the true inte­rest of State. And, Sir, to your misfor­tune, I remember very well, you conclud­ed our last Discourse with these words; These Gentlemen, said you, have taken time to think of their Objestions; 'tis fit, we should take time to think of our Answers; 'tis enough for this day, that we have given them a hearing. This, Sir, is a formal engage­ment you cannot recede from. You must furnish me with Weapons to defend my self, or rather resolve to engage them with­out a second: For I find my self not able to bear any longer a part in the Action: I have a treacherous memory, and forget half what is said to me. Every one pleads his Cause in Person with more Vigor and Success, than by Proxy: You will be pleas'd to hear them speak, and I beg it of you.

You have by your Merit gain'd so absolute an Empire over me, you may com­mand any thing in my Power: I am easily perswaded to enter into Discourse with Persons for whom I have entertain'd an E­steem, upon the Character you have given of them.

Since you have been pleas'd to re­ceive my proposal in so obliging a Manner, I will confess the whole truth, and let you see I had that Confidence in your kindness; [Page 4]I have taken the Liberty to appoint my Gentleman and his Lawyer their Rendes­vouz at your house; they will be here in half an hour. I knew this to be your day of repose, and came before to see if you would receive us, and if I found you not at leisure to hear and to speak to us, I could have perswaded my Gentlemen to take a turn in the Thuilleryes.

They shall be very welcome, and so shall any that comes with you; assoon as they are come, a Lacquay shall have order to stand at the door, and tell all that ask for me, I am not within. But, Sir, since you will engage me to day in a formal Com­bat, I will deal freely with you. I am not of opinion we should engage our selves to answer particularly all they have said to you; and you reported to me, That Me­thod is fit only for the Schools, and would turn our Discourse into Wrangling and Pedantry. If you will be advis'd by me, we will raise a Counter-battery: Let us put them on the Defensive, and see how these Gentlemen, who would prove, the safety of the state depends on their preservation, can reconcile with this Maxim the danger they have heretofore put this Monarchy in; for, I aver it, that in threescore or fourscore years they have ten times brought the State [Page 5]to the brink of destruction by the disorders they have caus'd, and the Wars they have rais'd in it.

You say well, Sir, that's their weak side, and I joyn in opinion with you, they are to be attaqu'd there.

But to the Business of our Answer; have you not seen a Writing published not long after our last Discourse, intituled, A Letter from a Churchman to a Friend? It was Printed at Brussels by Francis Foppery. 'Tis the very thing you want, being a full and pertinent Answer to all the Complaints contain'd in the Petition they intended to present to the King.

You may believe, that having had a design these twelve Months past to be per­fectly informed of this great Affair, I have not fail'd to furnish my self with that Piece: I have read, and brought it with me, be­lieving it might be of use in the Subject we are to examine. But what is your judg­ment of it?

I say, he hath written like a man of sense, and consider'd well what he said: And to tell you my mind, I look not on this Author, as an Author without Mission and without Call, as a private Person who of his own head publish'd a Libel against the Hugonots; 'twas a business design'd: [Page 6]That unknown Writer was put on by the same persons that constantly solicit the King to ruine the Hugonots, or by the Agents of the Clergy.

If I may be allowed to add to the Judgment you have given, I could wish, that Writer had in some particulars weigh­ed better what he said, and dealt more in­genuously. For instance, where the Hugo­nots complain, That in ten years three hun­dred of their Churches have been demolished, that Author answers, This is quickly said, but hard to prove; Pag. 6. for we aver, that there have not been forty of their Churches demolish'd within these ten years: If we are call'd to justifie this, we cannot do it: I know that in the Province of Poitou alone, near forty Churches have been demolish'd. And if that Paper was written by Order of the Clergy, as you conjecture, I wish they had taken care not to contradict themselves: In the Assembly of the Clergy at Paris in May last, where the Bishops at Court had Order to debate the affair of the Regale, and the matter in Controversie between the King and the Pope; The Agent of the Clergy who o­pen'd the Assembly, said in his Harangue, that the King had demolish'd an infinite of Churches: Infinite, (according to Mr. [Page 7] Churchman) is confin'd in very narrow bounds, being reduc'd to forty. But I heard a knocking at the door, and am much mistaken if it be not by our Gentle­men; they are the very Men.

I know not, Sir, what you may think of us, who, strangers as we are, come boldly into a house so considerable as yours, with­out having asked your leave; especially since we are come with a set design to quarrel the Master of the House, and op­pose his sentiments. We have reason to fear we shall not be very welcome; But there stands a Gentleman by you hath un­dertaken we shall; if we have presum'd too far, he is to bear the blame.

Persons of your Civility are wel­come in any place. And as to the Decla­ration of War you have made against me at your entrance, I am not afraid of it; there is no danger, Sir, of any blood to be lost in our Quarrel; I am of Opinion, whoever is vanquish'd will not be troubled at it: I apprehend your meaning from the Discourse I have had with this Gentleman, who hath given me an account of what pass'd betwixt you and him.

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My dear Friend, I am resolv'd to be even with you to day: You have taken a second who is abler than I. And I shall engage you with a man too hard for you both. God grant, your Defeat be so hap­py, as to dispose both of you to Conversi­on: You shall have no more to do with me, you are in good hands; take my word for it, I will henceforward be only a hea­rer.

Since the Gentleman accepts the Chal­lenge with so good a Grace, he will not be displeas'd, if I pray we may go into his Study, which doubtless is well furnish'd; for I foresee we shall have occasion in our Discourse to have recourse to some Books.

With all my heart Gentlemen, we will go where you please, my Study is but indifferent, but I believe we shall find there all the Books we shall need.

By what I have heard from this Gentle­man, who hath procur'd me the pleasure [Page 9]of seeing you, I conceive, Gentlemen, you approve not of the Design the King hath to reunite the Religions in his Kingdom, and are not pleas'd with the Means he makes use of.

Sir, We have more respect for the King, then to presume to judge of his Conduct and condemn it: But we can­not but see, that those who give his Maje­sty the Counsels on which the Conduct a­gainst us is grounded, are the greatest Enemies of the State. All the Jealousie of the House of Austria, all the Forces of Spain and of Germany, will never do France so much mischief as these Politick Bigots.

You have an ill opinion of our zealous Catholicks; Methinks, the name you give them is not suitable to them. Be­sides, it hath something of Contradiction in it; you call them Politick Bigots. Devoti­on is seldom joyn'd with Policy: The Po­liticians of all ages have been always oppo­site to the Bigot and Devout.

Really, sir, they may very well be call'd Bigotted Politicians, when their Devotion and Zeal for the Ruine of the poor Protestants is a meer piece of Po­licy; their lives and their manners prove it clearly: There are some among 'em, to whom we do too great an Honour, if we [Page 10]think they believe there is a God. I have known some Intendants of the Provinces, who had no Religion at Paris, but became on the sudden in their several jurisdictions very zealous Persecutors of the Hugonots. May there not be found among those of the Councel of Conscience some Persons for whose Piety, you Sir, would scarce pass your word? I mean Bishops that keep Concubines; Monks, that are become Cour­tiers and Effeminate, and these Compla­cent directors of Conscience, who approve of all Actions, so the Protestants be de­stroy'd, the Protestants; the light of whose Doctrine is too piercing and clear, and ex­poses too much the vileness of the Actions of their Persecutors, reproaches their Con­duct, and torments them in the very use of their pleasures. Is true Devotion consistent with maxims of Morality, so loose as those of our greatest Persecutors? But so runs the stream; thus men make their Court, 'tis the Mode, and all the World follows it.

I easily believe, there are men of the Character you have given. But I am perswaded there are of those Saints (or Bigots as you call them) who are really de­vout. And I am clear of opinion, they are not Enemies of the State as you say: [Page 11]They conceive unity of Religion the great­est good imaginable, and that it would be the Glory of the King to procure this good to France. And this I take to be the Prin­ciple they build upon, and the ground of their Actions.

I am of Opinion, Sir, those men may very well be call'd Enemies of the State, whose Conduct tends directly to its ruin; who inspire into his Majesties Subjects a mutual hatred, which obliges them to look on one another as Enemies. After that the late King Lewis the 13th. of glorious Memory, had, by the Method he took to appease the late Troubles, taken away the fear the Protestants were under, that there were designs not only against their Liberties, but their Lives, it may be affirm'd, the hearts of those of either Re­ligion were so perfectly reunited, it was impossible for the Enemies of the State to find a breach to enter at. But the King hath been made to tell us in one of his Arrests, that the Kindness and Patience he had had for his Subjects of the pretended Reform'd Religion, had heightned the ad­version of his Catholick Subjects against them. The Aversion the said Catholicks have always had against the said Religion, and those who profess it, hath been encreas'd [Page 12]by the publishing the said Edicts, Declara­tions and Arrests. It is really very neces­sary, the King should be inform'd, that contrary to what he hath been made be­lieve, the Edicts of Pacification had esta­blish'd a perfect peace between both Par­ties, and that happy union hath been con­siderably alter'd, since the considerable Breaches that have been made of those E­dicts. The Roman Catholick resumes that spirit of Animosity he formerly had; he looks on the Protestant as a Victim ready to be sacrific'd to his pleasure, and justifies by the Conduct of his Superiors, the Aver­sion he hath for his Countrymen and fellow Subjects: The Protestant on the other side looks on the Roman Catholick as an Ene­my who endeavours to ruin him. He is full of diffidence, and mistrusts every thing: He dares not speak, nor open his mind free­ly: He is afraid of being question'd for a Word: His Bowels are shut up against the poor Roman Catholick, to whom he us'd to be very open-handed: And he cannot forbear saying to himself, doth Charity oblige me to feed an Enemy to day, who, perhaps will take away my Life to morrow? The poor Hugonot in every Village looks upon his Magistrates and Superiors as men authoriz'd to watch all occasions to destroy [Page 13]him. The Magistrates think themselves ob­liged to be harsh and severe to those who are hated by the Court. They tell us eve­ry day, we have Order to humble and mortifie you: You may expect what you please, but expect no favour. Heretofore the saying was, you shall have Justice done you, but hope not for more. Alas! 'Tis long since we have been in a Condition to expect any favour. We should now be very well satisfi'd, could we have Justice done us; for Justice requires men to keep their Promises: We should esteem our selves happy enough, if permitted to enjoy peaceably the Priviledges and Liberties confirm'd to us by so many Promises, Edicts and Arrests. You cannot believe it in our Power to look upon our approaching ruin, without being troubled the same time to see others rejoyce at our fall. The injuries and reproaches the Hugonots receive from the insulting Roman Catholicks pierce to the heart, and make deep wounds which bleed afresh every day. In a word, that sweetness of Commerce and fair Correspon­dence that raign'd among the Subjects of France is broken and lost, and instead of mutual Confidence, nothing appears but a general fear and universal mistrust: The Tumults in several places, the demolishing [Page 14]and burning of Churches, the Seditions rais'd against the Protestants, the injuries done their Persons for two years past, are convincing Proofs of what I alledge. And matters were carryed on with so furious hast, the King found himself oblig'd to stop the Torrent of these Violences by an Arrest. You are not ignorant, Sir, how necessary it is for the peace of a State, that the In­habitants of a Kingdom be united among themselves by the Bonds of Amity.

'Tis for that very reason, Sir, the King would reduce all his Subjects to one Religion: By suffering two different par­ties in a State, you sowe the Seed of immor­tal Divisions: You know the troubles the Guelfes and the Ghibellines caus'd in Italy; they that would maintain the peace of a State, must suppress the very Name and Memory of Factions.

'Tis not with Sects in Religi­on as with Factions in the State, the case is very different. Factions of State may be suppress'd by good Conduct, and destroy'd by time; yet a considerable time is neces­sary for doing it; the Example you have mention'd of the Guelses and Gibellines suf­ficiently proves it: Those Factions raign'd several Ages; nor could the Name be ex­tinguish'd but after hundreds of years, and [Page 15]the desolation of Italy by the fury of the Parties. But to take away the difference of Sentiments in Religion is a more diffi­cult task. Fire and Faggot, Gibbets and Axes signifie nothing; this appears clearly by the History of the last Age. We must bear with a mischief we can neither pre­vent nor remove, and nourish Peace be­tween two Parties which cannot be de­stroy'd, but may be preserv'd by permit­ting the difference, and maintaining a War between them: This seems a Paradox, but is not so difficult as you may imagine. Pro­vided the stronger Party oppress not the weaker, 'tis certain the weaker will have for the stronger a kindness and value for the Toleration indulg'd; And the stronger will permit it self to be won by the kind­ness and grateful acknowledgments of the weaker: 'Tis a matter try'd and of fresh Experience. Every one knows the Union the Catholick and we Hugonots liv'd in, be­fore they inspir'd the King with a design to destroy us.

This method of preserving Peace is not so sure as you imagine. But I could heartily wish a true remedy could be found for the greatest mischief in a State, which is, the Disunion of its Members, and the Animosity raigning between the Subjects of one Soveraign.

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You will grant me then, Sir, that those who blow up the fire, and re­vive these Animosities, are great Enemies of the State. And this they are evidently guilty of, who inspire into the King, Senti­ments of Rigor and Severity against the Reformed. But, alas! The matter is yet more sad; they are not satisfied with en­deavouring to take from the King all the goodness and kindness he once had for us; but they labour all they can to root out of our hearts the Love, the Respect, the Veneration and the Tenderness we have for our King. I aver it, we love our King even to adoration; we are so clearly con­vinc'd of his sublime Qualities, it adds in­finitely to our grief, to find our selves so ill thought of by a Prince, for whom we have so much Zeal and Admiration. Is it in the power of Man to love and to fear at once the same person? Oh! how shall we do it? We are told every moment the King hath a design to destroy us: He is represented to us with his Sword in his hand ready drawn for our ruin. 'Tis Pub­lish'd, 'tis Printed, that if he live so long, as by course of Nature 'tis presum'd he may, he will see our Religion at an end. Process verbal of the Assembly March and May 1681. If God preserve to us this great Prince, so long as all good Peo­ple [Page 17]ought to wish, he will utterly suppress this Monster in his Kingdom. What means this but to cast us into a general Consterna­tion, with design to stifle and destroy the love we have for our Prince, and to make us look on his Life, as the greatest of our misfortunes? They must have a great stock of Regeneration who can love those they esteem their Enemies; yet all means possi­ble are used to perswade us the King is the greatest Enemy we have. As to the Con­sternation, they have attain'd their ends; 'tis general and so great, it cannot be grea­ter. Yet hitherto the Love we have for our King, stands firm against this horrible Consternation, because we have yet some hope the King will permit himself to be mov'd by our Prayers and Patience. And if disappointed in this, we will apply our selves to God for Grace, not to do any thing contrary to our duty.

To tell you the truth, they slight you so much now adays, they value not at all your Love or your Hatred.

Ah, Sir, say not so; I know well enough those are the Sentiments they would inspire into his Majesty. But to a Prince so sage, and so good as ours, it can­not be a matter of indifferency to be be­lov'd by his Subjects. Oderint dum metu­ant, [Page 18](Let them hate so they fear me) is a word for a Tyrant. I am sure, the King cannot endure the thought of having in his Kingdom two millions of Subjects, who should obey him only out of a slavish fear. He is the common Father of his Countrey, and I cannot but believe he takes us all for his Children.

You have no great reason to think so, to deal ingenuously with you, the King takes you not for very good Subjects; and means have been used to make him sensi­ble, you are troubled at his Victories, and that you fear the success of his Arms and Designs, no less than every good French­man loves and prays for it.

'Tis true, Sir, this is the Cha­racter they give of us to the King, and en­deavour to perswade us to believe to be true; for by the usage we have at their hands, and the Speeches they give out of us, they labour to make us sensible, that the Grandeur of the King will be fatal to us, and that having humbled all his Ene­mies, he will imploy his Forces for our ruin; they would perswade us, that our present sufferings are but an effect of former Threats. The King, say they, is become the terror of his Enemies, and the delight of his Subjects; he fears nothing. And [Page 19]having not now any other imployment for his Power, will force you headlong into Ruine. Ah! Sir, if we were so unhappy (as we are represented) to behold with trouble the Glory of the King, it would become them to study to reclaim us by changing their Conduct. For what can give more trouble to a good Prince, than to think he hath in his Countrey a great number of his Subjects oblig'd to lament his Victories, to mourn amidst the publick Joyes, and to look upon the Prosperity of the State as fatal and pernicious to their private Concern; being assur'd when the State hath not other business, it will turn its whole Force against them? If we be­lieve one God, and one Providence, we ought to be perswaded, that God is mov'd by the Vows and Prayers of men, and that the most unanimous Prayers are the most Efficacious. 'Tis the Interest of a Prince to use all his Subjects with equal kindness, that the Union of their Hearts, and Harmony of their Prayers, may bring down the Blessings of Heaven on the State. But there cannot be a greater Calumny and Falshood, than to affirm we are trou­bled at the Prosperity of the State. Hath any one of those of our Religion, who have had the Honour to serve the King in [Page 20]his Armies, been guilty of Cowardise or Baseness whatever? Hath any of them fought with less Zeal, appear'd less Brave, or done less for the Victory than others in the Army? What signs are there we are not pleas'd with the publick Pros­perity? What Cause have we given for any to think so? The truth is, they de­scribe us such as they would have us to be, and such as they who accuse us would be, if they were in our Case: But God gives us the Grace to retain true French hearts, to rejoyce at the Grandeur of the King, and to leave to Providence the success of our private Affairs.

'Tis true, you have cunning e­nough to put a good Face on your Matters, and to colour your Designs with appearan­ces of Loyalty, but you have in your hearts a hidden inclination to revolt.

But is it fit to charge the Innocent with the blackest of Crimes with­out Proof? 'Tis said we have a secret dis­position to Rebellion. How do they prove it? What do they mean by it? In my Opi­nion, the Design of Rebels is to change the form of Government of a State, as the Fa­naticks did in England by Cromwell, or to call in a stranger into the Countrey, and submit to new Dominion. I know but [Page 21]these two ends of Rebellion; for to make Insurrection for Insurrections sake, to raise Tumults for no other end, but to make a busle, is a Design fit only for Fools and Mad-men. Can we be lyable to the least Suspition of the former? Have we given by any of our Actions, any colour to be­lieve we desire a change of the present form of Government, and to see the Mo­narchy turn'd into a popular State? What should we get by it? Can we promise our selves greater safety, when expos'd to the Authority and Fury of so wild and unrea­sonable a Beast as the Multitude? As to the second, what advantage can we expect by changing our Master? Are we desi­rous to be under the Dominion of Spain? Do men think we shall gain by the shift? Or do they believe we have such Maggots in our Brains, as to desire the English may abandon their Isles, and come once more and conquer our Continent? Or that the Hollanders quitting their Marshes, should possess themselves of this Kingdom? No­thing but Frenzy can make men capable of Chimaeras as these; so that they who charge us with being Enemies to the State, have as little sense as Charity in their Cen­sure.

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I perceive by my friends eyes, he burns with impatience to propose his Obje­ctions out of a Book in his hand.

What Book is it?

'Tis the Letter of a Churchman to a Friend.

I know it very well, without hearing more of it; I have read that Libel, and easily comprehend what Objections may be rais'd out of it: But, Sir, give us leave, before we enter into that great affair, to finish what we have begun. The Apo­logy you obliged me to make, hath put me out of my way; for we began, with pro­ving that the Enemies of the Reformed, are Enemies of the State. I have already made it appear, by shewing, that they disunite the Kings Subjects, that they root out of the Kings heart, the Fatherly kind­ness he had for us; and endeavour to root out of ours, the Love we have for the grea­test of our Kings. This concerns the Vi­tals of the State; it attacks the Principles by which it subsists: For the bond of Love between the King and his Subjects, is that which unites all the parts of this great and vast Body. But 'tis fit I represent to you those horrible Calamities these Enemies of France would plunge the Kingdom in. They would bring back again the last Age, and [Page 23]revive the Reigns of Henry the 2d. and Charles the 9th. In a word, they would set up new Gibbets, and kindle new Fires a­gainst the Reformed. Can France expect a great Mischief?

Y'are much mistaken Sir, there's no such intention. Some Zealots may desire such a thing; but the King hath not any such Design.

I believe you Sir, We know the Goodness and Clemency of the King, and that he naturally hates all Violence. We see every day the Prudence of his Mi­nisters. But men are led where they ne­ver had intention to go; they are mov'd by degrees to revoke all the Edicts of Pa­cification. If Matters be carryed on with that Violence they have been for some years, and especially within few months past, the Business will be quickly at an end, they will shortly perswade the King, three fourths of the Hugonots of his Kingdom are con­verted: They will tell him, the residue is nothing, or not worth the thinking of; And so prevail with him to suppress the E­dicts. Thus shall near two millions of Souls remain debarr'd the exercise of their Reli­gion: 'Tis a violent State, in which Consci­ences cannot stay long: The Ministers shall be forbidden to Preach on pain of death: [Page 24]Yet they will Preach, (as before in the like case) in Caves, and Woods, and Cellars, and Darkness. And instead of preaching in a few places, they will preach in every place. It cannot be, but they will be dis­cover'd, exercising a Religion prohibited by the State, and incur the Penalties to be inflicted by the late Edicts. And accord­ing to the Severity of those Penalties they will be Imprison'd, Banish'd, Hang'd. Con­sider how much it will grate the good na­ture of the King, to see himself oblig'd to permit his Subjects to be put to a thousand Tortures, for no other reason but having a desire to serve God. I foresee Matters may be carryed yet farther. Among two or three hundred thousand Persons able to bear Arms, remaining still of that Religi­on, 'tis impossible but there is a great num­ber of Fools, impatient and desperate: In plurality of Voyces, Fools are always too hard for the Wise, who are often oblig'd to permit themselves to be carryed away with the stream of the major Vote. Such heady and impatient People, instead of Submit­ting, will Mutiny, make Parties, take up Arms. And then will the King be forc'd to draw Rivers of Blood out of the hearts of his Subjects.

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Ay, Ay, Sir, there is great cause to fear you you are in a powerful and formi­dable Condition: Where are your Chiefs? where your strong Towns? Where your Money? Where your Forraign Allyances? You have nothing to support you, but the indulgence of our Kings.

Pardon me if I tell you, you do not apprehend me; my design is not to put you in fear, but move you to pi­ty. I do not say, but the King may with all the ease imaginable, dissipate the Forces of any Faction that should rebel against him. I am fully convinc'd of it, not only by your Reasons, but some stronger Ar­guments. You say the Reformed have neither Chiefs, nor Towns, nor Money. Have you forgot that saying of the Poet, Furor arma ministrat? Fury never wants Weapons, they who have no Towns, may take some. Those who want Money, may Rob and Plunder. Despair can effect what Valour and Courage never durst under­take. A State that has lying close in its Bowels two millions of Male-contents (though but Women and Children, and the dregs of Mankind) is in danger of suf­fering terrible Revolutions. After the Massacre of St. Bartholomew, the Hugonots had none to head them. Dandelot was [Page 26]dead, the Admiral assassinated, all the Flower of their Nobility murther'd, and the Princes of the Blood Prisoners, yet they never spoke bigger, never insisted on higher Terms than then. But I expect not any benefit to the Reformed from such Revolutions, because God never blesses the designs of defending a Religion by Arms, of Rebelling against our Prince, and mak­ing War under pretences of Piety: The fu­ries of Civil War being absolutely incon­sistent with Charity. Such heady and im­patient people by taking Arms will act a­gainst the Principles of Religion, and (I aver it) particularly against the Principles of the Reformed: They are to expect no other success, but to be massacred by the People and the Arms of their Soveraign: They would occasion (as heretofore) mil­lions of Innocents to perish with them. The King would certainly master them, but would be griev'd to see his Countreys drown'd with the Blood of his Subjects: What greater misfortune than this to a Prince so good-natur'd as ours? Besides, a State busied in reducing rebellious Sub­jects, is in a manner abandon'd to stran­gers; who fill and tear it in pieces with Fa­ctions, foment Divisions, take advantage of Disorders, and draw Blood from all [Page 27]parts of it, while it self opens the Veins on every side. Those Gentlemen who con­stantly solicit the King to Rigor against us, are certainly weary of the prosperity of the State; they have no mind to see France any longer the most flourishing Kingdom of Europe: They would bring back that Age wherein the Realm divided against it self, call'd in the Duke of Parma, the Flemings and Spaniards to enrich themselves with the pillages of the Towns, and desolation of the Provinces.

I see, Gentlemen, the alarm you have taken, hath stirr'd your fancy, and put you in a heat: You go on too far, and too fast, there is a design to Ruine you; 'tis confest, but 'tis by undermining you by degrees: Those very men you call Enemies of the State, have no mind to see the effu­sion of your Blood.

Were those men guilty of no other mischief, but a design to deprive the King of such a multitude of faithful Sub­jects, they very well deserved to be call'd Enemies of the State. I hope those of the Reformed Religion will never permit them­selves to run into the Extremities I spoke of; But they will do all they can to go seek in other Countreys, the peace and the quiet they are denyed in their own. I [Page 28]have told you already their Consternation is great and universal. And all the con­siderable persons of our body seek only a Gate to go out at, and a means to remove out of his Majesties sight the Objects that displease him.

I cannot think they would be much troubled at your departure out of the Kingdom.

Whether they would be trou­bled I know not, but I very well know they would have cause enough to be trou­bled. The Count de los Balbazes during his stay at Paris, being in company of se­veral Ministers of forraign Princes, they fell in Discourse of the Conduct of the Court of France, as to the Hugonots. He exclaim'd against the Policy of the Cabi­net, and said, that for the good of the State it matter'd little what Religion the Subjects were of, provided they were Loy­al and dutiful to their Soveraign; that a like Conduct had turn'd some States be­longing to the King his Master, into vast Deserts and Solitudes by the expulsion of the Moors; who were a remnant of Jews and Mehometans, multiplyed and spread over the Provinces of Castille, Valentia, and Andalusia. They had been baptiz'd, and to escape the Inquisition, made profession [Page 29]of Christianity, but privately us'd the Wor­ship of their Ancient Religion. Upon some false advice given Philip the second of Spain, of a great design the Moors had against the Christians, they were expell'd the Countrey. They were not permitted to carry any thing away, but some Com­modities of Spain, but were forc'd to leave behind, their Gold, and their Silver, as well as their immoveables. This was exe­cuted with extreme Rigor: There went out of Spain twelve hundred thousand Men and Women; the greatest part whereof pe­rished several ways; Spain having been well drained of men by sending Colonies into America, was so exhausted by this great Evacuation, 'tis not repeopled to this day. And that Countrey which was here­tofore one of the fairest of Europe, is now a vast and barren Desert, and the Spani­ards feel at this day the smart of their Bar­barity. God grant a like misfortune hap­pens not to France, and that it make not it self desolate by an expulsion of two millions of her best Inhabitants: I cannot think those who endeavour it are much her friends.

However, Sir, I am of Opinion the persons you speak of, take themselves to be as great lovers of their Countrey, as you, [Page 30]or any of your Party; And if the matter be disputed, I very much question, whe­ther you will carry the Point.

I find all I say to you, doth but vex, without convincing you. But you will excuse the Expressions of misera­ble persons, who have not the Liberty to speak in Publick; they may be allowed at least to complain in Private, and when they can do it without danger. Since you are not pleas'd with a Discourse tending to de­monstrate, that the Enemies of the Re­formed of France, are Enemies of the State, I will trouble you but with a word more on that Subject: You cannot but be­lieve that Forraign Allyances are of some importance to France. You understand the Politicks so well, you cannot be igno­rant, a State without Allyes is not capable of doing great things. This makes Princes labour perpetually to break those Engage­ments their Neighbours have with their E­nemies, and to perswade them to espouse their Interests. The greatest part of the Allyes of France are Protestants: The Swis­ses, the Elector of Brandenburg, the King of Swede, and heretofore the Hollander, who perhaps may again renew his Allyance. But can you believe to use the Protestants of France as they are dealt with at present, [Page 31]a proper means to engage strictly the Pro­testant Allyes of the Crown?

I do not see the King finds any great difficulty in making Allyances with protestant Princes, or that they concern themselves much, or trouble his Ministers with your pretended Calamities.

The King is now in so eleva­ted a Condition, that all comply with him. Yet the private disgusts of his Allyes are still in being, though they do not appear: They are Seeds that will certainly spring up sooner or later. States are not always in a flourishing Condition; when Fortune declares against them, old grudges break out. 'Tis not to be imagin'd, men can, out of Policy, wholly devest themselves of love to their Religion, and become alto­gether insensible of the Calamities they suf­fer whom they call Brethren, though the present State of Affairs may oblige them to dissemble. 'Tis very well known, the Allyes I have named, have heretofore con­cern'd themselves in our Calamities, though far less than those we now endure: 'Tis not their Affections, but the Times are chang'd. The English naturally hate the French, and find new reason to hate them in the rigorous Proceedings of the Catholicks of France against the Protestants there, who [Page 32]profess the same Religion with the English: To prove that strangers are somewhat con­cern'd for our Calamities, I need but read the Letters of his Majesty of England to the Bishop and Mayor of London; they are newly published, and you will not repent your reading them, being Letters worthy the Piety of that Prince, and capable to clear him from any unjust suspitions that might have been had of him in respect of his Religion.

YOU know without doubt, that the King of England proceeded further in our favour; declaring all the persecuted Protestants (who should come into Eng­land) Denizens of his Kingdom. And that all those who should transport their effects thither in Merchandise, should im­port them Custom-free; and whereas the Collection for the French Protestants in England was at first made only in the Ci­ty and Suburbs of London, the King hath commanded it should be made through­out the Kingdom. Nor is it England alone opens its arms to receive the distressed Protestants of France; They are enter­tained in all places of Europe: The Duke of Hanan hath offer'd to receive four hun­dred [Page 37]Families; Swede and Denmark, tho very remote, declare themselves ready to embrace the scatter'd Remains of the Pro­testant Churches of France. The Charity of England towards them is very edifying, yet I confess, I am not equally satisfied with all other Protestants who might af­ford Refuge to their persecuted Brethren: I have seen some of them return'd as Per­sons in despair from places where they had promised themselves support, resolv'd to hazard all, and run again into the temp­tation they had fled from; being so scan­daliz'd with the cold reception and hard usage they had found, that they were rea­dy to hearken to the solicitations of the Missionaries.

I confess, the carriage of some strangers towards our persecuted Pro­testants appear'd to me quite contrary to the spirit of Christianity: And if it conti­nue, what will become of so many poor Peasants and Tradesmen, who groan at this day in search of the means to have liberty of Conscience? What will become of so many eminent Persons, who will be oblig'd to quit their Countrey naked and destitute, to follow Jesus Christ, and can carry nothing with them, but their Lives and their Consciences? What can be more [Page 38]Lamentable, than to see how cold mens Charity and Zeal is? 'Tis more deplorable than the Persecution. What is become of that spirit of our Ancestors, that made them have all things common among them? That render'd every private Person sensi­ble of the publick Calamity: In the be­ginning of the Reformation, if those Pro­testants, who were in peace and safety, had done nothing for those who were under Persecution, the Light of the Reformation had been long since put out in most pla­ces of Germany, the Low-Countries, and France.

Mens Charity, I hope, will be awaken'd again to do something for God and themselves: For, in truth, the Compassion the Protestants in safety should express for their afflicted Brethren of France, is but a good Office done to themselves. There is not a Protestant State Neigh­bouring on France, but is under apprehen­sion of its Arms, and hath cause to fear it may one day feel the miseries the Reform­ed of this Kingdom groan under now: Where-ever the King carries his Arms, those wicked Councellors who perswade him to ruine our Religion, will carry their Coun­sels, and make use of the Fortune of this great Monarch to accomplish their de­signs. [Page 39]This may give them who at pre­sent are in safety, cause enough to fear they may not always continue so. It would become them to merit a Compassion they may one day stand in need of, by exerci­sing Compassion towards those who are actually in misery. But above all they ought by Works of Mercy, and the Exer­cise of fervent Charity, and strict Union among themselves, to divert the Wrath of God that threatens them; and to endea­vour to escape the greatest of Misfortunes, the loss of Liberty, and oppression of their Consciences. I cannot forbear adding, that the Children of this World are wiser in their Generation, than the Children of Light, and that their Zeal not only upbraids, but may justly make us asham'd of our cold­ness: 'Tis difficult to express the great pains the Roman Catholicks take, they spare no cost to make Converts, as they call them. There are very considerable Funds assign'd for the Maintenance and Encouragement of those they have perswaded to change their Religion. The King allows out of his Revenue, vast sums for gaining and re­compencing these new Converts: We have known lewd Women converted big with Bastard Children, who had Pensions of four or five hundred Livers allow'd them. 'Tis [Page 40]a Prodigy to me, that we are not willing for the support of poor distressed Prote­stants, to be at that expence they of the o­ther Party are at, for perverting of Souls. I wish, all Protestant States would imitate the principal Towns of the Low Countreys, which give Lodging in a manner gratis to all those who fly thither for Refuge; be­sides immunity from Parish-Duties and Charges levyed for the use of the Town, and furnish with Money and Goods those that have none, till they are in a Conditi­on to subsist by themselves, and make great Collections in their Towns for that pur­pose.

Though all that could be wish'd, is not every where done for those who leave their Countrey to save their Souls, yet sufficient is done to make it ap­pear, that the Kings Protestant Allyes and Neighbours, are much grieved at the ill usage of their Brethren; and that disgust­ed with the present Conduct of our Mini­sters in that Point, they long for an Oc­casion to shew their Resentment: I can­not imagine upon what account our Ru­ine can be look'd upon as advantagious to the State: I will not trouble you with a repetition of the Reasons we gave the last year, to convince the King of our inviola­ble [Page 41]Fidelity, and consequently, that he is concern'd to preserve us no less than any other of his Subjects: I make no question, but you have heard all our Remarks on that Subject.

Yes, Gentlemen, I have heard them, and think it needless to insist further on that point: Time will shew who are in the right, you or we. Counsels are justifi­ed or condemned by the Event: Unfortu­nate Valour is branded for Rashness, and fortunate Rashness commended for Valour. If the Mischiefs you foretel happen to the State according to your Prediction, it will be judg'd you were in the right; but if a way be found by fair means, and with­out effusion of Blood, to bring you again into the bosom of the Church, you will be oblig'd to acknowledg our Conduct, not altogether so imprudent as you ima­gin'd; therefore without looking further into the future, I will consider only the present, and must say, I do not see what great cause you have to complain. You will find it a hard task to perswade us you are miserably and rigorously dealt with, when we see you in full peace, enjoy every man his Estate, and the fruit of his Labour: I will not mince the Matter to you, by denying all we can shall be done for de­stroying [Page 42]your Religion, but with excepti­on of your Persons and Estates which shall be spar'd: Is not this fair, and ought you not to rest satisfi'd?

Ought we not to rest satis­fi'd, say you? Sure, Sir, you take us for People whose God is their Belly, who be­lieve not a future State, but place all their happiness in present enjoyments. The Principal is taken from us, our Religion and the Liberty of our Consciences, and you would have us remain content with the residue. And what is that residue, you say, shall not be meddled with? Our E­states and our Persons: Are not our Per­sons meddled with, when they exercise a thousand Cruelties, and commit infinite Outrages to make us change our Religion; when they strip us of all means to live, when they reduce us to a necessity of star­ving, or turning, by declaring us uncapa­ble of employment, and excluding us from all Offices and Professions, and from the exercise of all Trades we could get a lively-hood by: When Gibbets were set up in every corner to hang us on, and Fires kin­dled for burning us, we were allow'd the choice of going to Mass or of dying. Are we not reduc'd now to the same choice by their taking from us all means of living? [Page 43]Are we not in as bad a Condition as here­tofore? We must dye or change our Reli­gion: 'Tis true, the death now propos'd is not hanging or burning as formerly, but I am not yet resolv'd, whether is more eli­gible to dye in a moment on a Gibbet, or pine to death by a long train of Mise­ries.

You are not wanting to your selves in setting out to the height the misery of your condition; But leaving out the fi­gures and aggravations of your pathetical Descriptions, the rest will signifie little.

Do you call it Figure and Aggravation to be in our condition, ex­pecting every day the thunder-bolt of a new Arrest for demolishing our Churches, and depriving us of the Liberty of wor­shipping God Almighty? You complain to this day of the Outrages committed up­on your Churches and Images in the heat of the Civil War: If our Churches were destroy'd by Violences as those, we should have the Comfort of being able to preach on the Ruins of them, and hope to see them rebuilt when the Kingdom should be at peace. But we lose all, not only our present Possession, but all hopes for the future. We are forc'd to grieve at heart for Calamities for which there is no Reme­dy: [Page 44]I say, to grieve at heart, for 'tis Cri­minal for us to make the most innocent complaint. Perish we must, and under a Formality, and appearance of justice: Be our Defence never so good, what evidence soever we produce in our favour, we are still in the wrong, our Possession is unjust, and hath no right to ground it. They are not satisfi'd with taking away our E­states, but they brand us for Usurpers: How prodigiously bold is the Libel in your hand, to challenge us to shew one Church demolish'd that was a Church at the time limited by the Edict, when nothing can be more notorious than that (of the great num­ber of places of Religious Exercise lately interdicted) perhaps there are not two that can be any way suspected to have been set apart for that use since the Edict of Nants. This is clear by the Tables of our Ancient Synods, where we find a greater Number (by half) of places for Religious Worship, than we have at this day. We had them at the time the Edict was made, else how could they appear in Acts of the Synods past at that time? By the Edict we are to continue in peaceable Possession of all we then had, and what we then had, is now taken from us contrary to the express terms of the Edict, and all the rights of Possessi­on [Page 45]and Prescription. For besides their Ar­rests ex parte, wherein they pretend we have Liberty to make our Defence, yet con­demn us unheard, they extort from his Majestys Declarations that ruine us, that reduce us to Extremity, and run us into De­spair.

Pray, Sir, which are those ruining Declarations?

I need not tell you Sir, what they are: They are too publick to escape the knowledg of a Person so well acquaint­ed as you are with the World: There are Volumes made of them, and our good friends of the Clergy cram their Studies with Collections of them. They set up the Title of them in Triumph; Arrests pass'd against the Hugonots by the Solicitation of the Clergy of France: Our late Calamities are so grievous, they make us forget the former: Do but call to mind the Declara­tions published against us within twelve months last past, and you will see whether our Complaints are but figurative and pa­thetick Aggravations.

Those Declarations are not very many.

They are not quite as many as the weeks in a year, but half a dozen more such would quite undo us: Have we [Page 46]no cause, think you, to complain of the Declaration that orders the Judges or o­thers appointed for that purpose, to go vi­sit our sick at the point of death, to know what Religion they will dye in?

What harm in that? Every man may die of what Religion he please: Those that visit you, put no force upon you, but ask you a Question or two and leave you.

The fault I find with it, is, that it opens a gap for all sorts of Seducti­on and Violence. By the Declaration, every door must be open'd to the Magi­strate; he enters attended with a Curate, and a Missionary: The Arrest excludes not the Relations of the sick from hearing them examin'd: It neither orders them to withdraw, nor orders the Examination to be taken in their presence. But a Law must always be favourably interpreted: And that the sick may be at liberty to speak their thoughts, their Friends and Relations must be put out of sight: By this excellent Con­struction of the Arrest, they get the sick person into their hands, force the Husband from the bed of his Wife, and the Wife out of the Arms of her Husband, the Child from his dying Father, and the Fa­ther from his Child: Having clear'd the [Page 47]Room and secur'd themselves from fear of a Witness, they promise, they threaten, they frighten a dying wretch and load him with injuries: they take advantage of the disorder of his faculties occasion'd by his sickness, and the fright he is in to see so many new Faces about his Bed. A word ill plac'd, and unwary expression (the ef­fect of a high Feaver or Frenzy) is laid hold on, as sufficient ground for Mr. Cu­rate to cry aloud, Mr.—or Mrs.—is wil­ling to dye a Catholick: Upon this, the sick person is taken into their care, his Kindred and Friends remov'd from him, and he made believe, he is perfectly converted. By this Artifice he gives up his last breath amidst Crosses, and Tapers, and Images and Crucifixes, and other Utensils of a Church, into which they say he is entred, though he knows nothing of it. When he is dead, they bury him with like Pomp, they take away his Children in their Infan­cy, they ransack his House and leave his Family desolate.

The Arrest neither says, nor means any such matter.

I know not whether the Ar­rest have any such meaning: Perhaps his Majesty who pass'd it, had not: But I am sure this was their meaning who obtain'd [Page 48]it: It appears by their practice pretended, pursuant to it: Till our days, a mans House was his Castle, and private habitations were inviolable Sanctuaries; Where every one (taking care, not to offend against Law) had free permission to do what he pleas'd, at least, had the Priviledge to dye undi­sturb'd. But now we are not allow'd to live in quiet, or to dye so: Our Enemies have in this particular invented a new kind of Cruelty, unheard of even in the Ages of Persecution and Martyrdome: If in those days men were oblig'd to live in the Emperors Religion, they were permitted to dye in the Christian: Can any thing be imagin'd more cruel than the usage we find? A sick wretch in his last Agonies struggling with death, hath need of more strength than his own to maintain the Com­bat: The smoothest Calm, and greatest Tranquility of Spirit is little enough to put him in a Condition to face those Terrors that usher in the last moment of his Life: 'Tis some comfort to a man in that case to breathe his last in the Arms of his Wife, or Embraces of his Children: They cherish and help him, he gives them his blessings: Amidst these mutual Offices of Charity and Tenderness, all their hearts melt into Tears: The one and the other desire pri­vacy [Page 49]and quiet to vent their grief, and give free course to their just Lamentations. A Magistrate enters with all the Clergy of a Parish at his heels: The House is fill'd with noise and bustle: A croud presently gathers at the door, and with horrid noise and prodigious outcryes, grate the Ears of the dying Man: At this very time and in these Circumstances, he who hath scarce strength enough left to breathe out his Soul, must engage in a Conflict he was hardly able to maintain when in perfect health: He must answer; he must study and ponder what to say; he must consider how he may escape the Snares laid for him in captious and ambiguous Questions; he must sustain the shock of Threats, and encounter the in­fluence and power of Authority. He must, for his Comfort, have the patience to hear an ignorant Curate, who to de­monstrate our Religion false, shall use no other Argument, but that of repeating a hundred times in a quarter of an hour with a furious tone, that if he dye in that Religion, he is damn'd as a Devil; instead of his dear Children and Friends, he must be content to see about him a company of men, whose Eyes sparkle with rage, and whose Tongues (if he persevere in his Re­ligion) thunder out Reproaches.

[Page 50]

The Condition of a dying man or­dinarily disarms the fury of an Enemy, who having given the mortal Wound, gives the man leave to dye in peace. Are the miseries of our Life so few, that we must be deny'd a quiet death? You have, doubtless, heard what happen'd in the Fauxboarg St. Marcell, since this Declara­tion: A poor Woman being very ill, through the violence of her Distemper ralk'd idle: That very time the Commis­sioner and Priests enter her Chamber, turn out her Relations and Friends who assist­ed her, make her say what they please, and go their ways to fetch the Consecrated Bread and Oyl for extreme Unction. That none in their absence might get into the Chamber, they lock the Door and take the Key with them. The Woman in the mean time coming to her self, was fright­ned to see a Cross standing at her Beds feet: She presently guess'd what had happen'd in her Fever; she rises, and designing to get away, runs to the Door: finding it lock'd she resolves to go out at the Win­dow, too great an adventure for one in so weak a Condition. Endeavouring to get down, she fell from the third story, and lay dead with the fall on the Pavement. A more lamentable Accident could not [Page 51]have happen'd, except that at Ville dieu, a Village of Poitou some months since: The Curate and Church-warden went into the House of an old Man who lay sick; they turn'd his Children out of doors, threat­ning them furiously, if they came near the House, they should hang for it: The poor Fellows frightned with Persecutions they had already endur'd, retir'd into the Woods, and durst not approach the House: In their absence, the Persecutors teaz'd the old Man several days: But he had the Sense and Courage to resist their Tentations, who finding at length they could not prevail, quitted him: The poor man left thus with­out help, was starv'd to death, and was found dead, having eaten his hands.

You have told your story, give me leave to take my turn, and ac­quaint you with one I heard but a few hours before I came hither: In Mompellier, two Maids, the one sick, the other in health, renounc'd our Religion in one day; she that was sick had done it in the height of her Fever: Being come to her self and hear­ing what had pass'd, she was so griev'd, she fell again into her Frenzy, and flung her self out at a Window: The other who was in health had no sooner committed the fault, but she repented it: She protested, [Page 52]she had been surpriz'd, and could not live in the Religion they had newly made her embrace. Having made this Declaration, she was put into a Covent, where she found a Well, into which she threw her self: Such are the natural Consequences of the Declarations procur'd against us.

If this be true, why do you not complain? Justice will be done you.

Justice, Sir! Of whom shall we de­mand it? Of the Magistrate, in whose pre­sence these Outrages are done. Of the Sove­raign Courts? Which take pleasure in mak­ing our Yoak the heavier. Of the Mini­stry? Who pretend they believe not a word we say. Of the King? Who will not give us the hearing.

If this Declaration be executed with Moderation and Equity, what cause to complain of it? For since you are al­low'd to live in quiet, and at the end of your Life, are ask'd only what Religion you will dye of, what can be more clear, than that without any intention of Ruining you, great care is taken of your Salvation, and that it is heartily wish'd for?

Can you believe, Sir, that those who have solicited and surpriz'd his Majesty to make this Declaration, have done it out of Love to our Souls, and [Page 53]Care of our Salvation? I make no doubt, but use was made of that very pretence to induce the King to it, His Majesty being uncapable of a base thought or mean de­sign. But I am too fully convinc'd, those who first suggested it to the King, have very small care of the Salvation of our Souls. There are many of them have no care of their own, how then should they take care of other mens? Others of them have such animosity against us, that if they saw us at Hell-gate, and had it in their power to thrust us in, they would certain­ly do it: But, to speak in cold blood: Let me perswade you on this occasion to make use of your usual Sagacity: How can you imagine, those who solicited this De­claration, aim'd at the Salvation of mens Souls? Why should they think, that a man who all his Life long hath been of the Re­form'd Religion, should desire at his death to turn Roman Catholick? If this man had had any such thought, it should have been made appear in his Life: 'Tis far better living than dying in your Religion: For that which you call Conversion, makes a man capable of Imployment and Office, it opens him the way into Dignities and great places, to Gain and great Fortune: What can be more evident, than that a man dis­pos'd [Page 54]to turn Catholick, would, for the rea­son I have intimated, not stay till his death, but do it in his life-time, and as early as he could? But a man in his life hath perhaps a care of his reputation, or is clogg'd with Interests that oblige him to dissemble; but at his death he slights such respects, he breaks all such bonds, knowing that though he hath lived for others, he must die for himself. This were a good Argument in a Country where the Roman Catholick Religion is prohibited: but in France where it is predominant, where it makes use at this time of its advantages with a high hand, a man hath all encouragement imaginable, with all the freedom he can wish, and probable hopes of extraordinary recompence, to declare at any time his in­clinations to quit our Religion: Perhaps those Gentlemen were of opinion that God inspires many people at the hour of their death, who, should they recover, would con­stantly follow the notions they are then in­spir'd with. True it is, Sir, you know we live in an Age of Miracles and extraordinary In­spirations! We find them very numerous! Most of those who persecute us have great faith for Inspirations! In a word, if this Declaration extended only to those who in their life have made appear some inclina­tion [Page 55]to alter their Religion, it might be thought the desire of their salvation occa­sioned these visits: But these visits are made to all, without exception to them who all their life-long have been most firm and re­solv'd. I would gladly know what new illumination an old firm Hugonot can be suppos'd to have from a plain single que­stion ask'd by a Magistrate in a civil and gentle manner? and if none, whether there be not some other design in the business? Is the asking of such a question look'd up­on as a powerful instrument of the Holy Spirit for the conversion of an Heretick? Have we any Presidents of Conversion by such means? 'Tis clear then that the De­claration strictly pursued according to the Letter, is not of any use to make a man change his Religion; and it is equally clear that they who sollicited that Declaration, being men of sense, did not in the least de­sign by it the conversion of dying men, or the salvation of their Souls.

I would fain know what other de­sign they could propose to themselves in it.

'Tis not hard to guess; the Clergy hath a design to load us with mi­series, and to render our Religion odious to us by a multitude of calamities attend­ing it: The happiness of Mankind here on [Page 56]Earth consists in the pleasures of Life and Liberty, to die quietly: they have already found out a thousand ways to render our lives miserable and unpleasant, and invent every day new means to continue them so: there wanted nothing but a means to trouble us at our death, to make our yoke insupportable: And they have hit upon't in this Declaration. Besides, having very small hopes of converting (as they call it) Fathers or Mothers, or any person at the age of discretion, they levell'd their design against Children and Infants: To compass this, they could not have invented a more effectual means than that they are furnish'd with by this Declaration, whereby if they can but make believe a man died a Roman Catholick, they make themselves Masters of all the Children he left under age. To bring this about, it was necessary to open a passage to the Beds of the Dying: it was necessary to have liberty of entrance into any house, which could not be had with­out the authority of the Soveraign: the Kings goodness permitted him not to grant all they desired (and had obtain'd by the Declaration in 1666. since revok'd in part, and in part mitigated by that of 1669.) which was, that the Curates should have liberty to enter any house to perswade the [Page 57]Sick to change their Religion. They at­tempted afresh to revive this Article; but disappointed of their ends, they rested sa­tisfied with what was granted them, which was, that the Judges should go into the houses of the Sick to know what Religion they desir'd to die in: they thought it sufficient for their purpose, if they could by any means get mens doors open, after which they would take the liberty to en­ter whether leave were granted them or not. It hath happen'd accordingly; for this (we see) is the course taken, which puts the Sick into horrible agonies, and their Families into terrible frights.

I see you are of their opini­on who hold they have a design to seize upon our Children.

Alas, Sir, can you doubt of it? if the Declaration against the dying had not sufficiently convinc'd you; if the Ar­rest that prohibits the Midwives of our Religion to lay any woman; if the per­mission granted to the Midwives of the Roman-Catholick Perswasion to baptize our Infants as soon as they are born, had not given you cause enough to support it; I believe you will not require clearer de­monstration than the late Declaration so much talk'd of; by which they are im­powr'd [Page 58]to take from us our Children at Seven years old. A terrible Declaration to Fathers and Mothers: A Declaration will make us take the resolution to throw our selves at the Kings feet, to beg of him that he will take away our lives, or allow us the liberty of our Conscience and our Children, or leave to go naked out of his Kingdom, to live dispers'd through all Countries of the world till we pine to death.

The Declaration orders no more, than that at Seven years old Children shall be of age to choose their Religion. Is this such a matter to be exclaim'd at? The De­claration of the Children shall be receiv'd, but no violence offer'd them.

Is this a matter to be ex­claim'd at, say you! Pray Sir shew me in History one Example of such a Persecution, one President of a Grievance of this na­ture, that denies Parents the liberty to in­struct their Children in their Religion. Was it ever heard of, that Children should have power given them to make choice of their Religion at an age they are incapable to distinguish between black and white; an age to be perswaded to any thing with a Plum or an Apple; an age to which the best Arguments are the finest Rattles to [Page 59]play with? No Violence, say you, shall be offer'd the Children: Is it not a violence and wrong to the Parents, to have their Children seduc'd and taken away from them? What need of Violence to be us'd against Children of that Age which are ea­sily perswaded to any thing? The Violence is done to the Parents, whose Children shall be taken away from them, as soon as seduc'd to declare themselves inclin'd to be Roman Catholicks: In a word, On what account soever Children shall be forceably taken out of the Bosoms of their Mothers, never to return; Can you call it a small Matter, a slight Business, against which there is no cause to exclaim?

Once more I affirm it, the Declara­tion says not, your Children shall be taken from you.

I confess, it does not: Yet they who are entrusted with the Execu­tion of it, will do it. And the Declara­tion was desir'd and obtain'd for no other end. Shall I prophesie to you the issue of this Declaration, as I have been your Historian, in giving you an account of the Consequences of that which concerns the sick. It shall be presently given out, there is no Violence design'd. Order shall be given by word of mouth to the Magistrates, [Page 60]not to permit any to be done. The Priests in a while will not at all regard these Pro­hibitions, though perhaps at first they will observe some measures, and content them­selves, (it may be) with engaging (by Oath in Confession) all the Women, particular­ly those of mean condition, as the Ser­vants in our Families, to endeavour all they can to seduce the Children, by Pro­mises and private Instructions, and all other means useful to that purpose: For a Hob­by-horse, a Child will be made to say, he hath a mind to go to Mass: Two Witnes­ses shall be ready to swear it: The Child shall presently be taken away, never to be seen again by the Parents: Yet they must pay an extraordinary rate for the Board and Instruction of the Children taken away: Thus will they kill two Birds with one stone; take away the Children, and ruine the Pa­rents, to force them by Poverty to quit their Religion: In a short time they will proceed farther; they will find a pretence to enter our Houses: They will have re­ceiv'd News from very good hands, the Children have a great inclination for the Catholick Religion, but that their Parents are harsh to them for it: They will enter by Authority from the Magistrate, and [...] out the Parents and Relations: Hav­ing [Page 61]the Children alone, they will say what they please: The holy Spirit will inspire them in a moment, and dissipate those thick Mists of Calvinism, that darkned their tender understandings. It will on the sudden make them so clear sighted, they will in a moment discover all Catho­lick Truths; and must presently be lock'd up in Cloysters, to be educated there till they come to maturity sufficient to resist a Father and Mother, and proof to the perswasions of Friends, and influence of Relations.

This, I grant, is already so obvi­ous, that I shall make no scruple to ac­knowledg it. You perhaps may be permit­ted to dye in your Religion, but care shall be taken to bring up your Children bet­ter. And this is the principal means to be us'd for destroying your Sect.

We see it very clearly, Sir, The Arrest against our Midwives, that which orders the Magistrate to visit our sick, and this last Declaration have put it out of doubt; and you call this Sir— 'Tis a Proceeding you will be puzzl'd to parallel in the most barbarous Countries and Ages of the World: It violates the most sacred and most venerable Laws: It ruins the Foundation of Authority, by [Page 62]destroying the Paternal, which is the most Ancient, the most Just, the most Venera­ble, and the ground of all other: Proba­bly, Sir, you have seen the Memoires and Petition we presented to the King on this Subject: The many injustices of that De­claration are so fully made out by the Pe­tition I mention'd, I will forbear enlarging on them here: They are Injustices that fly in our Faces: Can we be silent where nature speaks? Is there a greater cruelty than to rob Parents of their Children? 'Tis a mutilation that puts us to ineffable Torment: 'Tis an usage unthought of in the Age of Torture and Massacre: And will you say still, we have no cause to complain? we are not put to extremities? You may believe, Sir, that in taking away our Children they tear our very Bowels: And that the Punishments we formerly endur'd, are nothing to this: The Con­sequences of it you will see surprizing and horrible: The tenderness of Mothers, the Sentiments of Religion, and the Fury of Anger, mixt together are a Compound, capable to produce terrible Effects. I fear you may see examples of Fury equal to those of the Jewish Women, who finding their Children were to be forc'd from them to be baptiz'd, destroy'd both the Children [Page 63]and themselves to prevent it. 'Tis a new kind of Torment will dispeople France more than all the Massacres of the last Age: For all those among us who love their Religion, will certainly endeavour to save themselves by retiring out of the Kingdom, though it were sure they should perish in the Attempt: Good God! What a spectacle will it be to see the Children violently taken away from their Parents! What Cannibal heart can be hard enough to endure the sight of Mothers bath'd in Tears, cover'd with their own Blood, scratching their Faces, tearing their Hair, beating their Breasts, Sighing, and Groan­ing, and making hideous outcryes after those who rob them of their Children, calling them Hangmen, Robbers, Villains, and other opprobrious Names, dictated by extremity of Fury raging in the tender Soul of a Mother.

I cannot deny, but the Catholicks themselves were surpriz'd at this Declara­tion, and that it hath in it something re­pugnant to the Laws of Nature: But great designs, how just soever, cannot be execu­ted without using some unjust means: The wisest Politicians are often oblig'd to do some ill that the may attain a greater good. The King hath a mind to have [Page 64]all his Subjects reunited in one Religion. The design is excellent, but cannot be compass'd without use of violent means.

Pray, Sir, tell me, Had not the Christian Emperors a design to have their Subjects all of a Religion? Did not they wish Paganism destroy'd? This sure was as excellent a design as the ruining of Calvinism: But did they take the like Course to attain the design? Before and in the Reign of Theodosius the Great, the Empire had embrac'd Christianity almost an Age. The Provinces, the Cities, the Armies, Rome it self was full of Christians: Yet the Senate of Rome was almost all Pagan, and by the Mouth of Symmachus pleaded be­fore the Emperor, to disswade him from demolishing the Altar of Victory that stood at the Gate of the Senate-house. Yet these Senators were not turn'd out, nor did any lose his Office for being a Pagan. Sym­machus, as zealous as he was for Paganism, received from Theodosius the honour of the Consulship, the highest Office of the Empire: We do not read that the Children of Pa­gans were taken from them in those days, or had Liberty given them at seven years old to turn Christians against the will of their Parents: The Piety of the Theodosij and the Constantines never mov'd them to [Page 65]act in favour of the true Religion such a violence against nature: They did not in that Age understand it lawful to do ill, that good might come of it: The Impiety and Fury of the Persecutors of the Church ne­ver suggested such a thought: The Coun­cellors of that Apostate Emperor who went so dextrously about destroying the Chri­stian Religion, were but bunglers to our Clergymen of the Councel of Conscience, who surprize in a manner so ruinous to us, the greatest Prince of the World. Julian destroy'd the Schools of the Christians, and shut up their Churches, but it never entred his thoughts, to take away their Children at seven years old to be brought up in Pa­ganism: Every rational man holds it a Max­im, that Religion is not to be impos'd by Command, but taught by perswasion. You have read the Book of Father Nicolai the Jacopin, intituled, De Baptismi antiquo usu Dissertatio duplex: In the second Disserta­tion he tells us, some Schoolmen hold, that Jews and Infidels may be compell'd to be baptiz'd. But 'tis hellish Divinity, a Max­im of Executioners and Inquisitors: These sottish Divines ground their Doctrine on some Examples, as that of Chilperic, who commanded the Jews to get themselves baptiz'd, and imprison'd one of them to [Page 66]compel him thereto, as Gregory of Tours reports. Aimoyn writes, that Dagobert oblig'd them to it upon pain of Banish­ment: The Capitulars of Charlemain tell us, that Prince punish'd with death the Saxons who refus'd to turn Christians: But Father Nicolai makes it appear, Conc. Tolet. 4. Can. 57. de Judaeis, Ann. Christi. 633. these were par­ticular actions never ap­prov'd by the Church. He quotes the Councel of Toledo, which disapprov'd the Violence us'd by Sisebut in Spain against the Jews, in obliging them to be baptiz'd on pain of Whipping and Banishment. He shews further, that the Penalties or­dain'd against Jews and Infidels, were not so much to force them to turn Christians, as to punish them for Crimes otherwise committed: At last he proves, there is not in the Primitive Church any president for this Practise of compelling Jews or Infidels into Christianity. Much less may you find an Example of the new kind of Cruelty exercis'd against us: If you meet with some Ordinances that command Infidels to turn Christians, yet you will never find any Christian Prince made a Law for taking from Jews and Infidels their Children, and hindring them to be instructed in their Re­ligion.

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Yet, Sir, if I mistake not, I have read in the Memoires and Petition you mention'd, that a King of Portugal, call'd Emmanuel, order'd all Male Children of Jews under fourteen years of Age to be taken from them, and instructed in the Christian Religion.

'Tis true, but you are to ob­serve, the Example is single, that it is mo­dern, being a President but of the last Age, when the Church was very corrupt, and that it proceeds from the infernal source of the Spanish and Portuguess Inquisitions. In a word, he that reports it, though a Bi­shop, had not the power to forbear saying it was a Jewish Course and unjust in the Execution, that it had not any foundation of Law or of Religion, though it seem'd to proceed from a good intention, and had an appearance of Piety. 'Tis Ozorius Bishop of Algarves, who wrote a great Volume in twelve Books of the Life of Emmanuel, the second King of Portugal. The Story is so pat, and the Reflexions of this Bishop so proper for the present Con­juncture, I cannot forbear reading to you a Translation I made yesterday of the whole passage, though somewhat long. This Historian having repeated at large [Page 68]the reasons of those who were for permit­ting the Jews to live pea­ceably in Portugal, Ozorius lib. 1. rerum Emmanualis. Anno. 1497. and the contrary Arguments, goes on thus. ‘ Emmanuel ap­proving the latter Opinion, order'd all Jews and Moors who would not embrace Christianity to quit the Kingdom, and appointed a day, after which those who should be found within the Realm, should be made Slaves, &c. The day drew near: The Jews with great diligence prepar'd for Embarquing: Emmanuel troubled to see so many thousands persist obsti­nate to Damnation, that he might at least be instrumental for the Salvation of their Children, bethought himself of a Course good in the Intention, but unjust in the Execution. He order'd all the Jews Children of fourteen years and un­der, to be taken from their Parents, and secur'd at a distance to be brought up in the Christian Religion: This could not be done without terrible agitation and trouble of mens minds: 'Twas a horri­ble spectacle to see Children forc'd out of the Bosoms of their Mother, and wrench'd out of their Fathers Arms in which they were lock'd. The Parents were ill us'd and cudgell'd to make them [Page 69]let go their hold. Every place eccho'd lamentable Cryes, the Women complain­ing so loud, their Voices reach'd Hea­ven. Many of the miserable Fathers were so mov'd at the atrocity of the Action, they flung their Children into Wells. Others were so desperately enrag'd, they kill'd themselves: To add more Calami­ty to this miserable Nation, they were deny'd leave to pass into Africk: For the King very desirous to bring them to Chri­stianity, thought to induce them to it, partly by hope of Good, partly by fear of Ill: so that, though he stood engag'd by his word to permit the Jews to em­barque, he put them off from day to day, in hopes, time would make them change their Resolution and Religion: This was the Reason, that though at first there were three Ports in Portugal ap­pointed them to embarqueat, they were afterwards prohibited to embarque at any but Lisbon. This brought into that City an innumerable multitude of Jews: While they were shamm'd in this man­ner in the business of Embarqueing, the day came, on which all that should be found in Portugal and would not turn Christians, were by the Order to remain Salves. The Ports were shut, so that a [Page 70]great number remain'd, who chose rather to change their Religion (sincerely or feignedly) than to be all their Life sub­ject to slavery: They turn'd Christians and were baptiz'd: After which they had their Liberty, and their Children re­stor'd, and spent the rest of their days very quietly in Portugal: This Action was not agreeable to the Maxims, either of Religion or Law. For with what justice will you endeavour to force mens spirits to receive Mysteries they slight, and have a perfect Aversion for? You would fetter mens understandings, and rob their Wills of their Liberty. 'Tis impossible to be done, nor does our Sa­viour approve of it. He requires a vo­luntary Sacrifice, and will not accept of forc'd Service: It is not his pleasure that Violence should be done to mens under­standings, but that their Souls may be fairly inclin'd, and their Wills won to a love of his Religion: To proceed in this manner, is to encroach on the right of the holy Spirit, and attempt that by hu­mane Power, which Grace alone is ca­pable to work in mens Souls, which yield at last to his holy Inspirations: 'Tis only the holy Ghost can illuminate mens Understandings, and invite and per­swade [Page 71]them into a Confession of the Name of Jesus, and into the Communi­on of Saints, when we reject not his Grace with obstinate ingratitude: To conclude, can any thing be more mani­festly opposite to the Spirit of Christia­nity, than to expose so many and so Ve­nerable Mysteries, things so truly holy and divine, to men under suspition, and evidently prophane? We never consider, how we force those who hate in their Souls the Christian Religion, to commit the highest Crimes they possibly can a­gainst Jesus Christ.’

It cannot be denyed, but these Refle­ctions are sage and judicious. 'Tis the Light of Reason breaking out of the midst of Darkness: 'Tis good sence flowing from its proper Spring, express'd by the mouth of a Portuguess Bishop living in a Coun­trey, groaning under the Tyranny of a severe Inquisition. Can you believe, this Portuguess Bishop could have approv'd of the last Declaration, that gives way to the seducing of a Child by a Bartholomew Baby, and then taking him away out of the Arms of his Mother? It makes me groan to think this Declaration may reach to Constantino­ple. I cannot but fear the President may be fatal to the poor Christians in the East, [Page 72]and that the Turk will tread the steps of the Council of Conscience at Paris: What a Desolation will follow, if the Infidel Princes will seize the Children of the Chri­stians? Will not Christianity by this means be quickly destroy'd throughout their Do­minions? The Turk exacts a Tribute of Children from Greece, which that poor Na­tion thinks an intollerable slavery: But what will it be, if the like be practis'd in all Mahometan Empires, and not one Chri­stian Child secure in their Countreys? Whereas now, when one is taken out of the Family for tribute, they remain assur'd of the Possession of the rest.

Among all the Reasons in the Petition against this Declaration, none affected me more, than that which shews, that Children of seven years of Age were never by any Law in any Age of the World, made subject to Orders of Courts, and Formalities of Justice: But if you com­pare the Declaration against the Relapsed, with that which concerns the Children, you will meet with Children of seven years old, who, having been regain'd by their Pa­rents, shall be Imprison'd, Examin'd on in­terrogatories, Confronted with Witnesses, and Condemned to make honourable a­mends by walking bare-headed, and bare­foot [Page 73]through the Streets, with a burning Link in their hands to the seat of Justice, and asking pardon for their Crime. 'Tis a spectacle all Europe will rejoyce at for the Novelty: As for the Reasons in the Peti­tion grounded on his Majesties Word and Arrests, which had appointed the choice of Religion to be made at the Age of fourteen, they are now silly Arguments: True it is, they might have pass'd for good in the Golden Age, but in ours, Men glo­ry in the breach of their Promises, and value themselves upon not keeping their words.

Gentlemen, I confess, what you speak of is a little severe, but you do not consider whom it concerns.

Sir, It concerns not his Ma­jesty, as you think. We know the Kings intentions are good, and that he sees not the Consequences of what they Act in his Name. But you will allow us to complain of those who surprize his Piety, and of a Clergy who would incroach into their hands the principal management of the State: We see clearly their false Zeal will ruine us, but it will also reduce the King­dom to extremitys. When Princes frame their Conduct by the Maxims of Monks and Jesuits, they ruine their States: Wit­ness [Page 74]the Affairs of Hungary: The Emperor possess'd by those false Zealots, took from the Protestants all their Estates, and gave them to the Jesuits. He hath banish'd their Ministers, demolish'd their Churches, and expell'd them the Kingdom. Can you choose but admire this excellent policy of the Jesuits? At the very doors of the Turk they reduce Christians to such extremity, they have no way of safety, but to throw themselves into the Arms of Infidels. And now, that the Grand Seignior is at peace with Muscovy and Poland, you will see how he will imploy his Forces, and what will be the Consequence of the Counsels of the blessed Fathers of the Society of Jesus: They are at this day Masters of Eu­rope, they govern all Princes, and are ab­solute in all Courts: But it may be ob­serv'd, that Europe hath reason to look on this day, as the Eve of her Destruction. Germany will perhaps be a Prey to the Turk, England a Theater of Fury, and France with all the puissance of the Geni­us that governs it, may fall into a condi­tion I dread to imagine; for if they Arm the hand of our Soveraign against us, and perswade him to spill the Blood of his Sub­jects, the State must be weakned, by having drawn from it the most faithful and truest French Blood in its Veins.

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I am a Catholick, but none of those who are for Monks and Clergymens inter­medling in Civil Affairs: Their business is to pray to God for the prosperity of the Kingdom; 'tis certain, that matters are but very little mended since these good men wriggled themselves so deeply into Courts.

But do you not admire, Sir, the boldness of the Jesuits, and the use they make of it at Court by the man they have there at his Majesties Elbow? They were banish'd France by Arrest of the Parlia­ment of Paris, being clearly convinc'd, they had by the hands of John Chatell at­tempted to murder Henry the 4th. This Prince fearing a stab from them, call'd them in again by an Edict in January 1604. One Clause of the Edict was, They should be oblig'd to keep one of their Society, a French- man Born and sufficiently Autho­riz'd, to attend the King, to serve him for a Preacher, and to be answerable for the Actions of the Society, that is, That there should always be a Jesuit attending at Court, as an evidence that all those of his Society were look'd upon as disturbers of the publick Peace, as Murderers of Kings, and Enemies of the State, one of whose Chiefs the Court would have always in its [Page 76]Power, that he might be responsible for the attempts of his Fellows, and remain as an Hostage to receive such Punishments as the Criminal enterprizes of his Society should deserve: This is the natural Chara­cter which from Father Cotton to Father Le Chaise ought to be given, according to the intention of the Edict, of all the Jesu­its that follow the Court. A Character that ought to make them asham'd, and keep them continually humble: Instead of which, they are become Masters of the Consciences of our Kings, the Tyrants of the Church, and, we may say, of all France: This gave occasion to Monsieur de Mezeray, to make this judicious Re­mark, That this Condition an­nex'd to the Edict, Tom. 6. Hen. 4. An. 1604. instead of branding them, as they ima­gin'd who got it inserted, procur'd them the greatest Honour they could desire. Philip of Macedon was awak'd every Morning by a Page, who told him, Remember you are a man: I wish our cruel Enemy were awak'd every Morning with these words: Remem­ber you are here to be answerable for the Do­ctrine and Actions of those, who teach, that Kings may be assassinated when disobedient to the Pope, and inspir'd these detestable Senti­ments into John Chatel, and Clement and [Page 77]Ravaillac, and William Parry, Robert Ca­tesby, Thomas Percy, and other Murtherers of our Kings, the Kings of England, and the Princes of Orange in the last Age and this.

I see you are no Friend of that good Father, and it must be confess'd he is not much yours.

We find by experience, he is not much our Friend: And, (the more unhappy we) he hath as much Credit with the King, as Hatred for our Party. It seems the King cannot refuse him any thing. Was any thing ever seen more ter­rible, than the Arrest he had obtain'd, where­by our Ministers and Elders were prohibi­ted on pain of Corporal Punishment, to go into any House, by night or by day on any occasion, but to visit the sick: By this Arrest as soon as a man was an Elder, he was excluded from the Company of all those of his Religion. His Majesty look'd on this as so strange a surprize, that he thought fit by another Arrest to explain this, and declare it was not his intention to hinder the Ministers and Elders to visit their Flocks. I will give you another in­stance how this man abuses his Credit: The King upon the Complaint of his Subjects of the Religion of divers Violences, burning [Page 78]of Churches, and other Outrages done them, pass'd an Arrest in May 1681. Pro­hibiting any Violence by Word or Action, to be done to the Reformed. A poor Mi­nister of Poitou, in one of his Sermons, gave God thanks for having inspir'd the King with this Equity and Clemency: Fa­ther Le Chaise had news of it by Letter, and presently obtain'd another Arrest, which orders those to be inform'd against, who (in their Interpretations of this Ar­rest) should say, That the Exhortations made in the Kings name to the People to change their Religion, are not accord­ing to his intention: You are to observe, Sir, that the Exhortations made in the Kings Name in Poitou, are no other than strange Menaces, and extraordinary Out­rages. And to prevent their being stopp'd by his Majesties Arrest, the Sieur de Maril­lac, and Father le Chaise thought fit to an­nul it by another Arrest, which will give way to all the Exorbitances his Majesty design'd to hinder by this.

It hath been observ'd, there hath been for some months past, an extraordi­nary Emotion amongst you: What's the Reason of it?

The Reason Sir? 'Tis be­cause we see things hurryed on faster than [Page 79]we imagin'd: To tell you the truth, we have been long sensible of a Design laid to ruine us; but fancy'd, they would not have gone so roundly to work with us: We lull'd our selves asleep, in hopes the Affairs of the State might occasion a change in ours. But ever since last Summer, we look'd upon our selves to be very near Destruction. The suppressing our Col­ledges and Academies, convinces us effectu­ally, we have not long to continue in the Kingdom; for if the King were willing we should stay, he would allow us our Mini­sters, and permit us to enjoy places ne­cessary for Instruction.

Now you mind me of it, have you seen the Arrest against the Aca­demy of Sedan? if you have, you can­not but think them out of their Wits who draw those Arrests, making one of the wisest Princes of the World speak so ridi­culously: They make the King say, he had granted the Hugonots of Sedan an A­cademy for instruction of their Children, and that they had abus'd his Grant, by receiving strangers into their Academy: Have you ever seen an Academy strangers were deny'd access to? I admir'd at the confidence of these Penners of Arrests in publishing falsities so gross. I was wishing [Page 80]to see the Edict of Reunion of the Princi­pality of Sedan to the Crown: I find it repeated there five or six times, that the King Confirm'd to them their Academy with all Rights and Priviledges they en­joy'd under their Princes: Is not the King Master of it? Is not his Pleasure reason e­nough? Why then are such notorious fal­shoods impos'd on the World?

I was more astonish'd at the Declaration, that gives all Hugonots who will turn Catholicks, three years respit for payment of their Debts: It will be easily granted, they have not in this been very tender of the Honour of the King, or of their Religion: Can any thing be more shameful, than to invite People to Con­version by turning Bankrupts, and solicit them to turn Bankrupts, by promising, that the Catholick Religion shall serve for a Sanctuary to protect them in their Cheats? There is not a dishonest Trades­man in France, who having three years respit, cannot in that time make over his Estate, abscond or run away a little before the three years are expir'd, and cheat all his Creditors: This open's a gap to all those frauds that destroy Commerce, and lay Families desolate: These are the Nets the Fisher of the Gospel casts into the Sea, [Page 81]to catch men for Jesus Christ. But I re­turn to the Gentlemans Question, who ask'd, whence proceeded that strange fright we appear to be in for some months past? Besides the suppression of our Aca­demies; Besides the Declaration that gives Children liberty at seven years of Age to change their Religion, we know it too well, that those Bigots press'd for four or five more, and hop'd to obtain them before the end of the year. One to force us to kneel before the Host: Another to for­bid us using any Trade or Mystery: A third to oblige us to permit our Children to be baptiz'd, and our Marriages bless'd by the Priests, under pretence of acknow­ledging your Baptism and Marriages effe­ctual: This is the fatal Blow, the total Revocation of the Edicts of Pacification: This Alarm was spread all over France. The Protestants thought themselves at their last Prayers: Every one considered how to get away. They were all upon the Wing, and are ready to depart as soon as the Blow is given.

The Declaration which gives Children liberty at seven years of Age to choose their Religion, hath made the King lose in three months time above fifty thousand Subjects: A Declaration that shall [Page 82]forbid us the exercise of Trades and Myste­rier, will empty the Kingdom of near a Million, and one that shall impose on us a necessity to kneel before the Host, will send all the rest packing: And so the State will be soon rid of the Hugonots: Whether this be suitable to the Kings intentions, I know not, but know very well 'tis not for his interest: If we had not the courage vo­luntarily to leave our Country, a Declara­tion that shall force us to kneel before the Sacrament, will make us abandon all. And it shall be in the power of a Priest, to make all the Reformed in his Parish run away. You know what happen'd at St. Hippolite: The like will be done every where else.

I do not very well know that story, but have heard something of it.

I am not exactly acquainted with the Circumstances; the Substance is this. St. Hippolyte is the capital Town of Cevennes, inhabited wholly by People of our Religion: Those of yours being so few there, that the Priest in his Pulpit cannot sometimes without a solicism address in the usual Phrase, my Brethren: The Clergy re­solv'd to ruine this Church of the Reform­ed: The Priest took the Sacrament to be carryed to a sick Person, in the very mo­ment [Page 83]that the Reformed were coming out of their Church on a day of Devotion: He rushes into the midst of the Croud, lays hold on the first he met, and forces him to kneel; the rest slip away, some on one side, some on the other: The Priest continues bawling, and requires them to kneel. He stays as many as he can, to hin­der their escape; and strikes some with the Cross he had in the other hand: This at last procur'd him some blows, and it was the thing he desir'd: He informs, and (it being a business concerted) had his Wit­nesses ready. Upon these Informations, the Court orders the Church of St. Hippo­lyte to be rac'd, never to be rebuilt; and to weaken the Party, banish'd twenty or five and twenty of the most considerable Families of the Town: That which is re­markable, is, that the Priests who rais'd this Sedition, is, as I am told, expell'd the Town. By this it is acknowledged, he was the first Author of the disorder: Yet the Reformed are punish'd, as if they alone were guilty. I have not met with so rigorous a punish­ment for such an Offence: When the Ar­rest for adoring the Sacrament shall be past, the like will happen in all other pla­ces, as did at St. Hippolyte. You will hear of nothing but Outrages, and Blood shed, [Page 84]and Imprisonments, and Proscriptions and Punishments: A forc'd adoration of the Sa­crament hath not any precedent in Christi­anity. 'Twas the Pagan only would have compell'd the Christian to adore what he did not believe to be God. This is to usurp a Power over Conscience, to require us formally to abjure our Religion, and to exercise the cruellest of Tyrannies over men. 'Tis making them Idolaters, Pro­fane and Hypocritical all at a time: Idola­ters, by forcing them to adore what they esteem not to be God. Profane, in kneel­ing by way of Adoration, to that which in their hearts they despise and scoff at: Hypocrites, in worshipping outwardly, what they do not inwardly: In a word, it justifies all the Violences of the Infidels against the Christians. A great Minister said not long since to one of our Party, who told him of this Arrest we were threat­ned with; does it not become the Piety of the King, to cause all his Subjects to adore the God he adores? A Turk may use the same Argument in Turk [...], And would not such a proceeding utterly extirpate the poor s [...]atter'd Churches, that groan in the East under the power of the Infidels? We see we are within an inch of destruction. The wisest course, in my opinion, will be [Page 85]to withdraw before the Blow is given: What think you, Sir, will all this come to? What are we to hope? What are we to fear?

To deal freely with you, I believe you have not long to subsist; there is a settled design for extirpating your Religi­on: All the Edicts in your favour will be in a short time revok'd. Some of you will leave the Kingdom, and the King will not be much concerned at it: The rest will stay, and return into the Bosom of the Church in few years: You see what Pro­gress hath been made in Poitou in few months: Fifteen or twenty thousand Per­sons are already converted. And when the Edicts are all revok'd, there is no doubt, but the business will be perfected with grea­ter Expedition.

Ah, Sir, Methinks you might have spar'd speaking of your Converts of Poitou! The Subject is matter of Terror to our Religion, and of small Credit to yours. If you design to have the Hugo­nots converted, as they were in that Pro­vince, 'tis no other than composing a Church of Rogues and Villains, and revi­ving in our days the age of Persecution: In a word, never were so much baseness and cruelty mix'd in one Action as in the [Page 86]Practise made use of for those numerous Conversions.

That, Sir, if you please, shall be my task: You will not deny me the pleasure of telling a story, which probably I know better than you: I have Friends in Poitou who inform me of all, and am well acquainted with the Deputies of the Province. I believe I know some Circum­stances you may be ignorant of.

I shall most willingly give you the hearing, Sir, if these Gentlemen will do so too.

First then, you are to know, that the Publisher of the Gazetts swells extremely the number of these Converts: If you account them half or two thirds of what the Gazett speaks, you may per­haps account them more numerous than they are. But the falseness of the Calcula­tion is not the thing I intend principally to insist on: I confess the number of the Revolted is prodigious, and that so many Persons have in so short a time chang'd their Religion, without Instruction, with­out Preaching, without Disputes, with­out knowing why is perhaps a thing not to be parallell'd in any Age. But that you may cease admiring at it, I must acquaint you with the whole matter: First you are [Page 87]to know, that the Province of Poitou is the heaviest charg'd with Taxes of any in the Kingdom, and consequently the poor­est: Nothing can be poorer than the Pea­sants there. I need not tell you, that mean­ness of Condition abases the Spirits, and takes away mens Courage, it dulls their Wit, puts out the very light of their Un­derstanding, and makes men degenerate almost into Beasts. For ten years last past, effectual Orders have been given, that the Peasants living at distance from considera­ble Towns, should not be instructed; their Churches have been rac'd, and their Mi­nisters taken away. Ignorance joyn'd with the extreme Misery of their Condition, and Slavery hath made them Brutish, and capable not only of meanest thoughts, but the most base Actions: The Intendant Marillac, a Person who had not thriven very well in the World, applyes himself to the Bigots, the Jesuits and their Patriarch, Father La Chaise, for repairing his broken Fortune. This man according to the Or­ders of those he had sold himself to, began at first with the lesser Temptations: That is, he walk'd through the Province with his Purse in one hand, and his Sword in the other. But at last, the Myrmidons he had pick'd out for his assistants with some piti­ful [Page 88]Priests, pass'd from Village to Village entring every House, beginning with Threats, and ending with Promises. They told the poor Wretches, the King would have but one Religion in his Kingdom, that whoever refus'd to turn Catholick, should be us'd with the utmost Severity and Rigor: But those who would change their Religion, should be well paid and live at their ease. Accordingly they fall a bargain­ing with those rascally Wretches; some valued themselves higher than others: One among the rest held out stoutly several days for ten Groats; they offer'd him a Pistol, he stood out stifly, and would not bate them a Farthing of four Crowns: At last they gave him his price: This shameful Trade was driven in so scanda­lous a manner, that these Convertors had provided a multitude of Printed Acquit­tances, with Blanks for the Names and the Sums; which Blanks were fill'd with the Names of the new Converts and the Sums they receiv'd, in order to the giving an account to the Treasurers of the Chamber of Accounts of the Conversion, whereof the Sieur Pelision is President: These Sums amounted not to much, for some of the Converts had not above sevenpence wrapt up in a piece of Paper. But for recom­pence, [Page 89]immediately after their Conversion, they were discharg'd of Taxes, and freed from Quartering Souldiers, and all publick Payments: On this Rock split a great num­ber of those Wretches, who fear'd the sight of the Collectors of Taxes, as of so many Devils, and look'd upon the Priviledge of exemption from payments as their Sove­raign Good, and chiefest Felicity: You may hear the account the Gazett gives, how those Conversions were made: I have in my Pocket that of the 25th. of April 1681. 'Tis in the Article of Poitiers: ‘The Sieur Marillac, Intendant of this Province, applying himself continually with a great deal of Zeal to the work of Conversion, arriv'd the 28th. of the last month at St. Sauvan, with the Sieur Rabreüil, Vicar-General to our Bishop. He receiv'd there advice of importance concerning those of the Religion, and went away the 20th. from St. Sauvan, to hasten to the place from whence he had the News: He receiv'd there the abjuration of an incre­dible number of Persons. Afterwards they return'd to Poitiers, and the Bishop much affected with the fruit of this Voy­age, sent Missionaries into those parts to instruct the New Converts.’

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Perhaps, Gentlemen, you observe not how new this Method of Con­version is: I assure my self in all your rea­ding, Sir, you have scarce met with any such Convertors. Our Saviour understood not this way of Conversion: For had he known what belongs to it, instead of his twelve Apostles and seventy Disciples, he would have sent so many Intendants, such as the Sieur Marillac: All the World would have been Christian: To trouble our selves with Preaching to the Peasants, that's filly piece of business: Shew them Money in one hand and a Cudgel in the other, you make them Saints in a quarter of an hour; and shall convert more in a month, than St. Paul with his Preaching ever did in twelve. Heretofore in those simple Ages of Primitive Christianity, men made it their business to instruct before Conversion, to make them know and believe before they made Profession, and often Catechis'd them several years before they were admitted to the Mysteries of Religion: But the Ga­zettier tells us, Monsieur Marillac under­stands better the Mystery of Conversion; he knows how to convert numbers in a trice, and afterwards sends Missionaries to instruct them.

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Pray, Sir, Let us not make it a Subject of Mirth; those of our Party have no cause to laugh at it, but to shed Tears, and Tears of Blood: Monsieur Ma­rillac hath no been always so careful as the Gazettier tells us. I know from good hands, those wretched Converts who have been made to abjure their Religion, have not been at all instructed: A Gentleman of Quality, a Roman-Catholick, assur'd me the other day with an Oath, that being at the Intendants, he saw there about two hundred Peasants, who were come purpose­ly to complain they knew not what Pray­ers to make, for they had been forbidden to say their old Prayers, and not taught any other; so that since they had been compell'd to be Catholicks, they had no Religion at all: The bishop of Poitiers one day in good Company rally'd these Conversions, calling those new Catholicks Monsieur Marillac's Converts: But this is not all.

The Intendant Marillac having tasted the sweet of these Conversions, and find­ing Promises and Threats ineffectual to bring about as many as he desir'd, resolv'd to make use of more violent Means: He and his Agents had quickly scumm'd off (out of our Society) those base Souls who [Page 92]had no Sentiment of Religion, and were capable of selling their Consciences to him that bid most. The number of these Wretches was not sufficient to satisfie the eagerness of this Converter. He caus'd Troops to come to Poitou, and Quarter'd them upon those of the Religion only, and gave them Order to commit the worst of Outrages, till they had forc'd their Hosts to go to Mass. He sends Advice to the Inhabitants of a Burrough or Village, that within such a time they were to change their Religion, or to receive a Garrison: The Soldiers he Quarter'd liv'd at discreti­on, being Masters of every House they en­ter'd: Masters, Horses and Grooms must all be maintain'd as they please: Besides this, great Contributions must be every day paid; to one, two Crowns, to another, four, to another eight: And to prevent being charg'd any more with converting People, without having instructed them, a Capucin or two are plac'd in Garrison with the Souldiers, and the Inhabitants as­sess'd at three Crowns a day for their Maintenance: And because these Monks by the Rules of their Order are not to fin­ger any Money, the Souldiers receive it for them, and give them an account: Here then is a Garrison compos'd in a very sin­gular [Page 93]manner of Souldiers and Capucins: But these unusual means are but suitable to that extraordinary end they are de­sign'd for; that the People may not any way dispose of their Goods, the Intendant hath publish'd an Order, wherein he for­bids them, on pain of forfeiting four hun­dred Livers, to remove any thing out of their Houses: And that they might not by absenting from their Houses escape the Cruelties design'd to be exercis'd there, he hath on like Penalty forbidden them to ab­sent when the Souldiers come in. You may believe, the moveables of a rich Pea­sant cannot hold out long to bear such a Charge: When the Moveables are eat up, the Souldiers proceed to Sale of the Land, under pretence, the owner hath trans­gress'd the Orders: Poverty is a great Temp­tation and you cannot wonder many weak Souls yield to it: Yes, these poor Wretches would think themselves happy, could they come off with the loss of their Goods. All manner of Outrages are com­mitted against their Persons. The Horse­men commonly enter the Burroughs with their Musquetoons in hand crying aloud, Now for the Hugonots, now for the Calvi­nists: They have at the But of their Mus­quetoons a little woodden Cross, which by [Page 94]force or surprize they make the People kiss; and having told those that have kiss'd it, that they are become Catholicks, they presently drag them away to Church: As soon as they enter a House, they make it ring again with execrable blasphemies and terrible Oaths, threatning all the mischiefs they design to do, if they of the House go not immediately to Mass. And they are as good as their words; for they take the Master of the House and burn the soles of his feet with a gentle fire. They torture others with Vices and other Instruments to screw in their Thumbs: They have hang'd up some Women at the Rafters: Some have escap'd death by their Neighbours coming in and cutting the Ropes. They bind Men on Benches, and drub them on the Soles of their Feet, as the Algerines do their Slaves, and the Turks their Spahies. In a Village near Niort they took three Wo­men, bound them fast to Benches with their Faces upwards, and pour'd in Water at their Mouths; but they had the strength to resist this cruel Torture: If a Husband yield to any of these Tentations, his Wife must follow him whether she will or no: She is dragg'd to Church with her Hair a­bout her Ears, and sometimes carry'd thi­ther in a Swound: Others have been made [Page 95]lay their hands on a Book without know­ing what they did, and were afterwards told they had taken an Oath on the Evan­gelifts, that they would go to Mass: Others have been taken in Sheets, carry'd to Church, and sprinkled with holy-water. Whereupon 'tis pretended they are become Catholicks; and if after they go to hear a Sermon of our Ministers, they are, with­out course of Law, carryed to Prison, and starv'd there to death. The Intendant in other places hath not given himself this trouble. He hath thought it sufficient to send for the Inhabitants of a Burrough, and tell them. Children, go into the next Room, and give your Names to my Se­cretary. The good Folks do what they are bid, give in their Names and go their ways: The List is sent to the Curate of the Parish, with Order to receive the Abjura­tions of all those whose Names he finds there: If afterwards these People say, they made not any Promise, they are cruelly bastonadoed, and frequently to death. I dare not engage further, in giving you the particulars of the Cruelties exercis'd by the Intendant and his Myrmidons, by the Souldiers and Judges of the Places, for fear, of making too long a digression.

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You may do very well, Sir, to particularize a little, and give us the Names of the Places and some of the Per­sons concern'd; these Circumstances would not a little confirm the truth of the Relati­on.

If these Gentlemen please, I will relate part of what I know, and will be as brief as I can. In the Burrough of Aulnay in Poitou, the Intendants Deputy caus'd a Child of fourteen years to be ar­rested and imprisoned to make him change his Religion. In the same place Huchard, one of the Intendants Assistants, and prin­cipal Instrument of his Violences, accom­panied with a Serjeant and a Fryer, arre­sted and imprison'd a Widdow called Je­anne Micheau, on no other account, but to make her change her Religion, being a Woman of the Age of threescore and twelve. Two days after the Intendant came in Person, caus'd the poor Woman to be brought before him, and having so­licited her very powerfully to change her Religion, he remanded her to Prison be­cause she persever'd, and ordered her to be put into a Dungeon, where her own Children could not speak to her. He sub­orn'd Witnesses to charge her with a false Crime, and condemn'd her upon the De­position [Page 97]of those false Witneses, though neither cross examin'd nor confronted. Ac the same time he caus'd a Woman big with Child to be imprison'd, who was forc'd to change her Religion to save her Child, in evident danger to be lost by her miscarry­ing in that inconvenient and horrible place she was put in. He caus'd several others to be imprison'd for the same purpose, that is, to make them change their Religion; some yielded, others held out: At a place called fontain Chavagne, Marsaut Presi­dent of the Election of Niort attended with two men, would have the Credit of ma­king Convertsfter the Intendants method. He went into several Houses, particularly into Daniel Giraults; and without more ado, fell presently upon the Men and Wo­men cudgelling them lustily, led them out to Mass, and made them lay their hands on a Book to abjure their Religion: They made their Complaint to the Duke de Vi­euville Governor of the Province, who was so far from doing them Justice, that he gave them no Answer: The same Mar­saut hath frequently put his naked Sword to the Throats and Breasts of the Hugo­nots to make them change their Religion: And when he met with People in the Countrey, he made them declare what Re­ligion [Page 98]they were of, and if they said they were Hugonots, he caus'd them to be sound­ly beaten till they abjur'd their Religion. In a Borough where Horse-men had been quarter'd and exercis'd all the Cruelties I have mention'd, one of them surpriz'd a Woman, and without the least pity of an Infant sucking at her Breast, he trod her and the Child under foot, because she had resisted three Priests and two Horse-men who would have dragg'd her to Church. The Outrages committed by the Souldi­ers in the Parish of Echirê are incredible. A Lieutenant Reformade upon the refusal of one Abraham Bourdet to go to Mass, first broke his Cudgel in beating him, and then drew his Sword to run him through, which he had certainly done, had not fear (which gives men Wings) made the poor Men leap over a high Wall, so that he escap'd to the wonder of those who saw him. At Chal­lusson in the same Parish, the Souldiers having persecuted to extremity a poor Wi­dow call'd Mary Rambault, she thought to run away by night and save her self. A Souldier runs after her, takes her, and hav­ing bruis'd her grievously with his Cudgel, and butt-end of his Muskettoon, he took her by the Throat and would have strangled her, had not another Souldier less [Page 99]cruel than he, taken her out of his hands. Having not been able to kill her thus, he resolved to discharge his Musquettoon in her Body, but his Comrade having on the sudden mounted the muzzle of it, he miss'd his blow with that, he flew upon her, seiz'd her by the Hair, disfigur'd all her Face, and left her drown'd in her Blood and her Tears. The Cruelties exercis'd in the Pa­rish of Vouille are not less: That same Mar­saut President of the Election of Niort went into every House with the Curate and some Serjeants, and made those he met fall on their knees, and having laid their Hands on a Boo, they went their ways and report­ed to the Intendant, that those People had promis'd on the holy Evangelists to turn Catholicks, and the poor Wretches were forc'd to perform what they never promis'd, or be cast into a Dungeon. In the same Parish of Vouille, Men and Women were dragg'd above half a League to Church: 'Twas there they tortur'd two young Maids, and forc'd them to turn Catholicks. In the Parish of St. Christine, Huchard the Intendant of Poitou's Executioner with the Provost of Niorts Lieutenant, carryed a Woman Prisoner into the Castle of Benet. And having put Money into her Pocket, pretended she had received it for changing [Page 100]her Religion, though she protested the contrary. In Littiere a Village of Poitou, the Converting Souldiers having taken a Girl of fifteen years of age, to make her change her Religion; drew their Swords upon her, put them to her Throat, threat­ning to kill her if she would not go to Mass. The Maid refusing, the Souldiers took Fagots they found in the Court, and made a Fire to throw her in: The Father and another of his Children coming to re­scue Fer, the Souldiers threw them all three into the Fire, where their Cloaths were burnt, and their Skins scorch'd in several places, and they scarce scap'd alive out of the Flame. This poor Man's Name was La Gau, and he made his Complaint to the Consistory of Lusignan, where he left it under his Seal: Thus are Conversions made in the Province of Poitou. You are not to imagine I have told you the thousandth part of what hath been done there. I have confin'd my self to one instance of every sort of Punishment and Persecution inflicted on the miserable People there. For in all places of the Province, they have exercised almost the same Violences; the Contagion of this cruelty hath pass'd into Saintong, and the Countrey of Aunix, where the Sieur de Muin Intendant of Roche­fert [Page 101]hath committed the same Outrages and greater, suitable to his harsh and un­tractable nature, and the mortal Enmity he hath always profess'd against the Hugo­nots. So that observing the Connivence of the Court at all Marillac had done, he made no doubt of being countenanc'd and justi­fi'd in proceedings of like nature, and re­solving to out-do what had been acted in Poitou, he exercis'd Cruelties beyond Ima­gination. In the Burroughs of Mauzé, Surgeres, and all others about Rochelle, he dispers'd all the Congregations, interdicted the Ministers, rob'd their Houses, plun­dering and carrying away all their Goods, Burnt, Beat, Imprison'd or put to Flight all those who would not change their Re­ligion. Those who resisted these horrible Persecutions wereforc'd to save themselves in the Woods, and to live there on Grass like Beasts of the Field. The poor Coun­trey People, who by reason of their po­verty are destitute of help, were at first the most expos'd to these Violences. But now they spare not any, but without re­spect to Quality or Birth exercise the like Cruelty on all; I that speak to you have seen at Paris three men (who look'd like Gentlemen, and said they were of Quality) that swore their Persecutors had wound [Page 102]about their Necks Flax and Tow, to which they set fire, and let it burn till half stifled, half burnt they said they would go to Mass. A Lady of a considerable E­state and Family had in her House a Do­mestick, who had chang'd his Religion and turn'd Protestant above four and twen­ty years since: The Intendant of Roche­fort resolv'd to have this Man with his Wife and Children, to force them to re­turn to the Roman-Catholick Religion: He demanded him of the Lady, and sent the Grand Provost to have him away: All this would not do, the Lady stood out stiffly, and said, she would not deliver her Domestick, without special Order from the King: The Intendant mad to see his Course stop'd by a Woman, vow'd her ru­ine, and procur'd from Court Letters un­der the Signer with several Blanks, which he intended to fill up at his pleasure, for seizing the Lady and her Children, who, to escape his Violences, were all forc'd to run away hastily out of the Kingdom. If the Gentry give any relief to the poor per­secuted People of their Parishes, they are presently banish'd their Houses and prohibited coming near them. But that you may better comprehend how they use the Nobility. I must read you a [Page 103]Letter of a Gentleman of the Province of Poitou.

But to acquaint you with something yet more horrible, they begin to degrade those Gentlemen that refuse to turn Roman-Ca­tholicks, and strip them of all the privi­ledges of Nobility. There is in the Neigh­bourhood of Niort a considerable Family, which came off very well in all the actions [Page 112]brought for twenty years past against the Nobility, to shew by what Right they held the Priviledges and Exemptions they pretended to: This Family having obtain'd several Arrests in confirmation of their Nobility, and the Priviledges annex'd to it, the Informer thought fit to appeal from a Sentence of the Intendant, given in fa­vour of the Family. It was observ'd at the Council (to which the Appeal was made) that the Family was numerous, and had so many Branches, it fill'd the Coun­trey. This was look'd upon as a favour­able opportunity, to gain at once many considerable Persons to their Party. The Gentlemen were all solicited to turn Ca­tholicks, and promises made to some of them of full Companies in Service, besides Money and Favour. The eldest of the Family had the baseness to yield, and ob­tain'd an Arrest in these Terms. Having seen the Evidences and Abjuration of — made before Father la Chaise, we confirm him in his Nobility, and discharge him of all Taxes: And we allow a months time to the rest of the same Name and Family, to make the like Abjuration. After which time they shall be foreclos'd, &c. and made to pay the Taxes asses'd on them with all Charges. The proceedings of this Suit were all shew'd [Page 113]me by a Gentleman of two or three thou­sand Livers a year, who is now reduc'd to extremity, his Estate seiz'd, himself degra­ded, and depriv'd of the Priviledges of Nobility, because he abjur'd not his Reli­gion, as requir'd by the Arrest.

I will acquaint you with another very special sort of Persecution: The last year an Arrest pass'd, whereby the King pro­hibited the Catholicks to embrace the Pro­testant Religion, and forbad the Prote­stants to receive any Abjuration of the Catholicks, under pain of being interdi­cted the Ministry, and having the Church demolish'd, wherein any Catholick should have been receiv'd into the Profession of the Reformed Religion. At a place in Poitou called la Mott, a Servant Maid a Roman-Catholick, was perswaded by some Rascals, to go with the Protestants to re­ceive the Sacrament in their Church: The Intendant upon notice, sends for the Mini­ster and Elders, and tells them, that though it appear'd not, that Servant Maid had ab­jur'd, yet there could not be a more cer­tain sign she had been receiv'd amongst them, than that she had receiv'd the Sacra­ment with them. Hereupon he made a great noise, interdicted and expell'd the Minister, and threatned to have the Church [Page 114]pull'd down. And if such Courses be al­low'd, what Church can be safe? How easie a matter is it for the Curates, the Monks, and the Intendants to send Ras­cals to receive the Sacrament among us, without our being able to hinder them? They durst not for some time commit these horrible Outrages in the great Towns, where the Protestants were numerous, for fear of provoking them to some desperate Act: But now they resolve, all places shall fare alike: Niort, Chatellheraut, and Ro­chelle have already felt the effects of their Fury. There is not any kind of Outrage, but hath been, and is done to the Inhabi­tants of those Towns: They write from that Province, that there is not a Prote­stant left in Thoüars; and generally the Inhabitants of the Towns, as well as the Countrey, declare aloud, nothing but an absolute impossibility of getting out, shall stay them in the Kingdom. But such is their Cruelty, the Ports are guarded with all strictness imaginable: If any one embark, and they know it, presently they romage the Vessel, take him and imprison him: I have with me an Original Writing, of those poor Fugitives who were lately taken and imprison'd, which I will read to you.

I confess, this proceeding appears horri­ble to me, and that it puts me in mind of what Ozorius told us of the Condition of those miserable Jews, who had the Ports of Portugal shut against them, and were constrain'd to remain slaves in that Coun­trey. [Page 119]In the Age of Massacres, every one was at liberty to go out of the Kingdom. If this Course of retaining these persecuted Wretches be continued, there is cause to fear, they will break out at length into some desperate Action; that they will burn their Houses, and set fire on the Towns. The Resolution, I confess, is violent and furious, but Wretches in Extremity bid adieu to their Reason. What think you in your Conscience, is not this an open Persecution, and equal in Cruelty to that of past Ages? What difference will you make between the Raign of Charles the 9th. and Lewis the 14th. the greatest of our Kings?

If Matters be thus, why do you not complain? 'Tis very well known, the King loves not Violence: He will certainly do you Justice.

How, Sir, are you ignorant that we complain, but cannot be heard? Do not you know well enough, that the Province of Poitou had Deputies here, who represented to the World the lamentable Condition of the poor Hugonots there? In a word, Have you not seen the Petition they presented to the King? I have it here, and will read it to you.

If you have a mind to see other pieces as authentick as this, I will read you two Petitions; one intended to be presented to the King, the other presented to the Parliament of Guienne.

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Can you believe, Sir, If these things were Fables, men could have the impu­dence to present them to the King, and his Ministers, and his Soveraign Courts?

But what was the effect of all these Petitions?

The Effect, Sir? 'Twas this: Order was given to the Deputies of Poi­tou, to go out of Paris in four and twen­ty hours, and not to return: The Inten­dant writ from the Province, that all we informed at Court were Fables: He sent Horsemen with Pistol in hand, to force those who had chang'd their Religion, to give it under their Hands, they had done it voluntarily and unconstrain'd: This se­cond Violence more cruel than the first secures him against all: The Court is in­form'd of these Subscriptions, and call our Deputies Rascals and false Informers: Not but that the Court very well understands how Matters are carryed: They know ve­ry well, that the Intendants Guards and Retinue are not Preachers able enough to Convert such Multitudes by their Discour­ses: Miracles are ceas'd: And the King hath too clear a sense, to think such nu­merous Conversions are made Naturally, and without Violence: Whence should this new illumination come, I pray? Or [Page 131]why should it be peculiar to the Province of Poitou? Yet at Court they pretend not to believe a word we say, to the end they may give permission to all Practices against us, yet be able to say, if any Violence be acted, 'tis without Order of the Court: Since September last they have labour'd more than ever, to Publish it is not the Kings pleasure any Violence should be us'd. His Majesty hath had the goodness to say as much to several of his Gover­nors and Intendants: In the mean time, 'tis certain, that in the Provinces of San­tonge and Poitou, the Violences and Out­rages you have heard, are not only con­tinued, but increas'd. The Sieur Maril­lac finding himself authoriz'd by the con­nivence of the Court, hath tripled his Fu­ry. I will tell you a very true story, which will teach you what to believe of the mitigation so much talk'd of. Four Souldiers Quarter'd in one House, having sack'd and consum'd all the Goods in it, and committed all Violences imaginable, to make the Master of the House change his Religion, took his two Daughters, both grown and handsom, they lock them up with themselves in a Rom, and threa­ten if they resuse to turn Catholicks, they must suffer the greatest Extremities; and, [Page 132]to be as good as their words, they put them into a posture to receive the worst Outrage that can be done to a civil Wo­man: To prevent which, they chang'd their Religion. I know very well, his Majesty would be so far from Countenan­cing such an Action, that he would abhor it, if he knew it. Neither do I believe Monsieur Marillac so mad, as to Command such Brutality. But this lets you see what a loose hand is held over the Insolence of the Souldiers; to what point they extend the Permission granted them, to act what Violence they please, provided they oblige the Hugonots to change their Religion. In a word, you may judge from hence, what you are to believe of the Mitigation they tell you of: Ask me not again, Sir, as you did awhile, whence proceeds that terrible fright we are observ'd to be in for some time past: We see coming towards us that Scourge which now Afflicts Santonge and Poitou: We understand well enough, they will not open a Persecution in all places at once; this would make too great a noise: But when they have laid these two Provinces desolate, they will pass into a­nother: They scatter and lay wast all our Congregations in one end of the Kingdom, and in the other, tell us, we shall be dealt [Page 133]with better far than we imagine, that we are to blame to take the Alarm, and ought not to think of leaving the Kingdom: That is, that we are a File of Wretched men mark'd out for death; while those at the one end of the File are Hang'd or Shot to death, those at the other end are spoken fair to, and made drink, to amuse them, that they run not away, but may, when the rest are dispatch'd, be Hang'd as the others. They began with this poor Province of Poitou, because it is bounded on one side by the Sea, and on the other side borders on all the Provinces of France, so that the wretched Inhabitants have no way to escape out of the Kingdom. And it is certain, those who will permit them­selves to be surpriz'd, and neglect the op­portunity of getting into a place of safety, will one day dearly pay for their Impru­dence and Security.

Your Reflections have in­terrupted me in the Course of my story. I have many things more to acquaint you with, which will give you further Light into the Character of this Persecutor who Ravages Poitou. He spreads, and causes it to be spread abroad every where with inconceivable boldness, that 'tis the King's intention, there shall be but one Religion [Page 134]in his Kingdom. If any one chance to say any thing to the contrary, what Reli­gion soever he is of, he is punish'd for't. It happen'd, that three Roman-Catholicks said, the King had not declar'd himself as fully in this particular, as 'twas reported he had; they were all three Imprison'd for it. A Man of the Religion having taken an occasion to ra [...]ly these Conversions made for Money, and having said, the King was too wise to be at great expence to carry on an Action so base as that, of Bribing People out of their Religion, was Imprison'd and Condemn'd to go bare-head and bare-foot, with a lighted Torch in his hand through the Street, follow'd by the Executioner to the Court of Justice, to beg Pardon for his fault: But I have one thing more to tell you, by which you may better know what a Person he is I am speaking of: He went to Dinner at the Marquess of Verac's, a Gentleman of note in the Province. While they were at Dinner, the Intendant gave Order, the In­habitants of the place should assemble at the Cross: After Dinner he took his Coach, got up on the streps of the Cross, and said to the Peasants assembled, Chil­dren, you are to know, 'tis the King's inten­tion there shall be henceforth but one Religi­on [Page 135]in France: Turn Catholicks: Whoever does so, shall have cause upon all occasions to praise the King's Bounty: Those who refuse shall experience his Severity: To prove what I say, see here, your Lord the Marquess of Verac come along with me to change his Re­ligion: Whereupon the Marquess (who is a very honest man, and a very good Pro­testant) stepping up immediately to the same Cross, said to the Peasants: Children, The Intendant does but jest with you; The King has no design to revoke his Edicts: And it is not true that I am come along with him, or have any design to change my Reli­gion.

This is surprizing, and suf­ficient of it self, to make out the Character of the Man. I cannot tell, Sir, what you think of these Conversions of Poitou: But as for me, I confess, that assuming the Sen­timents of a reasonable Catholick, I could not forbear being of the Opinion of Ozor­jus Bishop of the Algarues. That nothing is more opposite to the Spirit of Christianity, than a Conduct of this Nature, that exposes so many Mysteries and holy things to men suspected and evidently prophane. Can you choose but tremble, Sir, to think that at this day in Poitou, thousands of those who are forc'd to go to Mass, and prostrate [Page 136]themselves before that which you call Our Lord, detest and look upon that as an Idol which they pretend to adore: When they are sick, they bring them the holy Oyl, and make them take the Sacrament after your manner: They obey with their bo­dies the Violence us'd, but they think ve­ry Prophanely of those things you esteem so Holy. 'Tis, in your Opinion, an en­ormous Crime these Wretches commit; yet 'tis your Zealous Catholicks are the Cause of these horrible Prophanations of your Mysteries: When Violence is us'd to force men to Lock up in the bottom of their Hearts their sentiments of Religion, it produces the effect of that Violent and inconsiderate Zeal of Emmanuel the second King of Portugal, who compell'd the Jews to turn Christians, as I told you: The Jews profess'd themselves Christians, but conti­nued Jews in their Hearts. Their Children inherited their Dissimulation and Religi­on. Hence it is, that half those Portu­guese, who, to avoid the Inquisition, are Christians in Portugal; no sooner set foot in Holland, but they are Jews: Those Hugonots who have been forc'd to turn Roman-Catholicks, will inspire into their Children their Religion, and the disquiet of their Spirit: These Sentiments will be [Page 137]transmitted from Generation to Generati­on, as a Seed of Rebellion, that will al­ways incline this People to shake off the Yoke impos'd on their Conscience, as Soon as they have opportunity. So that by the Course now taken, instead of gaining Ser­vants to God, you raise Enemies to the State. And I had reason to say, that by the Method now us'd for Conversion, you will make you a Church of Rogues and Villains, of Atheistical and Prophane Ras­cals, destitute both of Religion and Ho­nour: Conversion at this day is a Cloak to cover Debauches, and the most abominable Enormities: Let the most infamous of men profess himself a Catholick, he is presently become a right honest man: That Church which claims the title of Holy as proper to it self, opens her Gates to Bankrupts and Cheats, and exhorts men to become Bankrupts by turning Roman-Catholicks, which is a sure Means of Pardon and Ob­livion for all Sins, and in a word, a Salve for all Sores, a Remedy for all Evils.

Give me leave to tell you a little story, not impertinent to the Purpose which I had the other day from an Offi­cer: You know, 'tis now every ones busi­ness to make Converts: 'Tis the imploy­ment of Gentlemen and Officers of War, [Page 138]as well as of the Bigots: A Souldier of the Garrison of Friburg, having commit­ted a considerable Robbery, was impri­son'd for it. He had wit enough to know, it would go very hard with him, unless he could find Favour. The first Question ask'd him in Prison, was, what Religion he was of; to which he answered, with­out the least Hesitation, he was a Hugo­not. Presently flock'd about him all the Devotes of the Town, and, in the Head of them, Madam de Chamilly the Gover­nor's Wife. Never Martyr made a more resolute Defence than this Souldier, who was look'd upon as a Hugonot, would soon­er Burn than turn. Monsieur de Chamilly the Governor of the place, came in Per­son to the Prison, spoke home to the Soul­dier, and made him understand, it would go very ill with him, if he did not turn Catholick: The Souldier was not a whit mov'd at all this: But at length he began to relent and yield to the gentle instances of the Lady Governess. Yet not without en­tring into a formal Treaty, for fear of a surprize, and being hang'd when conver­ted. In short, they gave him all the secu­rity he desir'd for his Life, and they kept their words. When the Souldier was got clearly off, his Comrades made it appear [Page 139]he had never been a Hugonot, but to the day of his imprisonment had always been a Roman-Catholick: Madam de Chamilly was so vex'd when she knew it, she would have had the Souldier try'd again for his Crime: But the business was over, he had obtain'd his Pardon, and the Matter was past bringing about.

Sir, I see you will not have op­portunity this day, to make use of the Ar­guments in your little Book: These Gen­tlemen make great Complaints, and are not wanting in words to express them. Let me advise you to put up your Book in your Pocket: Methinks, our Discourse has been so long, 'tis now time to take a little Breath. But to interrupt as little as may be a business we are all so much concern'd in, I think we may do well to proceed in our Discourse, and finish to morrow.

The Last Efforts OF AFFLICTED INNOCENCE.
The Second Discourse.

GEntlemen, you shall not e­scape me to day: We have given you leave to Attack us, and must now see how well you can defend your selves: That Gentleman jeer'd me, that I was oblig'd yesterday to put up again my Book in my Pocket: But I'le take it out now, and you shall, if you please Gentlemen, presently give your Answers to the Objections of my Author.

[Page 142]

You Author, Sir, is none of the Greatest: He is a Scribler of Libels, a man without a Name, one that hides him­self in a Corner, to shoot as us like a base treacherous Fellow, when most of the World beside glory to appear eminent a­mong those who destroy us. But we will put upon him the Value you please: If we cannot answer him, it will be our fault, having had time enough to provide for it: Every seditious Monk and hot-headed wri­ter have made the same Objections against us: These things have been a hundred times charg'd upon us, and as often an­swer'd: But I am very sensible, they are concern'd now more than ever, to insist upon and maintain these Calumnies: 'Tis no wonder to see them endeavour to stain the Reputation of those they use as Ene­mies of the State: Our Loyalty is a con­tinual Reproach to our Persecutors: We cannot be surpriz'd to see them Labour­ing so earnestly to blemish it.

This, Sir, is beating the Air, and complaining without Cause: That which I have to say and to read to you, is cer­tain and indisputable matter of Fact: Hear what our Church-man says. These Gentlemen have gain'd themselves no more advantage by adding, They had never been [Page 143]so unfortunate to render themselves unwor­thy of those Concessions: For if I were al­low'd to call to mind, and relate here what pass'd in the Raign of Lewis the 13th of triumphant Memory, they would find it very difficult to perswade the World of the truth of what they say: We may see by the Edicts published on that occasion, to what point the disobedience of those Gentlemen had reduc'd that great Prince: You may read what fol­lows, and see the terms the Edict of Niort of 27th. of May 1621. is penn'd in, where the King complains of Exorbitances com­mitted by those of your Religion, of Po­litick Assemblies, of Rebellions, of taking up Arms, of Orders sent into the Provin­ces, to seize his Majesties Revenue and Fi­nances, of Commissions given for making great Guns, and for raising of Souldiers: You will meet with the sieges of Montauban, Rochell, Montpellier and Privas, and many actions of Rebellion committed by you in the late times, when you would not obey the King's Orders, whereby your Churches were to be demolish'd, and you were pro­hibited to preach in certain places: But hear what he says after: To which they add, as if they were the most miserable People of the World, that without looking back into times long since past, their present [Page 144]Condition is very different from that they were in some years ago: We know very well these Gentlemen sigh for those times, they call, longsince past, in which they were so formidable: 'Tis true, we are not now in the times of their Enterprizes of Ambois and Meaux, and those other at­tempts of theirs, when they call'd in the English and the Rheiters to their assistance to Sack all our Provinces, to Rob and pull down our Churches, to surprize the Towns of greatest importance, to give Battel within view of Paris, and in sight of their King. The Battel of St. Denis, in 1567. And when they were not asham'd to propose to Charles the 9th. to disarm first, if he would have peace with them; and to send back for that purpose those six thousand Swisses he had call'd in for the safety of his Person, and of the State. Here, Sir, in few lines is a great deal of business, you will not easily rid your hands of.

Ile do my endeavour, Sir, I very well know, that a hundred Authors before yours, charge on us as a great Crime the Civil Wars of the last Age, and of the beginning of this. But if you will give us the hearing, we will examine who ought to bear the blame of them.

[Page 145]

Sir, Before you answer this Anonymus Author, I think you may do well to speak a little to what I read to day in a Book of Dr. Arnaud, intituled, The Overthrow of the Morals of Jesus Christ by the Calvinists: I see it on the Table there, and will, if you please, read you the pas­sage. The first Christians had no other Arms but their Faith and their Pa­tience: Book 1 Ch. 5. Nothing could ever move them to use force for ruining Idolatry. But as for them, as soon as they saw them­selves in a Condition to resist the Powers or­dain'd by God, they fill'd Europe with bloo­dy Wars, they chang'd the Governments of States, broke down the Images, polluted the Altars, burnt the Churches, and prophan'd the most holy things. You know this Mon­sieur Arnaud hath gain'd himself a great Reputation among his Party: And what he says is of more weight, than what is said by an Author without Merit and with­out a Name.

The Charge is the same, though the Accusers are different. By answering either, we answer both. Save that Dr. Arnaud aims farther than the Ano­nymus Church-man, and lays his Accusa­tion general, against all the Reformed of Europe, as if they had kindled a War and [Page 146]alter'd the Government, where-ever the Reformation was introduc'd: The genera­lity of this Charge deserves a particular Consideration, and if these Gentlemen please, I will let them see how unjust it is.

We shall gladly give you the hear­ing. 'Tis a thing we had to say to you, in Justification of the Conduct of the Mi­nisters against you, and of the design the King hath to destroy you. And I explain it thus: You are naturally inclin'd to a Republican Government, you hate Mo­narchy, and your Sect hath not made ap­pear that Spirit of Rebellion that animates it in France alone, but in the Low-Coun­tries, in Germany, in England: And gene­rally in all places where it is establish'd, you have shaken off the Yoke of your Lawful Princes, and setled your Religion by tak­ing up Arms against your Soveraigns.

If a Gentleman so clear­sighted as you, can charge us so unjustly, what Equity can we expect from those or­dinary understandings which are guided wholly by prejudice? To hear you speak, one would think we had in every place set up the Standard of Rebellion: And that like Mahomet we had establish'd our Sect by force of Arms. The ground of all this is [Page 147]no other, but that in the time of our Re­formation, the Low-Countries withdrew themselves from under the Dominion of Spain; and the Protestants of Germany had some engagements with Charles the 5th. To let you see the injustice of this Complaint, I must intreat you to take a short view of the States, where our Refor­mation is establish'd; and you will see whe­ther it hath entred every where by Arms and Rebellion. As to England, all the World knows, the Reformation was intro­duc'd there by Authority of the Soveraign, not by popular Sedition: Henry the 8th. shook off the Yoke of the Pope, and en­franchis'd his Kingdom from the Tyranny of the Court of Rome. Edward the 6th. his Son and Successor finished what he began. Mary the Daughter of Henry de­stroy'd all her Father and Brother had done, and brought the Kingdom again under the Dominion of the Roman Church: Elizabeth her Sister overthrew all Mary had done, restablish'd the Reformation of the Protestants in all her Dominions, and strengthned it by a Raign of above forty years. Swede was reform'd under the Au­thority of Gustavus Erikson, whom your most Catholick Writers cannot reproach with any thing, but his banish­ing [Page 148]the Roman Religion out of his Coun­tries. He was descended of the Ancient Gothish Kings, and Grandchild to Charles Chanut King of Swede. He was chosen King of Swede, by all the States of that Kingdom with universal joy, and great ac­clamation, as having merited that Honour by the great Service he had done his Coun­trey, in delivering it from the tyranny of the Danes: This then was no usurper, but a Lawful King: A Prince of so much good­ness and wisdom as Swede ever had. He Raign'd happily thirty seven years, and in acknowledgment of his Merit, the Swedes made their Crown hereditary in favour of his Children, which had before been Ele­ctive. This Prince reform'd Religion in his Countries without Violence, without Threats, but by fair and gentle Means, without a Sword drawn, or drop of Blood shed: Denmark receiv'd the Reformation the same time under Frederick and Christi­ern the 3 d. his Son without Violence, and only by the Authority of these two Prin­ces. The last Roman-Catholick King of Denmark was Christiern the 2 d. whom F. Maimburg, in his History of Lutheranism describes as a Monster. He assur'd himself the Conquest of Swede by the most inhu­mane and barbarous Action History ever [Page 149]mention'd. That is, by Massacring the Se­nate, and all the flower of the Nobility of the Kingdom at a Feast he invited them to: This Tyrant was driven out of Den­mark by his Subjects there, who call'd in Frederick Duke of Holstein, and plac'd him on the Throne. This Frederick was a Prince as eminent for wisdom, and re­nowned for goodness, as Christern the last who made profession there of the Roman-Catholick Religion, was infamous for his Wickedness, Treachery and Cruelty. For proof of this truth, I rely not on a Wit­ness lyable to suspition, but on Father Maimbourg, in his first Book of the History of Lutheranism: I have already made out a considerable number of the Reformed Countries, where it appears the Reforma­tion was not introduc'd by revolt of the Subject, but establish'd by Authority of the Soveraign. The Swisses were a free State before the Reformation, and therefore at liberty to make choice of their Religion, and may be added to the number of Coun­tries reform'd without Rebellion.

Let me advise you, Sir, to stop there: For if you step but a little further, you will come to Geneva, your Metropolis and your Rome: And I believe, you will find it a hard task, to justifie their manner [Page 150]of changing the Ancient Religion there: They expell'd their Bishop, depriv'd the Dukes of Savoy of the ancient Rights they had in the City, erected themselves into a soveraign Republick against all sorts of Right, Humane and Divine.

I think, Gentlemen, you have no cause to suspect the History of Geneva, lately published by Monsieur Spon: He affects a sincerity not very pleasing to the Protestants: They of Geneva have judg'd it so little favourable to them, they have prohibited the sale of the Book in their City. And it has pleas'd the Enemies of the Protestants so well, they have given it high Elogies and magnificent Approbati­ons: However I will rely on what that Au­thor says. If you read that History, Sir, you will find the Bishop of Geneva was not in any Age Soveraign of the City; true it is, he had some rights over the tem­poralties of it, as some Bishops of France, (particularly those who are Dukes, Earls, and Peers of the Kingdom) have over their Sees and Episcopal Cities, as the Bishop of Strasbourg had there, as the Elector and Arch-bishop of Cologne hath over that City: But these are not rights of Soveraignty: The Bishop of Geneva never was a Sove­raign Prince, but the Syndic and Councel [Page 151]of the City have always been Soveraign Magistrates in Civil Affairs: The Historian tells you further; the Duke of Savoy ne­ver had any lawful right over the City of Geneva: They have had Judges who were called Vidons; but the Judges had jurisdi­ction over no other but Savoyards, settled in the Territory of Geneva: And 'twas by meer sufferance of the Genevois, the Dukes of Savoy had a right of Jurisdiction over the Savoyards in their City. 'Tis confess'd, the Dukes of Savoy have sometimes kept their Court in Geneva, but without any Authority, other than the permission of the Syndics and Councel of the City. This Author informs you also, that the Dukes of Savoy resolv'd at any rate to make them­selves Masters of Geneva, got a Creature of theirs, Peter de la Baum to be made Bi­shop. This man, being a Traytor to the City, he ought to have protected, did all in his Power to bring it under the Ty­ranny of the Savoyards: Those who most vigorously oppos'd this Enterprize, and oblig'd him first to retire, were very Zea­lous Roman-Catholicks. They put them­selves under the protection of the Canton of Fribourg, which had been, and was then of the Roman-Catholick perswasion. The Do­ctrine of the Reformed was preach'd in the [Page 152]City, many were converted, the Bishop return'd to oppose them. He had a great Contest with the Senate about some Pri­soners, he pretended, belong'd to him, in prejudice of the Councel of the City, who was judicially possess'd of their Business: The Councel carryed it against the Bishop, and remain'd Masters of the Prisoners, the subject of this Controversie was matter of Jurisdiction, not of Religion. The Bishop having lost the Cause, withdrew out of the City. He was so far from-being expell'd or driven away, that his Authority was own'd there a long time after. But disco­very being made of several Conspiracies of this Bishop, tending to an absolute suppres­sion, both of the Religion and Liberty of the City, being then for the most part re­form'd, his Authority at last expir'd in a little State he was not able to manage; the free People of it having made choice of a Religion contrary to his.

'Tis easie, in so short an Account as you give, to cover truths with falshoods: the matters of Fact are for the most part disguis'd: And it would not be difficult to give them another Face, which would represent this Enterprize a meer Rebelli­on: But 'twill be too long a digression to enter into particulars of this nature: We [Page 153]had rather hear what you can say in favour of your Protestants of Germany.

I say, Sir, there's no reason to accuse them of Rebellion against their Soveraigns. 'Tis perhaps the League of Smalcald you would lay to their Charge: It was, Sir, a League defensive only: F. Maimbourg shall witness it. They conclu­ded, says he, Hist. Lutb. lib. 3. An. 1531. their League of mutual defence against all those who would trouble them in the ex­ercise of their Religion. The same Author tells us, that if the Protestant Princes had any design to prevent the Emperor, and take up Arms before him, Luther oppos'd it. And the Letter he writ on that Sub­ject to the Elector of Saxony, may be seen at this day at the beginning of the first Tome of Luthers works: Is there any thing more natural, than to unite in order to common safety? This League was not made by Re­bels and seditious Subjects, but by Sove­raign Princes: 'Tis very well known, the Emperor is not Master of the Empire, which is a Confederation of several States united under one Head, yet reserving to themselves-their Liberty and Soveraignty. In matters of Peace and War, Impositions, raising Ar­mies, and all other Acts of Soveraignty, the Princes and free Towns do what they please: [Page 154]They make War one against another: They end their differences as they please, and enter, when they think fit, into Interests contrary to those of the Emperor: If the Emperor attempt any thing against the Priviledges of any Member of the Empire, they remedy themselves by Arms, without incurring the penalty or name of Rebels. Who knows not this, must be a stranger to the History of Germany: The Golden Bull is express in it. Declaring, that if the Emperor violate any Right or Priviledge belonging by that Bull to the Members of the Empire, the Princes Ecclesiastical and Secular have Power to oppose him, and cannot on that account be charg'd with Rebellion: Nor can the Protestants of Ger­many be charg'd with Rebellion for entring into the League of Smalcald. Which was not more against the Emperor, than against all other who should persecute them. True it is, these Confederates ten years after had War with Charles the 5th. but were forc'd into it: They did not take up Arms first, the Emperor form'd a design to destroy them, and they were oblig'd to defend themselves: Besides, there is nothing more false, than that this was properly a War of Religion. That was only a pretence by which Charles the 5th. engag'd Pope Paul [Page 155]the 3d. in the League against the Confede­rates of Smalcald. The Pope indeed would have it pass for a holy War, undertaken for the destruction of Heresie. The Empe­ror on the contrary publish'd a Manifesto, wherein he professed, That the War he was entring into, was not a War of Religion: That this appear'd clearly by his permitting liberty of Conscience to the Lutheran Princes and Souldiers, who faithfully serv'd him in his Armies, and that he had not entred into a League with the Pope, otherwise than as a Prince who assisted him against the Common Enemy: 'Tis certain he had in his Army many Protestant Princes, particularly, Mau­rice and Angustus Dukes of Saxony, and Albert and John Marquesses of Branden­bourg. Charles whose Ambition knew no bounds, had no other design, but to de­stroy the liberty of the Empire, and to make it Hereditary in his Family: This ap­pear'd by the consequence of the War, wherein though he had all the good For­tune he could hope for, he perform'd not a tittle of what he had promis'd the Pope: He endeavour'd not the destruction of Lu­theranism, but having taken the Confede­rate Towns, put them to great Ransoms, and drew from them vast Sums of Money, and huge quantities of Ammunition, but [Page 156]left them at full liberty to profess what Re­ligion they pleas'd. The Pope perceiving himselfabus'd, he call'd home his Nephew and his Troops, which return'd miserably scatter'd into Italy. All the Benefit he reap'd by this War, was vexation at heart, for having assisted Charles to oppress Ger­many, and having open'd him a way for op­pressing Italy: But how can it be imagin'd, Charles the fifth undertook this War out of Zeal to Religion, when, if he was of any Religion, he was perhaps more a Lu­theran than a Roman-Catholick. Which there is just cause to believe, because Ponce de Leon his Confessor and depositary of his most secret thoughts, in whose Arms he expir'd, was condemn'd to be burnt as an Heretick by Philip the Son of Charles: I see on your Table, the Abridgement of the History of France by Mezeray, the first E­dition. Let us see, what he says, the last Age thought of it. This Author is a Ro­man-Catholick and judicious: He is read by all, and you cannot suspect him: Philip, says he, Ann. 1559. At his arrival into Spain, caus'd to be burnt in his presence at Seville and Valladolid, a great multitude of those they call Lutherans, Men and Women, Gentle­men and Church-men, and the Effigies of Constantius Pontius, Confessor to Charles the [Page 157]5th. who attended him to his death. 'Tis no wonder he was not afraid to stain the Memory of his Father; for, if some may be credited, he was about to have an in­formation put in against him, and to have his bones burnt as an Heretick. And that he forbore this proceeding for no other rea­son, than that his Father had been an He­retick, he was thereby devested of his E­states, and consequently, had no right to resign them to his Son. Philip indeed ap­pear'd a great Zealot for his Religion. But if you will believe the Germans, the terri­ble hatred he had against the Protestants, proceeded not so much from his love to the Catholick Church, as from his violent resentment against the Lutheran Confede­rates, who oppos'd the Design of Charles the 5th. to make him associate of the Em­pire with Ferdinand his Brother, whose Successor in the Empire Philip aspir'd to be. But to return to our Subject, I say, the Germans fought for their Religion and Liberty by Power inherent in the Princes of the Empire, who are as much Masters of their States, as the Emperor of his: Mau­rice of Saxony effected what Frederick could not. He recovered the Liberty of Germany, and broke the Yoke under which it groan'd. Having thus justifi'd the Pro­testants [Page 158]of Germany. I know of no other but the States of the United Provinces, who are charg'd to have chang'd their Religion, to set up and maintain a new form of Go­vernment.

Ah! Sir, as for them, I advise you for your credit, not to engage in their de­fence: 'Tis so publickly notorious, they were Subjects of Spain, and that in chang­ing their Religion, they chang'd their Ma­ster by as plain a Rebellion as ever was in the World, I am so much your Friend, I would not have you undertake their Cause.

No, Sir, I will not under­take it: Grotius de antiqui­tate Reipublicae Ba­tavicae. 'Tis done to my hand. Read what the learned Grotius hath writ of the Original and Government of the Provin­ces of the Low-Countreys: Read their Hi­storians, read ours. You will find these People never were absolutely Subjects of Spain, that the Earls of Holland never were their absolute Masters, that the Govern­ment was mix'd, partly Aristocratical, part­ly Monarchick. These Historians will tell you, the Provinces of the Low-Countries were reform'd long before they took up Arms against the King of Spain; that in the first Wars there was an equal, if not a [Page 159]greater number of Roman-Catholick, than of Protestant Lords and Towns engag'd against the Catholick King. That the States chose the Duke of Alanson, a Son of France, a Roman-Catholick for their Master: That before that Election, they had submitted themselves to Arch-Duke Matthias a good Roman-Catholick: You will see there, that the horrible Cruelties of the Duke of Alva fore'd this poor Peo­ple beyond the bounds of patience: That Tyrant boasted he had destroy'd by the hands of the common Executioner eigh­teen thousand Persons, and had made the Confiscations of the Condemn'd, amount to eight millions of Gold yearly. You may, if you please, read in Mezeray's A­bridgement, who is neither Hol­lander nor Hugonot, Ann. 1557. That before the Duke of Alva left Spain, they arrested the Mar­quess of Berguen, and Floris de Mentmo­rency Montigny, who were gone from the States of the Low-Countries, to make their Remonstrances to King Philip: The former dyed of grief, or was poison'd; the other was Beheaded, though both were good Ro­man-Catholicks: By which it appear'd, the Councel of Spain had form'd their design a­gainst the Liberty of the Low-Countries as much (at least) as against their new Religion. [Page 160]If you have a mind to hear any more of the Low-Country Wars, let us read Meze­ray in the same place: This year, said he, They make the beginning of the Low-Coun­try Wars, which lasted till the Peace of Mun­ster without intermission, other than that of the Truce agreed by the mediation of Hen. 4th. The fear of the Inquisition was the princi­pal Cause of the War. The Inquisition was extremely pernicious and insupportable to the Flemings, for besides the two vio­lent rigors it exercis'd against those who had embrac'd the new Opinions, it broke off all Commerce, &c. The very Clergy was no less displeas'd at it for the seven newly erected Bishopricks, taken out of the Metropolitan Diocesses of Rhemes, Tre­ves and Cologne, and the Bishopricks of Liege and Munster; because they had ap­propriated to these new erected Bishopricks the richest Abbies of the Low-Countries, and bestow'd them on Prelates at the Devotion of the Councel of Spain: So that under pretence of maintaining the ancient Reli­gion, the Spaniards labour'd to establish an absolute Dominion in Provinces, which owe but a limited Obedience according to their Laws and their Priviledges: This, Sir, was the true source of these Wars, wherein not only the Lay-subjects of both [Page 161]Religions, but the Roman-Catholick Cler­gy of the Low-Countries, were engag'd a­gainst the King of Spain for the preservati­on of their Liberty. Read Strada, whom you cannot suspect of partiality in our fa­vour, and you will discover through all the Disguisements of that Author, that it was not Religion, but the Cruelty of the Spanish Government, was the sole Cause of the revolt of those Provinces: If all this will not satisfie you, I will give you leave, Sir, to brand the memory of our Kings, who maintain'd the Rights of these Provin­ces, thought their Cause just, and support­ed them against the enterprizes of a Ma­ster, who had lost his just Rights of Law­ful Soveraignty over them, by endeavour­ing to be their Tyrant.

I see we shall never agree in this point: We were better return to our Civil Wars of France, wherein those of your Re­ligion have spilt so much Blood, and ap­pear'd always of a Spirit inclin'd to Rebel­lion.

If you think we have no­thing to say for our selves, you are very much mistaken, Sir: We have so many things to answer, we know not what Me­thod to put them in, nor how to compre­hend them in few words: The Wars you [Page 162]would charge us with as a Crime, have been Civil Wars, of the same nature with others rais'd in the Bowels of a State, by the discontent of the People, and the jea­lousie of the great ones; to which, Religi­on was but an accidental ingredient: This, Sir, I undertake to prove evidently by Hi­story. But before I enter on that, I beg leave to make some Reflections: Is it not a great piece of injustice, in those who read the History of the last Age, to fix their eyes on those thirty years only, which pass'd between the death of Henry the 2d. and that of Henry the 3d. without taking no­tice of the forty years elaps'd, during the Raign of Francis the 1st. and Henry the 2d? If they charge us with having been engag'd in the Civil Wars those thirty years, ought they not to commend the pa­tience we had for forty years before? Ad­mit it, we were afterwards more impatient than we ought; however 'tis true, that for almost half an Age, we patiently endur'd unheard of Cruelties, without seeking any means of Revenge or Defence. During the Raigns of Henry the 2d. and Francis the 1st. the Land was overflowed with our Blood, the Prisons were full of our poor Captives, the Executioners were imploy'd in nothing else but burning and quartering [Page 163]those poor Wretches, who were not guilty of any other Crime, but praying to God in a Language they understood, and refu­sing to adore any thing, but what they knew to be God: There is no sort of Cru­elty but was exercis'd upon them; they were burnt; they had their Members pluck'd off with hot Pinsers; they were rack'd and put to all sorts of Tortures; they were bu­ried alive: There were horrible Massacres committed upon them: Such were those of Cabrieres and Merindol, wherein they ras'd Houses and Towns, laid waste a whole Country, cut the Throats of several thou­sands of Persons, and caus'd others to pe­rish by Famine on the Mountains. The Court made it a divertisement to see the horrible Torments these poor People suf­fer'd. You shall hear the Account Meze­ray gives of it. There was, says he, a ge­neral Procession at Nostre­dame, Mezeray's Abridg­ment, &c. Ann. 1548. where the King as­sisted, to declare by this acti­on the Zeal he had to maintain the Religion of his Ancestors, and to punish those who would change it. This he confirm'd by the horrible Torments of many miserable Pro­testants, who were burnt at the place of Execution in Paris. They were hoys'd up with a Pulley and an iron Chain, and [Page 164]then let fall into a great fire. This was of­ten reiterated: The King was so pleas'd with it, that he fed his eyes with this Tra­gick Spectacle: And 'tis said, the horrible Cryes of one of these Wretches affected him so, that all his Life after, he was from time to time haunted with a very trou­blesome remembrance of it: I should scarce have reported this, had the Relation been made by any Author not a Roman-Catho­lick, for it would have been look'd upon as false and incredible. Those horrible imaginations that from time to time perse­cuted Henry the 2d. did not reform him. His Raign was stain'd throughout with the Blood of his Protestant Subjects: In all places of the Kingdom, Fires were kindled and Gibbets set up to destroy them. The Dutchess of Valentinois, that King's Mistress, making great advantage of the Confiscati­ons of the Protestants, serv'd as a fury to awaken his Cruelty every moment: That lascivious she-Wolf thirsting after the blood of the Faithful, and with a ravenous Appetite coveting their Estates, demand­ed their death as a recompence, for those criminal favours she was so liberal of to her King and her Pages: If these poor People met at night in a private House for Instru­ction and Comfort, they were surpriz'd, [Page 165]and us'd as Sorcerers found at a Sabbath adoring the Devil. To add a Persecution more cruel then the rest, they publish'd Calumnies against them, blacker then the Devil had ever invented; they renew'd a­gainst them all the old Accusations of the Pagans against the Primitive Christians: They charg'd them with strange Crimes, says Mezeray; it was said, they rosted little Children, Mez. Abr. An. 1557. and ha­ving made great Cheer, put out the Lights, and turned the place into a Brothel; a great number of them was burnt. In all this time did any one take up Arms? Perhaps they were so weak, you will say, they durst not; I am of Opinion, the Reformed were as numerous about the end of the Reign of Henry the Second, as at the beginning of the Reign of Francis the second, when the first Troubles began: 'Tis not to be imagin'd, that vast multitude of People was converted in five or six months; there were at that time of the Reformed Religion, some Princes, several great Lords, many principal Officers of the Crown, and of the People an infinite num­ber. Mezeray tells us, that in one of their Meetings they surpriz'd some of the Queens Maids of Honour; yet not one of the Re­formed thought of making any defence [Page 166]under the Reign of this Prince, who perse­cuted them with Fire and Sword: Can you wonder, that having been driven to extre­mity by long and continual Violences, they had no more patience, but at last endea­vour'd some means to save themselves from the fury of their Tormentors?

You know the primitive Christians did not so; they had no other Weapons but their Prayers and Tears, to defend themselves against the Persecutions of the Pagan Emperors.

I wonder Sir, how those of whom you have borrowed that Reflection, dare produce the Example of the Primitive Christians. 'Tis true, the Primitive Chri­stians had not any Arms to defend them­selves; nor had they any to attack with: They did not burn Hereticks, but labour'd their Conversion. There is not a more cer­tain Character of a false Church, or false Zeal, then Persecution, Violence, and Fury: There have sate on the Imperial Throne, Constantines and Theodosii, as well as Decij and Diocletians; but a Constan­tine or a Theodosius never made use of Arms against the Pagan Religion, which had made so many Martyrs: 'Tis not out of Charity alone, that Christian Princes ought to for­bear attacking a false Religion with punish­ment [Page 167]and torture; but out of Prudence the Church only can have Martyrs, and ought not to be robb'd of the Glory of that Priviledge, and that powerful argument for proof of her Doctrine: Nothing raises a greater prejudice against the constancy of true Martyrs, then the obstinacy of Here­ticks, who persist in their Opinions to Death. Our Accusers, Sir, are very unjust in their proceeding with us; to have the Sword in one hand, and the Faggot in the other; to cover Towns and Countries with dead Bodies; to destroy pell-mell the Inno­cent with the Guilty; to shed the blood of Infants; Women and old Men having one foot in the Grave; to commit Massacres; to drown France with the blood of its In­habitants; to Burn, Quarter, and invent new Torments: This is laudable Zeal, me­rit of the highest degree, that raises men to be Saints, equal with St. Dominick. But if a poor Hugonot lift up his Arm to put by the blow that is made at him, this is fury and rage, and the fruit of a spirit opposite to that of the true Church: I cannot forbear applying to this purpose, what St. Athana­sius said to them who reproach'd him with making his Escape; If they think it a shame to me, to have made my Escape, let them be asham'd to have forc'd me to it by their Perse­cution. [Page 168]When Men run away, 'tis an ar­gument of the Cruelty of those they run from: We fly not from the Gentle and Courteous, but the Bloody and the Cruel. There is no defence where there is no Per­secution. I confess it, Men are Men; the love of Life is strong and powerful, the in­clinations and Counsels of flesh and bloud prevail often over those of strict Piety. Were it true, that our Fathers took up Arms to save their Lives, 'tis a weakness they ought to be pardon'd for, in an Age which may very well be called an Age of Fury.

In my opinion, Christian Vertues ought to be constant; what is done out of a principle of vertue in one time, ought to be done in another, for true vertue is al­ways the same; Perseverance is the Chara­cter and the Proof of its truth: Had those of your Religion endur'd out of a principle of Christian Constancy, the ills done them under the Reigns of Francis the first, and Henry the second, 'tis probable the same Constancy would have accompanied them under the Reigns of Francis the second, and Charles the ninth.

The same vertue, Sir, uses a different Conduct at different times. Fran­cis the first, and Henry the second, were [Page 169]Princes at full age and of years of Discretion; they acted as they thought fit, their own Faculties were their Guides, there is no doubt but God had establish'd them for the exercise and tryal of his Church in her new Birth. They were Persons of a Character, against which we were not permitted to lift up a hand: But Francis the second was a Child, a weak Child, incapable of business, and govern'd by bloudy Princes, who in his Name did what they pleas'd, and would have extirpated the House of Bourbon and the whole Protestant Party. Charles the ninth took the Scepter in hand at an Age he was as little capable to Govern as Fran­cis the second: 'Tis certain, Subjects are not oblig'd to bear the Grievances done them by those who usurp and abuse the Royal Authority, with the same submission they ought to receive the Miseries they endure, by the ill use Kings make of their proper Authority. Hence it proceeds, that the Reigns of most of our Kings in Minority, are troubled with Civil Wars, when those who have possest themselves of the Kings Person, abuse his Name, and the People think not themselves oblig'd to submit to a Tyrannical Power newly usurp'd: We ob­serv'd not nor acknowledg'd in the Princes of the House of Guise, any Character that [Page 170]could oblige us to suffer their Persecutions they declar'd and acted against us, much less could we acknowledge any such Character in the Pope, his Substitutes, or his Clergy, the first Authors of our Miseries. These were our Enemies, these were the Party we engag'd against, a Party that had no right to use us so barbarously. 'Twas not against our Kings, but this sort of People, we first took up Arms. True it is, our Kings com­ing afterwards to their Majority, found themselves engag'd before-hand to prosecute our ruine; and we having our Swords in our hands, made use of them to avoid the violence and fury of their Ministers. But we never wanted either Love to their Per­sons or Faithfulness in their Service: In the heat of the Civil Wars, our Hugonots had constantly true French hearts, and an invi­olable Fidelity to their Kings. We are re­proach'd with the coming in of the English and the Rheisters into France. Those who introduc'd them never design'd to make them Masters of the State; but I can prove it by a hundred Evidences, that the League which oppos'd us, had a design to take the Crown of France from the lawful Heirs, and to bring the Kingdom under the Domi­nion of Spain. In the first Civil Wars un­der Charles the ninth, the Princes had obli­ged [Page 171]themselves to give Havre de Grace to the English for security: The Hugonots had no sooner obtained Peace, but they labour'd with more Zeal then any other Subjects of France to regain the place. Mez. Abr. An. 1563. Mezeray gives you an account of it: All the French, says he, applyed themselves with extraordinary ar­dour to recover the Town: The Hugonots were more forward and eager then the Ca­tholicks, to purge themselves from the Re­proach cast upon them of having introduc'd Strangers into France. In the late Wars for Religion, the Rochelois reduc'd to the last Extremities, were solicited by the Duke of Buckingham to yield to the King of Eng­land, and acknowledge him their Soveraign; and in case they would do so, he promis'd they should be succour'd in a far better man­ner then they had been. They rejected the Proposal with contempt, and chose ra­ther to expose themselves to all the Rigors of their Prince highly incens'd, then to en­ter under the Dominion of a Stranger: I could produce many such Examples to prove that our Hugonots though in Arms were never guided by a Spirit of Rebellion, but took care only how to save their Reli­gion and their Lives: But enough of these Reflections. If you think fit, we will now [Page 172]come to the principal matter, and consider of those Wars which are charg'd on us as a very high Crime.

In arguing, men turn things as they please; our business now, is matter of Fact and Historical Relation, which must be done without shift or disguise, that the truth may appear. Pray, think of that, Sirs, and do not enlarge your selves in useless Reflections.

'Tis my intention to do as you advise, you shall have no Harangues from us, I will only relate plain matter of Fact. And that my Evidence may neither be suspitious nor obscure, I will make use of no other then Monsieur Mezeray's Abridg­ment, which I have in my hand. I will lay aside the History of T [...]uanus, as written in a learned Language, because I will not say any thing but what all the World may exa­mine the truth of. They reckon six Wars from the first taking up Arms in the begin­ning of the Reign of Charles the ninth, till the end of the Reign of Henry the third, that is, that Arms were so many times taken up after the Rupture of the Edicts of Pacifica­tion obtain'd by the Reformed. Our prin­cipal business will be to justify the first ta­king up Arms by the Princes, of which the rest are but Consequents: This first War can­not [Page 173]be better defin'd, then by saying, it was formed by the jealousy of two Partys, in dispute not about Religion but the Go­vernment: That it was fomented by Kathe­rine de Medicis Regent of France, under her Children in their Minority, and that it was maintained by Zeal for Religion, which came in by the By, and made it so cruel and barbarous, nothing being more furious and brutal then false Zeal. We will examine the Rise and Progress of these two Parties: Their first rise must be taken from the last years of the Reign of Henry the second, which was after the loss of the Battel and Town of St. Quin­tin; Mez. Abr. Ann. 1557, 1558. the old Constable Mont­morency and his two Nephews, the Admiral Chatillon, and Dandelot his Bro­ther, were taken Prisoners there: The greatest and bravest of the Nobility of France being all perish'd or made Prisoners in those fatal Engagements, the Duke of Guise at his re­turn from Italy was look'd upon as the sole Tutelar Angel of France. They would have given him the Title of Viceroy: But think­ing it too ambitious, they gave him the Ti­tle of the Kings Lieutenant-General within and without the Kingdom, which was veri­fied in all the Parliaments. The Constable, 'tis known, was the Favourite of Henry the [Page 174]second, who lov'd him to that degree, that after his misfortune and imprisonment, un­fortunate as he was, yet at his return to Court the King made him lie in his own bed. But his Absence was fatal to him and his Fa­mily: The Duke of Guise render'd himself necessary to the King, and as Mezeray says, the misfortune of France was the happiness of the Duke of Guise, and the fall of the Constable was his Exaltation: The Duke of Guise had in all his Enterprizes the success, every one knows. He recovered Calais from the English; he took Thionville; he married his Niece the Queen of Scots, to the Dauphin, who was afterwards Francis the second. Fortune abandon'd the Con­stable, and sided with the Duke of Guise. Read the words of Mezeray, from that ve­ry time the jealously between these two Houses, tended to the forming two contra­ry Parties in the Kingdom, as will appear. This is the first Seed of the Civil War, wherein Religion had not any part: Thence forward, the House of Guise us'd all its pow­er to destroy Montmorency's Party. The Duke met with the pretence of Religion luckily by the way: Admiral Chatillon, and Dandelot his Brother, the Constables Ne­phews, were suspected; the Spaniards in­creas'd the Suspition, by saying, that at the [Page 175]taking of St. Quintin, they found Heretical Books amongst Dandelots Baggage. Henry the second being a violent Persecuter, cau­sed him to be arrested, and committed him Prisoner to Blaise de Montluc, a Creature of the Duke of Guise; this was a matter agreed on by the Guises and the Spaniards, with design to weaken the Constable by the loss of his Nephews. But they miss'd their aim, the Constables favour brought Dandelot clear off, and gain'd him his Liberty: And the Authority of Henry the second, kept the two Parties in an appearance of Peace du­ring the rest of his life, which was not long; but in the beginning of the Reign of Fran­cis the second, the Discord broke out. Me­zeray will tell you in the beginning of this Reign, the cause of the Civil War: A Mul­titude of Princes, says he, and of puissant Lords, is an infallible cause of Civil War, when there wants Authority powerful enough to keep them within the bounds of their duty: This was the misfortune of France after the death of Henry the second. From the time of his death, the Factions form'd during his Reign, began to appear, and to fortify them the more, unhappily met with diffe­rent Parties in Religion; a great number of Male-Contents, who long'd for change, and, which is more, many Soldiers and Officers [Page 176]of War, who having been disbanded were desirous of Employment at any rate: Me­thinks that by this Relation, Religion is not the cause of the Troubles; but the cause of them were the Factions of Princes and great Lords, who meeting with Parties differing in Religion, made use of them to serve their designs. In the same place that Author makes it appear, the two Parties fought not for Religion but for Empire: On the one side were the Princes of the Bloud and the Constable; On the other, the Princes of the House of Guise; and between both, the Regent, who by turns made use of one to beat down and destroy the other, that she might Reign. The Princes of Guise having got into their hands the Person of Francis the second, a weak Prince, gover­ned under his Authority in a tyrannical manner. The Princes of the Bloud, Antony and Lewis de Bourbon, who ought to have had the management of Affairs during the Kings Minority, could not endure that Strangers should enjoy an Authority and Honour belonging of right and properly to them. These Princes were ill us'd; An­tony of Bourbon King of Navar, came to Court, but was slighted, they did not so much as give him a Lodging, and he might have lain on the Pavement, had not the [Page 177]Marshal of St Andrew receiv'd him. The Princes began with the Pen, and caused se­veral Writings to be publish'd, to make it appear that the Laws of the State admit nei­ther Women nor Strangers to the Govern­ment; that during the Minority of the Kings, this honour belongs to the Princes of the Bloud; That the Guises were not natural French; that it was dangerous to commit to them the Government of the State, because of their Pretensions on the Kingdom, in saying, they were descended from Charlemaign. At last, Lewis of Boun­bon Prince of Conde, resolv'd upon a dan­gerous attempt, to gain Possession of his Rights, which the weakness of his Brother the King of Navarr abandon'd, and gave up to the Princes of Guise. He design'd to seize the Person of King Francis the second, and remove the Guises from Court. The Admiral and Dandelot were of the Party, and the Prince of Conde was the Head: But because the success of the Enterprize was doubtful, they would not appear in it: La Renaudie was intrusted with the manage­ment of this great design, which goes under the name of the Conspiracy of Amboise, which our Church-man, whose Book you have in your hand, makes such a noise about; there cannot be a greater injustice then to [Page 178]charge our Hugonots with this Affair. 'Tis certain there were ingag'd in that business as many Roman Catholicks as Hugonots; or if the number of Hugonots were greater, it was because there were more Male-Contents of their Party; the Chancellor de l' Hospital was one. I have read in good Authors, that La Renaudie was a Roman Catholick, yet I will not undertake to justifie it: 'Tis agreed on all hands that all the Officers who had receiv'd Indignities at Court, and been unjustly expell'd thence, engag'd themselves in the Enterprise, to be reveng'd of the Princes of Guise. There was at Court, says Mezeray, a great number of Persons out of all the Provinces, particularly Soldiers and Offi­cers of War, demanding Pay or Reward. The Cardinal of Lorrain who had the management of the Finances, was much troubled with them, and apprehended a Conspiracy in their multi­tude: This made him publish an Edict, com­manding that all those who followed the Court to demand any thing, should retire on pain of being hang'd on a Gibbet, which was publickly set up for that purpose: A great part of those who had serv'd in the Armies disgusted with this Indignity, turn'd against the Cardinal. Thus you have an account of what persons that Party was compos'd, which would have destroyed the Princes of Guise, where [Page 179]there appears so sensible and so clear a cause of Revolt, 'tis not worth our pains to go in search of a hidden one: On the one side, the Rights of the Princes of the Bloud, which they were resolv'd to maintain; on the other side, the design to be reveng'd of the grossest affront that ever was put on Persons of Quality, by setting up a Gibbet to hang them on, for no other cause but that they desir'd to be paid for the bloud they had lost, are so visibly the causes of this Conspiracy, that 'tis ridiculous to make Re­ligion the only ground of it: The chief of all the Male-Contents was Lewis of Bourbon, Prince of Conde: And though he appear'd not in the Enterprize, and several of the Conspirators deny'd to the Death, his be­ing privy to it, yet 'tis certain he was. Me­zeray tells us, That the Prince of Conde go­ing to Court, met at Orlians the Lord Cipierr, who told him the Plot was discovered: And that nevertheless the Prince continued his Journey. By this it appears, the Prince knew of the Plot. A little before, the same Author tells us, the Conspirators had chosen him for their Head, but not to bear any part in the action, which was to be carryed on by La Renaude under his Authority. The Prin­ces of Guise were fully convin'd of it, for they no sooner got the Prince of Conde in [Page 180]their power, but they caused him to be proceeded against, and Senten'd to be Be­headed.

We will suppose, Sir, that you can prove the Conspiracy of Amboise, was a Con­spiracy of all the Male-Contents; that a Prince of the Bloud was the Head of them, and that your Hugonots were not more deep­ly concern'd in it, than others; what's that to the purpose? Is a Criminal less guilty for having Accomplices? Is it allowable on any pretence whatever, to enter into so Crimi­nal a Conspiracy against your King?

Against our King? Ah, Sir, you will never be able to prove that: All our Historians bear these pretended Con­spirators Witness, they had no design against the King, or the Regent, but only against the Princes of Guise: Read, if you please, what Mezeray says. They resolv'd to present their Petition to the King, and to seize the Duke of Guise and the Cardinal of Lorrain, and exhibit Articles against them. This was their design: But who, adds Mezeray, could have secur'd the Princes of Guise from being kill'd upon the spot, or that the Male-Con­tents would not have made themselves Masters of the Persons of the Queen Mother and the King? 'Tis certain, it was laid to their Charge, they would have attempted both. [Page 181]It was laid indeed to their Charge, but not prov'd; of twelve hundred Persons who perish'd on this occasion, there was not one they could get to confess this, though use was made of most violent Tortures to force them to it. Monsieur de Thou gives them this Testimony: Thuan. Hist. Lib. 24. Not one of the Conspirators was convi­cted of any attempt against the King or the Queen, but only against Strangers, who go­vern'd all at Court in a tyrannical manner; that is, the Princes of the House of Guise. Can you think it, Sir, so great a Crime for the Princes of the Bloud, and the Chief Of­ficers of the Crown, to endeavour to gain their natural places and lawful Authority, by taking forceably an Infant King (and weak, when Major) out of the hands of Tyrants, who were going to hang up his Majesties good Servants, to establish the Inquisition in France, and to burn the true hearted French at the Stake? The Prince of Conde and the Admiral were, in my opinion, Names that carryed Grandeur and Authority enough in them, to oppose very lawfully the Tyrants of France. Your Church-man in his Book, tacks the Enter­prize of Meaux to that of Amboise, as if they were both of one nature. We are not now, says he, in the time of the Enterprizes of [Page 182]Amboise and Meaux: The man hath forgot both the Author and the end of the Enterprize of Meaux: The Head of it, was the same Prince of Conde; the end was to remove from about the King the same Tyrants, who under the name of Councellors, made Charles the ninth commit Violences which exceeded those in former Reigns, and to violate Edicts and Treaties, he had by solemn Oaths obliged himself to observe, and made use of the seeming Peace granted to the Party of the Princes, for hatching the most horrible and blackest Trea­sons that ever have been heard of. After the first Civil War, the Peace was made by the Edict of the 18th of March 1563. this Peace serv'd only as a Cloak for a Cruel War made with more safety against the Reformed after they had been disarm'd: The Reformed made their Complaints to the Prince of Conde and the Admiral: But these two great great Men answer'd, Mezeray. 1567. says Me­zeray, That they must endure any thing rather than take up Arms a­gain: That second troubles would render them the horrour of all France, and make them the Object of the Kings hatred. This was their Resolution; but when a Principal Person at Court had given them express advice, it was resolv'd the Prince and the Admiral should be taken, the former to be kept per­petual [Page 183]petual Prisoner, the other to lose his head on a Scaffold; by the advice of Dandelot, the boldest of the three, they resolv'd not only to defend themselves, but to attack their Enemies with open force: And in or­der thereto, to remove the Cardinal from the Kings Person. This, Sir, was the de­sign of the Enterprize of Meaux, and I have told you the Motives of it. I would ad­vise those who for this Enterprize would charge the Prince of Conde with Rebellion, that they would think well of it: The Hero who at this day bears the same name, whose veins are fill'd with that Illustrious Bloud, is an Evidence sufficient to convince the World, we may retain our Love to our Countrey and Fidelity to our King, with­out loving those who abuse the Infancy of our Kings, by making them Arm against the Liberty and Lives of the Princes of their Bloud: If the Prince of Conde opened this second War by the Enterprize of Meaux, it was because he had not any other way to save his Liberty and his Life.

The Enterprize of Meaux hath made you pass from the Conspiracy of Amboise, to the second Civil War, without touching on the first, which is the principal, and you promis'd to justify.

[Page 184]

Well, Sir, I will, if you please, return to my Task. The first War was not a War of the Hugonots alone, but it was a War of Antony and Lewis of Bourbon: The two Brothers, Antony and Lewis of Bourbon, says Mezeray, came not to the As­sembly of Melun; for two months before, An­tony retir'd into Gascoign, and his Brother went thither to him. Being then in more safety, they provided for their Affairs, and projected means to make themselves able to dislodge the Guises. The Design took wind, they were drawn to Court, and their Persons secur'd; a strong Guard was plac'd on the King of Na­varr, and the Prince of Conde imprison'd; his Process was made, and by a terrible Arrest fram'd by the Guises, he was Condemn'd to lose his Head. Was there ever so strange and unworthy a proceeding, that Strangers should Condemn to Death, the second Prince of the Bloud? And can it be thought strange, that a generous Prince should seek means to be reveng'd for so horrible an af­front? He escap'd miraculously by the death of Francis the second, whose Authority the Princes of Guise had abus'd. The King of Navarr redeem'd himself by yielding the Regency to the Queen: The Constable Montmorency fell off from the Princes, be­cause they would have call'd him to account [Page 185]for the vast Guifts made him by Henry the second. Then was form'd the famous Tri­umvirat between the Constable, the Mar­shal de St. Andre, and the Duke of Guise; whose principal design was to efface the Name and Memory of the Family of Bour­bon: But if the Constable was against the Princes, the Marshal Montmorency, his Son, and Governour of Paris, was for them though a Catholick; by which it appears, that Religion was not the cause of those Trou­bles: The Queen Mother ambitious to Reign absolutely, and alone, was weary of the Tyranny of the Princes of Guise. And to ruine their Party, she openly favour'd the Party of the Prince of Conde. The Queen Mother, says Mezeray, to reward the Services the Admiral had done her, granted or pretended to grant him assistance on several occasions: She caus'd an Edict very favourable to the Hugonots to be pub­lish'd in 1562. She proceeded yet further, and caused the Prince of Conde to Arm. In this very Page, Sir, our Historian reports, that the Duke of Guise being come to Paris with Twelve Hundred Horse, entred the Town at the Gate of St. Denis, through which the Kings make their solemn Entry: The Queen perceiving his design to take the Government from her, writ to the Prince [Page 186]of Conde, then retired to his House, recom­mending very affectionately to him, her Son, the Kingdom, and her self. If you look upon the following Page, you will see she sent for the Prince, who having got all his Friends together, took his Journey to go to the Queen, and pass'd the Seine at St. Clou. This, Sir, was the first taking up Arms, and the beginning of the first War; which was kindled by the Divisions of the great ones, and the unhappy policy of Ca­therin de Medicis. The Prince of Conde sent to the Princes of Germany the Original Letters of the Queen Mother, wherein she pray'd him to deliver her and the King out of Captivity: The Regent who put Arms into the Prince of Conde's hands, reap'd not the benefit she expected from them, but was retained in slavery with the young King, by the Tyranny of the Guises, and carried to Paris against her will. Can you wonder, that a Prince of the Bloud, of great Courage, and in Arms at the Request of the Queen, should pursue his point, and en­deavour to be reveng'd of the Guises who had almost brought his Head to the Scaf­fold? Can you think it strange? The Pro­testants immediately made themselves of the Party of a Prince of the Bloud, who had so justly taken up Arms to defend himself [Page 187]from the horrible Violences and Outrages of his Enemies; for then was the time, Sir, when the Massacres of Vassy, Seus, Auxeure, Cahoy, Tours, and a hundred other places were perpetrated: Then it was, that the Parliament of Paris pass'd an Arrest, where­by they gave order the Hugonots should be kill'd whereever they were found. It was not Henry the second commanded these Cruelties, but the Tyrants, who abused the Authority of an Infant King: Christian Mo­rality doth not Condemn a lawful defence against those who unjustly attack us.

Your Party kept not within the bounds of meer defence: They made vio­lent Attacks, they proceeded to Extremities in their fury, beat down and profan'd Churches, broke down Images, kill'd and tormented Priests. You are not ignorant what horrible Cruelties were exercis'd by your Baron of Adrets.

I pray, remember, Sir, I am not obliged to justify any more then the first taking up of Arms. I will not justify any thing was afterwards done; when men have once taken Arms in hand, they be­come deaf to Piety and Reason. The Prince of Conde did all he could to hinder these Disorders: There is not one among us but Condems the Conduct of that time full of [Page 188]Exorbitance and Fury. But I will under­take, Sir, to justify the Outrages committed by our Hugonots on your Churches, Ima­ges, and Priests, when you shall have justi­fied the Barbarous Inhumanities of your Ca­tholicks against our Hugonots. Can you ap­prove of that action of the Provincial, who finding at Briguoles a Sister of his that refu­sed to go to Mass, caused her to be Ravish'd by the Cordelier who carried the Cross, and by all those who would take that Brutal Pleasure; and afterwards caused her to be Burnt with flaming Lard, which he procu­red to be dropt upon her? Can you approve of what was done at Tours, where three hundred Persons were flaid, and then beat­en to death; young Women stript naked, Ravish'd in the Face of the Sun, then kill'd; Men cut up alive under pretence of finding Money swallow'd into their Bellies? Can you approve of what was done at Orange? Where some were kill'd with many gentle blows of Ponyards, that they might be the longer a dying; others were Impall'd; some Burnt; others Saw'd; Women were hang'd at the Windows, and the Infants out of their Bosoms dash'd against the walls; the old Men being drawn up in rank, to see this horrible Spectacle before they were Massacred. This is not the thousandth part [Page 189]of Actions I could relate like these. The Answer of the Baron of Adrets to those of our Party, who reproached him for his Cruelty, was; 'Tis not Cruelty to be Cruel to them who have first been cruel to us; the first is called Cruelty, the second, Justice: And to clear himself of the Imputation, he reckon'd up many thousands who had been kill'd in cold bloud, and put to Tortures never heard of before: When you have ju­stify'd all this, I will undertake the justifica­tion of our Breakers of Images and Profa­ners of Churches. I have something more to say to you. Be so kind to justify the Con­duct of the Spaniards, who are so Catholick and so devoted to the Holy See; make us a little Apology for what they did at Rome, when taken by Charles de Bourbon, under the Command of Charles the fifth. Let's look into Fa. Maimbourgs History of Luthera­nism, which I see on your Table: He will tell you, Sir, these good Catholicks were Cruel and Prophane beyond Example in History. 'Tis impossible, says he, to ex­press all the Outrages committed in that la­mentable Pillage: It infinitly exceeds in all sort of Crimes, what the Goths and Vandals heretofore did when they sack'd Rome; nothing was spar'd but Deformity and Po­verty: All things else became the prey of a [Page 190]Conqueror, the most brutish that ever was. If you please to read on, you will find that the Spaniards and Italians, by the relation of their own Historians, were more cruel and covetous then the German Lutherans. To conclude, if you will undertake to de­fend all that hath been done by your Catho­licks in Wars for Religion, I will intreat you to justify the horrible Enormities committed in the East by those Croisado's who left their Countries, their Estates and their Children, to go and adore the Sepulchre of Jesus Christ, and recover the Holy Land out of the hands of Infidels. I must intreat you to hear the reading of a Passage out of the Byzantine History, which I translated last night, foreseeing I should have occasion to make use of it in my defence on this Article to day. Nicitas Chroni­ates in the Life of Alexius Du­cas. Into what Method shall I digest the horrible Crimes commit­ted by Execrable Men? Shall I begin with their Outrages on the venerable Images they trod under foot; or those com­mitted on the Reliques of Holy Martrys, which they threw into the nastyest places? Or shall I speak of that which is as horrible at this day to hear, as those were to see at the time they were acted? The Divine Bo­dy and Bloud of our Saviour were split on [Page 191]the ground and thrown in the dirt; those who could seize the rich Cases the sacred Vessels were put in, secur'd the Vessels in their Pockets, and made use of the Cases for Cups and Trenchers. True fore-run­ners of Antichrist, acting before hand what he should commit, &c. In pillaging the Churches, the Holy Vessels were their prey; and the Mules and Beasts of burden were brought to the Church doors; where, the Pavement being slippery, they often fell and bruised themselves to death, so that the holy places were defil'd with the Bloud and Dung of those Beasts: Amidst all these Disorders, to the greater affront of Jesus Christ, there sate on the seat of the Patriarch, a Woman laden with Sins, a Minister of Furies, a Servant of Devils, and Mistress of Sorceries, Inchantments and Poysonings, singing Impure Songs, and dancing Lasci­vious Dances: Hear the Authors Reflection: 'Tis evident, these People abuse us, in saying they are going to Conquer the Holy Sepulchre of Christ, when they discharge all their fury against Christ himself, and with the Cross they carry on their Shoulders, violate and profane the Cross of Christ, for a little Gold and Sil­ver: Now, Sir, if you please, you will yield me up these Saints and Devout Croisa­do's as not to be justify'd in the Actions I [Page 192]mentioned, and I will be excus'd from ju­stifying those actions of the Hugonots, and confess the Outrages they were guilty of, were effects of the fury of War, and not the fruits of a true Zeal of Religion.

You know well enough, Sir, we do not approve of all our Catholicks may have done against you in these Civil Wars: Our wisest Authors look upon the Massacre of St. Bartholomew, and others like it, as actions to be condemn'd, and the shame of France to all Posterity.

To think otherwise and to be wise, Sir, are hardly consistent. For the Providence of God declar'd it self so sig­nally against the Authors and Executioners of those abominable Counsels, we cannot but see it: Mezeray observes in his History, That the Duke of Guise and the Cardinal of Lorrain, were Massacred at Blois, in the same Hall were the first Councel was held to deliberate of the Massacre of St. Barthole­mew; the principal Executioners whereof, Anna 1572. were the Guises: The same Author tells us, Another Councel had been held for the same pur­pose at St. Clou, in the house of Gondy, where the Duke of Anjou, who afterwards was Henry the third, presided. And that afterwards, that unfortunate Prince was assassi­nated [Page 193]in the same Chamber, in the same place, and on the same day, by Cle­ment the Monk; the whole World knows the Tragical Death of Charles the 9th. whose blood gush'd out through all the Pores and Passages of his Body: If you would know what that signifi'd, read those five Lines Mezeray hath plac'd over the Picture of that Prince at the beginning of his Life.

The Characters of Divine Vengeance are equally visible in the death of Henry the third: He dy'd in his one and fortieth year, being the flower of his Age, and in the midst of a Reign the most promising and hopeful for Glory and Renown, France ever saw: He dy'd by the stroak of a Lance [Page 194]in the Eye, at a Turnament, that is, a Sport: He who had often made it his Di­vertisement to feed his Eyes with the hor­rible Spectacle of the Torment of Hugo­nots, he caus'd to be burnt; he who had promis'd with horrible Oaths to see Ann de Bourg burnt, as soon as his Daughter's Wedding and his Sister's should be over. Events like these are very proper to prove, that there is a God in Heaven who sees the Actions of men, and renders to every one according to his Works.

These Reflections serve only to stain the Memory of the Dead: Let their Graves be their Sanctuary to secure them from our Censure. Leave intermedling with the Judgments of God, and sum up the sub­stance of what you have to say in justifica­tion of your Wars for Religion.

The sum of all, is this, Sir, That these Wars were not originally Wars of Religion, but Wars of State: Wars, to which the two Factions of Montmorency and Guise had given birth; Wars, wherein the Roman Catholicks were of contrary Par­ties as well as the Hugonots: For you see (in the pursuit as in the beginning of the War) the chief Roman Catholick Families of the Kingdom, engag'd in the Party of the Princes of the Bloud, and put into the [Page 195]List of those whose Throats were to be cut: The Marshals Montmorency and Cosse, and Biron Grand Master of the Artillery, were no Hugonots: Yet Mezeray tells you, they were in the List of those who were to be Massacred at Bartholomew-Tide: That the Marshal Montmorency's being at Chantilly absent from Court, sav'd the Life of his three Brothers: That Cosse was sav'd by the Intercesions of Madame Chateau Neuf Mon­sieur Mistress; and that Biron Grand Ma­ster of the Artillery, sav'd himself, by pointing some Culverins towards, &c. It was not the Zeal of Religion only animated these Furies, but Avarice, and Ambition, and a desire to Reign without a Rival: Hence it came, that a great number of Ro­man Catholicks were Butchered with the Hugonots. Read Mezeray's words: This Deluge of bloud, swept away abundance of Catholicks, who were dispatch'd by order of the Soveraign Powers, or the instigation of private Persons. To have Money, or a good Office, or a revengeful Enemy, or an Heir longing to be in possession, was to be a Hugonot: The Duke of Guise, as great a Catholick as he was, sav'd, during the Massacre, above a hundred Hugonots in his Palace, whom he thought he could gaint o his Service. Had all the Hugonots [Page 196]been willing to have plac'd him on the Throne, as he thought those hundred were, he would have sav'd a Million of them, and would have been their great friend and Pro­tector. So true is it, that the Ambition of the great ones, was the cause of these Wars on the one side and the other: Hath not the Duke of Alanson Brother of Charles the ninth and Henry the third, been seen at the head of Thirty Thousand of these Male-Contents? Yet he was no Hugonot, nor ever favour'd them of the Religion: Were not Marshal Danville and several other firm and profest Roman Catholicks engag'd for the same Party? By which it appears, all those Wars were the Wars of the Discon­tented in general, whether Catholicks or Hugonots. To Conclude, Sir, for justify­ing our Hugonots in these Wars, I can prove they had not any design but to preserve themselves, the State, and the Illustrious Princes of the Family of Bourbon now Regnant: On the contrary, the opposite Party was a Spanish Faction, who covered their Designs with the Specious Vail of Re­ligion, but were Enemies to the State, and would have put the Crown upon the Heads of Strangers.

[Page 197]

As to the last Article, I pray Sir in­gage not in the proof of it. Repetitions are troublesom to the Speaker, and no less tedious and unpleasant to the hearer. This Gentleman hath acquainted us with what you have to say on that Subject: for he hath endeavor'd to prove, the faction of the Guises would have taken away from the Branch of Bourbon, their Lives and the Crown, to bring France under the Domi­nion of a Stranger. 'Tis possible there might be some such design, but the faults of others do not justify us: If the faction of the Guises had Criminal designs, are you there­fore more innocent?

Sir, that which hath been said by us on this Subject, is not the hundredth part of what may be said to prove, the fa­ction of the house of Guise, which call'd it self the Holy Union, and went under the name of the League from the year 1576. to the year 1600. was altogether Spanish, and an Enemy to the State; and that our Party which was wholly opposite to the other, was altogether French. But I will comply with your desires, and say no more of it, pro­vided you will in requital answer a question I am going to ask you. What reason you Gentlemen of the Roman Catholick Reli­gion have to Condemn the Protestants for [Page 198]their pretended Rebellions against their Princes, on the account of Religion?

'Tis on this Ground: That Subjects owe absolute obedience to their Soveraign's in all things: That the Soveraign is Master of the Religion of his Countrey: And that Subjects have no right to demand to­leration of a Religion different from that of the State.

You have answered just as I expected: And according to these Maxims you argue very right: For if a Prince is absolute Master of the Religion of his Peo­ple, as of other their Concerns; if Subjects are obliged to follow always the Religion of their Soveraign, doubtless there is reason to charge them with Rebellion, who with Arms in their hands, desire to be tolerated in the Exercise of a Religion different from that of the State. But, Sir, have you thought well of the Maxim you propos'd? Do you remember 'tis the Maxim of Hobbs in his Politicks? You know how famous Spinosa was for Impiety: He was for allow­ing every one Liberty to think and speak what he pleas'd concerning Religion, yet attributes to the Soveraign an absolute Au­thority over the Religion of the State: You know these two men are an Object of Execration to all Divines, and that they are [Page 199]generally look'd upon as great Enemies of Religion: And amongst all their Maxims, this in particular hath been look'd upon as one of the most Pernicious: Consider a lit­tle, how far it may be carry'd: If the Prince be Master of Religion, you Catholicks must be Reformed in England and Holland, and so must the Lutherans in Denmark and Swede, and the Christians of the East must turn Mahometans in Persia and Turkey: If therefore this may peradventure be a false Maxim, as certainly it is, is it so great a Crime to be of a Religion different from that of the State? And if you are of a Re­ligion different from that of your Prince, is it a Crime to obtain from him a toleration to exercise it in private or publick.

Either you misapprehend me, or I have not well express'd my self: I design not to assert, the Empire of Kings extends to the Conscience, or that they are Masters of the Religion of the heart: I know ve­ry well we are to obey God rather than Men: I coufess it allowable, and frequent­ly necessary to be of a Religion different from that of our Prince: In a word, 'tis no Crime to desire permission of the Prince to make publick profession of a Religion different from his: My meaning was, that the Prince is Master of the External part of [Page 200]Religion: That if he will not permit any Religion but his; when we cannot obey, we may die patiently without making other defence than our Sufferings: Because true Religion ought not to make use of force and Arms for its establishment: Princes are infi­nitely to blame when they violently oppose the Establishment of the true Religion, but they are, answerable only to God for it.

In this sence, I confess, your Maxim is pious, and bears the Character of the Primitive Christian Morality: And now, Sir, I have you where I wish'd you: I ask you with confidence, what ground you Roman Catholicks have to charge us with the violation of this Maxim? If you think it good, why d' you not observe it? If you observe it not, why make you such ado, why clamour you so much against others, who do not observe it? You may very well be allow'd, Gentlemen, to make the like Objection against the Reformed. You, who are of a Religion, whose History, if written, would be a continual Series of Re­bellion against Soveraigns, of Attempts against their Authority, Conspiracies a­gainst their Lives, and Assassinations com­mitted upon their Persons, for the sake of Religion, and under pretence of maintain­ing [Page 201]it. You know the History of past Ages and the present, and cannot be ignorant that when a Prince meddles never so little with what you call the Estate, the Immuni­ties and Priviledges of the Church, though these things concern not the grounds of Religion, he is call'd impious, an Heretick, and a favourer of Hereticks, and permissi­on is given to rebel against him. For an Abby; for the Revenues of a Bishoprick ta­ken into the hands of a Prince; for the Rights of Regale; for Nomination to some Benefices what a bustle is made, what ex­travagant Insolences are not committed? According to that pious Maxim upon which you ground your Charge against us, and so cruelly prosecute it; those who labour for the maintenance of Religion, are to be meerly patient, and ought not to make use of any means that may diminish or indanger the Authority of the Prince. But will you cast your eye upon the Conduct of the League, that Holy Ʋnion, which in 1576. appear'd under that name for the preserva­tion of the Catholick Faith? You will see how they observ'd this Maxim. The first honour Monsieur Me­zeray does them, Mez. Abr. 1576. is to call them a great Faction, and the first Atchievement he attributes to them, is, that they had sup­prest [Page 202]the Royal Authority. In a short time, says he, it was evident, this Faction having taken root in almost all the Provinces, put forth Branches so high, it cover'd and almost stifl'd the Authority Royal: 'Twas this League engag'd the whole Kingdom into a Party, whereof the King of Spain was the Head, and made the French sign a Treaty of Union against the Authority of their lawful Prince. 'Twas this League forc'd Henry the 3d to sign at the States of Blois this Holy Ʋnion; So that from King, says Mezeray, he became the head of a Cabal, and instead of being the common Father, declar'd himself an Enemy of one part of his Subjects. 'Twas this League, which in derogation of the Royal Authority, went to stab the Favorites of Henry the 3d almost in his bosome. And that poor Prince dis­arm'd of his authority, took pleasure and comfort in erecting Statues, and setting up Monuments for those they had robb'd him of by their barbarous assassinations: 'Twas this League endeavour'd by all means to render Henry the 3d odious, by insolent Sermons, by Confessions, wherein the Monks inspir'd their Penitents with an aversion a­gainst their Prince, and impos'd on them for Penance, a necessity to hate him. 'Twas this League, 1584. says Mezeray, [Page 203]which having heated the Zealous, stirred the Factious, and perswaded the Princes, began to rise, to List Soldiers, to make As­semblies, to choose Chiefs, at whose Sum­mons by Billet, though they own'd not themselves Heads of the Party, those who were Listed were oblig'd to repair to seve­ral places of Rendezvouz. 'Twas this Holy Ʋnion treated the same year with the Spa­niard, and made a League Offensive and Defensive to Exclude from the Crown its Lawful Heirs. 'Twas this League seiz'd a­gainst the Kings Authority all the Towns it could take in the Kingdom: And not con­tent with that, would have had permission from Rome, to attempt the King's Life, and for that end made Fa. Matthew the Jesuit take so many Journeys, that he was com­monly call'd the Courier of the League: Compare this design with the Enterprizes of Amboise and Meaux, and see which is the more Criminal. Our Protestants are ac­cus'd for having endeavour'd to free our Kings from the slavery they were kept in by Princes Strangers, yet you are well pleas'd that the same Princes Strangers should at­tempt their Lives: 'Twas this League brought the Rheiters into France in 1585. 1588. 'Twas this League unworthily chas'd away their King from his Capital Ci­ty [Page 204]at the Barricade of Paris, and obliged him to save himself by night in great disor­der, that he might escape being shut up in a Closter, shorn a Monk, perpetually Im­prison'd, and perhaps Murder'd. 'Twas this League call'd their Prince Tyrant, ex­communicated him, blotted his Name out of the publick Prayers, and caus'd Arms to be taken up against him on all sides, after the death of the Princes of Guise. In fine, 'twas this Holy League made for the preservation of the Catholick Faith, that assassinated the King at St. Clou, by the hands of a Jacobin Monk. Shall I proceed to expose other hor­rible actions of this Holy League, and what they did to hinder Henry the 4th from en­joying the Crown that belong'd to him? 'Tis not necessary, the memory of it is fresh, and all the World knows it: When you have recollected what you have heard, I cannot tell whether you will think it prudent in a Roman Catholick to hit us so confidently in the teeth with that Maxim; that Religion ought not to be defended by Arms; and that under pretence of Religion, nothing ought to be done that may any way hurt the Roy­al Authority.

Sir, give me leave to tell you, this Invective is unjust: You charge our Reli­gion with the Crimes of particular men: [Page 205]Do you believe the actions of the League were agreeable to the Principles of the Ca­tholick Religion?

If I did you injustice in that point, I did but requite you in kind for the like injustice you had done us: For you would make our Religion answerable for all the disorders happen'd forty years toge­ther in the Civil Wars of France, the last Age. Were it true, that Motives of Reli­gion only had engag'd the Reformed in those Wars, yet those Disorders ought not to be imputed to the Reformed Religion, whose Doctrine perswades not, nor inclines men to Revolt. But I affirm it, Sir, I do your Religion no wrong, if I lay to its charge all the Disorders and furious Enor­mities of the League. Because the Pope the Head and Author of your Religion was the Author and Promoter of that League; because there were publick Rejoyceings at Rome, and Te Deum sung for the Bartholo­maean Massacre: The Sieur du Maurier, Au­thor of the Memoirs of Holland will in­form you, that there is to be seen this day at Rome a piece of Picture, wherein is drawn the Massacre of the Admiral, with these words, Pontifex probat Colinij necem; the Pope approves of the killing of Coligny. This Massacre was committed before the [Page 206]League was hatch'd, and openly own'd, though it was then form'd, and acted with a furious vigor: The assassinate of Henry the 3d was approv'd by the Court of Rome. Publick Elogies were made in praise of him who committed the Assassinate, and pub­lick Invectives against him that was murde­red; this Prince, as well as Henry the 4th his Successor, was Excommunicated by the Pope: Their Subjects were absolv'd from their Oaths of Allegiance, and all the Pow­ers of Europe rais'd against them. All this, Sir, may we justly impute to your Religion, because the Religion of Rome, and the Ita­lian Divinity spread throughout Europe, au­thorize these Rebellions against Princes, when the great Article of your Religion is concern'd; which is, Obedience to the Pope. 'Tis the Pope assumes a power to deprive Kings of their Crowns, and to transfer their Estates to others; 'Tis the Pope authorizes the assassinates of Kings and sacred Persons, when these facts are perpetrated pursuant to their Bulls of Deposition; 'tis the Pope usurps the temporal Estate of the Emperour in Italy, and under pretence that the Em­perours had lost their Right by Heresy, made himself Soveraign of the City of Rome. 'Tis the Pope stiles himself Superiour to Kings, and makes Crown'd heads stoop to [Page 207]kiss his feet; 'tis the Pope trod on the necks of Emperors, applying to himself those words, The young Lion and the Adder shalt thou tread under thy feet; 'tis the Pope hath drown'd Germany with bloud, arming the Father against the Son, and the Son a­gainst the Father, to force from the Empe­rours the right of Investiture into the great Benefices. The times are much altered since the Popes call'd themselves the Emperours most humble Servants, and said they were but dust and ashes in their presence: I see there the Works of Gregory the Great, and could let you see in them the Style of the Popes in those days, when they writ to the Emperours; but I had rather let you see it in the Margin of Father Maimbourgh's Hi­story of Lutheranism: You will allow me who am a Hugonot, the pleasure (which is not small) to take out of the Margin of a Jesuits Book those words of St. Gregory, which the Ministers have so often quoted; Hist. Luth. lib. 11. Ann. 1530. Ego verò haec Dominis loquens, quid sum nisi pulvis & vermis, ego indignus famulus ve­ster? I that take the Liberty to speak thus to my Lords, what am I but dust, and a Worm, your unworthy Servant? You will do us a pleasure to read the Text of Fa. Maim­bourgh. This holy Bishop forbore not to [Page 208]execute what had been commanded him, ha­ving remain'd satisfy'd with making a most humble Remonstrance to the Emperour his Master in a Letter extreamly submissive. This vexes you, Sir, as it pleases us; I confess our joy may be tax'd of some malice but 'tis a matter so rare and so singular to hear a profest Jesuit, and one under the fourth vow, speak thus of a Pope, you will par­don us for being pleas'd with it; but the days are long since gone, when they spoke thus at Rome: The Popes have since those days assum'd and exercis'd a Power to De­pose Emperours and Kings, to declare them Tyrants, to raise their Subjects against them, when they do any thing the Popes pretend to be contrary to Religion: This is a mat­ter so publickly notorious, it hath been prov'd a hundred times. Now Sir, I will dare your Roman Catholicks to charge us with our pretended Rebellions, and having maintain'd our Religion by Arms; and give me leave to tell you, I wonder the pru­dence of your Churchman, and the interest of his Party, permitted him to renew the memory of our Wars for Religion; for he might have easily foreseen, we would not fail to expose to publick view so many hor­rible Conspiracies those of his Character and Religion every day plot and carry on [Page 209]in those Countreys where the Supremacy of the Pope is not acknowledg'd: If we acted a part in the Civil Wars of France, they cannot reproach us with having de­sign'd the murder of our Princes, and actu­ally assassinated them. We have never been charg'd with having design'd and endeavo­red to blow up with powder a whole State in a moment, not only the head but all its principal Members: We are now under great Sufferings in France; but amidst all our Sufferings, we glory that our very Ene­mies bear witness of our Fidelity and Inno­cence; but the Martyrs of your Church­man, those poor Catholicks, he laments and bewails, that they are cruelly put to death in England, under pretence of a pretended Conspiracy, are sufficiently convicted to have been tampering with as horrible an Enterprize as any hath been design'd this Age.

We have done with that, Sir, let's hear no more of it, I pray, whether the English Catholicks be guilty or not, let not us inquire further; this Gentleman hath said as much on that Subject as you can; do not attack us, you will find work enough to defend your selves; you think you have said enough, but you have not spoken a word of the last Wars you rais'd in the [Page 210]Kingdom; the Wars of Montauban, of Ro­chel, &c.

As to the Plot in England, you shall not scape so; you shall hear a great deal more of it, if you please; I know all this Gentleman said to you of it, he told you what he knew, but not all that may be known of it; such order is taken to hinder the transportation of authentick Copies of the Tryals of those Criminals in­to Foreign parts, we scarce know any thing of them; so that you are not to admire this Gentleman seem'd not throughly in­structed: But because that formidable Pam­phlet you took out of your pocket, charges us to have occasion'd a Persecution against the Catholicks in England, under pretence of a pretended Conspiracy, you must allow us to justify our selves a little more fully, and to add to what we have said, what is since come to our knowledge; but, If you please, I will first speak a word or two to the last Wars of Religion in France about the beginning of this Age: I am for plain dealing, I will never call evil good, nor good evil; I am of their number who can­not approve of these Wars, nor make it their business to justify them. The places of safety which had been given us were the seeds of this War; the King was desi­rous [Page 211]to have them put into his hands, the Hugonots were obstinately bent to retain them: It was ill done, without doubt they ought to have restor'd them, and to have rely'd on the Providence of God and the King's Justice. Yet this we have to say for our selves.

First, 'Tis not just to charge a whole body of men with that which was done but by a part: Perhaps three fourths of all the Protestants of France were for a Submission: These doubtless would have carry'd it both for Number and Prudence, but they were the weakest of the Party: The turbulent Spirits were Masters of all their Forces and Arms.

Secondly, We say the Religion of great men keeps them not from being ambitious: They reign in Confusions, and make them­selves formidable by raising Troubles, they abuse the simplicity of the People, and make them pay for the Follies and Crimes of those who abuse them: This was one cause of the last Wars; we had great men of our perswasion, who being in the head of a great Party, made themselves formidable at Court for the strong places they were Ma­sters of. These men foresaw that by the change of Affairs design'd at Court, their Credit and their Pensions would be lost; [Page 212]they did all they could to bear up them­selves, and engag'd in their Quarrel the peo­ple, whose Zeal is always sufficiently igno­rant and ill enough guided. Methinks some charity ought to be had for people who have no ill intention, but only the mis­fortune to permit themselves to be seduc'd, by mistaking interests of Religion: It must be considered also that most of those who took Arms were frightned into it: Our E­nemies who desir'd nothing more than to see us rise, that they might take that occa­sion to destroy us, caus'd Rumors to be spread, that there was a design to massacre all the Hugonots; that it was agreed by a secret Article in the Treaty of Spain, and of the Marriages lately made: The pressing so earnestly to have again into the King's hands the places of strength given by his Father to the Protestants, heightned our suspicion. The horrible Image of the Mas­sacres and Torments of the last Age, was fresh in memory; many had been Specta­tors, and some had been Sufferers in those horrible Tragedies. The fear of seeing like days again drove them out of their Wits, and hurried them into a design to prevent Calamities that appear'd otherwise inevita­ble: This is a truth to which the late King of glorious memory bears witness in his [Page 213]Declaration of the 10th of Nov. 1615. And that great Prince found in that Source of the War, a reason to excuse it. When he says, The poor people having too lightly believ'd there were designes against their Lives, had precipitated themselves into this Enterprize, thinking themselves forc'd into it for their just and lawful defence: Besides, if you con­sider with what Spirit our Protestants were animated in the last Wars, you will find some cause to excuse them; perhaps there was in their Conduct somewhat of the spi­rit of that Governour who writ to Tiberias, The Empire is yours, my Government is mine. That is, they were jealous of their Liberties and Priviledges to that degree, they would not have them infring'd in the least; but you cannot with justice charge them to have been animated with a Spirit of Contempt, or hatred, or revolt against their Soveraign. All their design was to Cantonize them­selves to preserve their Religion; this only excepted, they were always ready to sacri­fice all for the Grandeur of their King and the good of the State: This is acknow­ledg'd more than once by the Roman Catho­lick Historians. After all, these Troubles ended about threescore years since cannot be at this day a lawfull Cause for revoking the Edicts of Pacification; because our [Page 214]Kings have defac'd the memory of those Troubles by so many Declarations, and have confirmed by their Royal words fre­quently and solemnly given us, the favours they had granted us. Good God! where is that integrity? what's become of that sincerity and good faith men ought to pra­ctice? Will they never call to mind that there is in Heaven a God faithful to his pro­mises, who threatens vengeance on those who violate Treaties and Alliances?

Gentlemen, I cannot endure you should make such a noise about pretended breaches of words. Is not a King always Master of his Arrests and Declarations? Is any thing more ordinary than to see that revok'd at one time which hath been esta­blish'd at another? Is a Prince charg'd to have dealt falsly or deceitfully when he charges or revokes some Laws he had made?

Let me intreat you, Sir, not to permit your self to be misled and impos'd upon by that sorry argument so often brought against us: Consider, I pray, there is a great deal of difference between Sump­tuary Laws, or Regulations of Proceedings in Suits Criminal or Civil, and Treaties bonâ fide made with Subjects, and People who are or enter under the Dominion of a [Page 215]Prince. A Soveraign may revoke Sumptu­ary Laws and alter the forms of Proceed­ings which have been heretofore, but are not now useful to the State, because they are not Treaties; he made not these Laws irrevocable, he was not engag'd, he did not promise any he would not revoke them, but in the Edicts of Pacification, our Kings treated with Men in the presence of God, they engag'd themselves to allow them some Liberties and preserve them: They pro­mis'd this solemnly without reserving a Power of Revocation. It cannot be de­ny'd, but the Councel of France is univer­sally blam'd, for looking upon all Treaties made with those who are, or enter under the King's Dominion as Toys to play with and deceive the simple, and false Dice to cheat those who mean honestly and act fair­ly. For those many years the United Pro­vinces have had in their subjection Bolduc and Mastricht, Cities wherein the Roman Catholicks have all manner of Liberty, and the Burgesses great Priviledges, they have not fail'd to observe to a tittle the Treaties and Capitulations agreed on. I heard read the other day the Record of what was transacted upon the voluntary surrender of Sedan to the King: There cannot be a thing fairer than the Priviledges the King grants [Page 216]to the Town and the Religion then predo­minant there: Nothing more solemn than the manner of their mutual engagement, by an Oath of Fidelity on the Subjects part, and on the part of the Soveraign, by the Liberties he allows them; but the memory of all this is vanish'd. When we mention these Treaties at Court, all the answer we have is, The King's mind is alter'd. This Conduct (which is observ'd in matters of State as well as of Religion) does France a greater injury than can be imagin d; it renders the French Government intolera­ble, at a time when France would have it appear the most easy: The People of Flan­ders and the Franche Comte lately conque­red, retain to this day an affection for Spain, and groan under a Yoke which is not at present very heavy; 'tis because they know the Priviledges and Liberties they en­joy, shall not last long; there is more danger than you think of in this manner of pro­ceeding; for the World never wants some Factious Spirits who mind not that other mens sins cannot justify or excuse them in theirs; they forget that the faults of Princes against their Subjects do not authorize Sub­jects to rebel against their Princes; they frequently say to one another, We are not obliged to keep our words with him that breaks [Page 217]his with us: Fregit fidem, frangatur ei­dem. You see you have carry'd us a great way from the place we were at; but you will think it fit, Sir, that we return thither again, and speak now of the Conspiracy in England.

You are strangely in love with that Subject. Let me lead you where I will, you are still for returning thither. And what shall you get by it? All you can say is over­thrown in one word: It is constantly de­ny'd there is one word of truth in all that story.

'Tis for that very reason, Sir, we return so often to that Subject. Can you think it fit we should patiently endure our selves to be charg'd to have invented by the most Diabolical malice that ever was conceiv'd, a Romance, a Fable (such as you suppose the History of this Conspiracy to be) out of a form'd design and of set pur­pose to destroy the Honour, the Estates, and the Lives of Millions of innocent Per­sons? What proof have we ever given, that we are capable of so horrible a Trea­son? I know very well, you will object the same to us, and ask what colour there is to believe, that you Catholicks could have conspir'd to massacre Millions of Innocents: And that 'tis as probable the Protestants [Page 218]have invented this Plot to destroy the Ca­tholicks, as that the Catholicks have entred into a Conspiracy to destroy the Protestants: But, Sir, the presumptions are far stronger, if not altogether for us: 'Tis not to be found in History, we ever plotted infernal Devices like this, to destroy our Countrey­men, or charg'd them with such black Crimes to ruin them: On the contrary, the History and memory of Men yet living, in­form us, 'tis ordinary with the misguided Zealots of your Religion to make Parties and enter into Conspiracies for extermi­nating by Poison, Fire, and Sword, those they call Hereticks. So that 'tis more just to charge your Catholicks with a Crime or­dinary with them, than to charge us Prote­stants with a wicked action, which no Age can shew we ever were guilty of.

You suppose that which we say is a Calumny; that 'tis ordinary with us to en­deavour to get rid of Hereticks by Poison, Fire, and Sword.

Alas, Sir, have you already forgot all I said t' you but now, and you ne­ver contradicted? I mean, all those Massa­cres and Torments you have put the Prote­stants to; if you speak of Conspiracies, take but the pains to read your own Au­thors, they will sufficiently inform you. [Page 219]'Tis the policy of your Bigots to deny con­fidently the clearest matters of fact, and things most notorious and generally ac­knowledg'd; the method they take is not altogether ill, for if they cannot deceive the World, they will impose upon some; but this hinders not the Catholick Histo­rians (who value themselves on their honour and sincerity) to give us relations of things as they really were: To this day your English Catholicks deny the Powder-Plot in 1605. and maintain it was an invention of Cecils: Notwithstanding all this, Mezeray hath in­geniously given us the History of that Plot, without regarding in the least the impu­dence of the Conspirators, who said (as at this day) 'twas a Crime falsly charg'd upon them to take an occasion to destroy them: If you will not believe me, here is Mezeray, read him; Jan. 1606. The great­est part of these last (says he) re­tir'd to Calais, where the King had com­manded the Governour to allow them refuge; those who govern'd his Conscience having pre­sently perswaded him, 'twas a pure Persecution rais'd by the Ministers against the Catholick Religion. 'Tis their custom, you see, to conspire, and stoutly to deny the Conspi­racy discover'd; but the evident proofs, every day produces, make out the truth of [Page 220]this last Plot, and the falseness of their As­sertions who deny it.

Sir, before we enter on this business, I pray I may be allow'd to make my Confession: I confess that the last year when I discours'd this Gentleman about our affairs, I was not throughly inform'd of the State of those in England: For instance, I said, Oates and Bedlow were not turn'd Pro­testants; I have since learnt the contrary, and that they turn'd Protestants assoon as they had given in their Depositions; being convinc'd by our Divines, that Religion which authorized such designs, could not be the true. But I pretend not that this doth in the least invalidate their Testimony, they were the honester men for turning Protestants; but let them have been of what Religion they will, if they believe there is a God and a Hell, 'tis not imaginable they could be so desperately wicked to damn themselves in a frolick, by inventing so long and horrible a story against millions of In­nocent people: And as I was ill inform'd concerning the Religion of Oates and Bed­low, I was no better inform'd, as to the num­ber of Witnesses who made Oath in that business. Of all the Tryals of the Conspi­rators having read only two or three, I knew none of the Witnesses but those two against [Page 221]whom the Jesuits of St. Omers publish'd so many Libels. I said not a word to you of the Depositions of Prance, Dugdale, Jen­nison, Dangerfield, and several others; and the truth is, they endeavour to perswade us on this side the Sea, that all this great af­fair hangs only on the Testimony of two pit­tiful Rascals; but by the Tryals of the other Conspirators, we have seen the Depositions of Dugdale, who said he had seen a Letter of Whitebread, Provincial of the Jesuits in England, wherein he advis'd one of the Conspirators, to make choice of bold and desperate men to execute the design, and that it matter'd not whether they were Gentlemen or not: This Dugdale hath sworn he was engag'd into the Plot by Ga­van, and several others; that he knew of several Meetings at Boscobel, at Tixal, and other places, where my Lord Stafford, my Lord Peters, Levison, and many others were present to find out a means to destroy the King and set up Popery; that afterwards Harcourt the Jesuit, made choice of him to be one of the Assassins; and that Gavan another Jesuit, had often endeavor'd to per­swade him it was not only lawful but meri­torious to kill any one for the advancement of Religion; that he fetch'd proofs out of Scripture, and instanc'd Garnet for an Ex­ample, [Page 222]whose Reliques had wrought Mira­cles; and that he assur'd him he should be Canoniz'd for this action. If this be com­par'd with the Tryals of Barriere, John Guignard, John Chatell, and Ravillac, and with the History of Garnet the English Je­suit, whom they have made a Martyr; and you reflect upon the Chamber of Meditati­ons into which the Jesuits put them, they would prepare for such extraordinary acti­ons; it will appear this Evidence hath not the ayr of fiction, and that nothing is more agreeable to the ordinary Conduct and Principles of the Jesuits. The same man swears, Harcourt the Jesuit was the first gave him the news of Sir Edmundbury-Godfrey's death, in these words, This night Sir Edmundbury-Godfrey hath been di­spatch'd. In Langhorn's Tryal he says that Ewers the Jesuite had differ'd with him a­bout the Murder of Godfrey: Dugdale ha­ving told the Jesuit, he would be hang'd if this spoil'd not the whole business, the Je­suit answer'd, that Godfrey was a great Per­secutor of Night-walkers and lewd people, and it would be easily believ'd one of them had murder'd him in revenge. In the same Tryal he deposes, that in the Conferences the Jesuits of the Plot had with him, he learnt they were to have an Army in readi­ness [Page 223]for a Massacre when they had assassina­ted the King; that once they were in a mind to begin with the Massacre, but after­wards alter'd the project: In Wakeman's Tryal the same Witness deposes further, that my Lord Stafford had promis'd to pay him before-hand five hundred Pounds Sterling, to kill the King with Pistol, Ponyard, or otherwise; that Ewers the Jesuit when he shewd him Harcourt's Letter, which brought the news of Godfrey's Death, said, That Godfrey was grown a little too inquisitive, and that they had done well in killing him. Prance another Witness deposes, That Har­court the Jesuit paying him for an Image of the Virgin, told him there was a Plot against the King's Life; that Fenwick, Ireland, and Grove had said in his presence, there should be in readiness an Army of fifty thousand men to establish the Catholick Religion; and that my Lords, Powis, Bellasis, and Arundel were to command it. That when Prance com­plain'd the poor Tradesmen would be ru­in'd, and have nothing to do in a time of War; it was answer'd, He need not trouble himself for that, he should have imployment enough, to make Images for the Churches. The same Witness in the Tryals of Green, Berry, and Hill, gives in his Deposition the whole Story of the Murder of Godfrey: He says, That to agree the manner of that Mur­der, [Page 224]they had several Meetings at an Ale­house at the sign of the Plow; that they la­bour'd much to perswade him it was no Crime to kill a turbulent and over-busy man; that the project being agreed they had dogg'd God­frey several times; that at last about nine a Clock at night, the Conspirators having obser­ved Godfrey returning from St. Clements, Lawrence Hill went to the Gate toward the street, and meeting Sir Edmund, intreated him to come and part two men who were a fighting by the Water-side; that Godfrey ha­ving follow'd Hill, when they had him at the end of the Pales, Hill flung a cord about his neck and strangled him; that Green finding he was not quite dead, wrung his neck about; that having kept the Corps some days, and car­ried it from place to place, at last they laid it a cross a Horse-back, carried it into the fields, and threw it into a Ditch, having first run his Sword through his body. Robert Jennison another Witness in Wakeman's Tryal depo­ses, he had heard Ireland one of the Con­spirators say, that the Roman Catholick Re­ligion was to be shortly set up in England; that there was but one person could hinder it, and that they could easily poison the King; that the same Ireland being told by the Depo­nent, that the King went a Hunting and a Fishing with a very thin Guard, said he should [Page 225]be very glad they were rid of the King: In Stafford's Tryal, the same Jennison deposes, that in the Meetings of the Priests and Jesu­its he had been at, he heard them say, It was necessary for the Good of the Catholick Religion, to alter the Government, and to re­form it after the model of France; that Ire­land a Priest had solicited him to come along with him to help him to dispatch the King; that the same Priest had ask'd him, if he knew any brave and resolute Irish-men fit to give that great blow. That being in Harcourt's Chamber with many other Jesuits, he had heard them say, that if C. R. would not be R. C. he should not be long C. R. the mean­ing whereof was, that if Charles Rex would not be a Roman Catholick, he should not long be Charles Rex; that they made him take the Sacrament and an Oath of Secrecy, and than discovered to him the whole Plot. In the same Tryal Smith declares, that ha­ving been born a Protestant, Abbot Mo­nutague and Father Gascoyne had labour'd at Paris to make him a Roman Catholick; tel­ling him, that in a short time the Catholick Religion should be the praedominant Religion in England; that having design'd to go to Rome, and passing through Provence in his way to Italy, they had oblig'd him to many Conferences with Cardinal Grimaldi, who [Page 226]at last perswaded him to turn Catholick; and that he was made Priest: That Cardinal Grimaldi told him, he had Correspondence with many great English Lords, that he was very well assur'd the Roman Catholick Reli­gion should be prevalent in England; but that there was one man they must be rid of, and that was the King; that in truth he was a good Man, but however he must be made a­way, because he was an Obstacle to their De­signs: The same Witness says, that having left Provence, he went into the English Col­ledge at Rome, where he continued long; and that he heard the Jesuits say in their Sermons and ordinary discourse, That the King of England was not truly King, be­cause he was an Heretick, and that whoever kill'd him should do a very meritorious act. And when he and five or six more were rea­dy to leave that house, the Fathers earnest­ly exhorted them to maintain that Maxim, That People are not oblig'd to obey the King of England. And that they should take care to instruct accordingly in Confession, all those they should find capable to enter into this great design. There is another Wit­ness, Dennis by name, a Roman Catholick, and a Jacobine Monk; and such at the time of his Deposition, having neither quitted his Religion nor Order. This Monk depo­ses, [Page 227]that being in Spain at Madrid, in the Chamber of James Lenck an Irish-man, Arch-Bishop of Tuam; this Arch-Bishop told him, That Dr. Oliver Plunket was to be imploy'd very speedily to procure Succours from France, to be sent into Ireland for main­taining the Catholick Religion in Ireland and England, and that be the Arch-Bishop would in a short time go in person into that Countrey to advance so pious a work. The same Witness deposes, that the Earl of Carling­ford s Brother caus'd great Sums of Money to be levy'd in the Covents; and that they said openly, this money was design'd for the bringing over an Army into Ireland, when time should serve. Edward Turbervil, ano­ther Witness, swears expresly, That Stafford being lodg'd at Paris at the corner of Beaufort­street, the Deponent came to him, and stay'd with him several days: That Stafford having taken an Oath of Secrecy from him not to dis­cover what he should trust him with, he told him at last, they were in search of one to kill the King of England, who was an Heretick, and consequently no King, but rather a Re­bel against Almighty God, and that he solicited him to undertake this great A­ction.

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Here Sir, are a great many Witnesses be­sides Oates and Bedlow, who swear as home as they: Can any reasonable man imagine, there can be found so many Infernal Spirits (as here are Witnesses) capable to invent so horrible a Calumny to destroy a Religion and all that profess it? And if it were pos­sible to suborn one Witness or two, have you ever seen a president of such a Subor­nation that hath gain'd so great a number of Witnesses? Besides, what is there improba­ble in this History of the Plot? Is it not the Spirit and Custom of your Bigots and blind Zealots to use such means as these to pro­mote their Religion? Read the Life of Queen Elizabeth, and you will find she was no sooner delivered from one Conspiracy, but another was fram'd against her. The words of Stafford who passes for a Martyr among you, are remarkable.

In his Speech to the Lord High-Steward, Stafford's Tryal, pag. 200. and the Peers, his Judges, he declares, That he did believe, those of the Roman Religion had (since the Reformation of the Church of England) en­tred into several most wicked and most dan­gerous Conspiracies; particularly the Conspira­cy of Babington, and that of the Earl of Westmorland, or the Northern Rebellion raised by the Papists in Queen Elizabeth 's [Page 229]time. He declares further, That he believ'd, there was a wicked Conspiracy in the Reign of King James, wherein some of the Conspirators were Roman-Catholicks, and some Prote­stants. And that after this followed that ex­ecrable Plot, called The Gunpowder-Trea­son: And when Sir, could they have made choice of a more favourable time wherein to revive and reduce into practise those bloudy Maxims, than a time when they as­sur'd themselves, and were fully perswaded, they should find a King of their Religion in the Person of his Royal Highness? 'Tis true the King of England hath been favou­rable to them in tolerating them; but they were notsatisfy'd with this, and having lost all hopes of prevailing with him to turn Ro­man Catholick, they look'd upon his Life as a great Obstacle to their Designs, for it made them lose time, and they had reason to fear the Protestants in the interim might discover the design; so that it was their interest speedily to make away a King, who possess'd the place of him from whom they promis'd themselves a full re-establishment of the Roman Catholick Religion in England. Recollect the Evidence, add to it the Let­ters and Memoirs that were seiz'd, and the Murder of Godfrey, and I will justify it, a man must have the Forehead of a [Page 230]Jesuit to deny there was a Plot. The Me­moirs and Letters are very numerous, you may read them in the printed Tryals; par­ticularly you will find a great Collection of them printed with Stafford's Tryal. But, pray Sir, remember Coleman's Letter, I spoke to you of last year; that alone is enough to stop the mouths of those who dare say this Plot is an invention of the Protestants. To which Calumny we will constantly op­pose, as an impenetrable Buckler, the words of that Letter, acknowledg'd by Coleman to be his. We have here a mighty work upon our hands, no less than the Conversion of three Kingdoms, and by that perhaps the utter sub­duing of a Pestilent Heresy which has domi­neer'd over great part of this Northern World a long time: Coleman 's Tryal, pag. 69. I said not a word t' you of another Letter as plain as this, which you may see in Ireland's and Grove's Tryals, where you will find words to this effect. Every one had notice not to make too much hast to London, nor to be there long before the day appointed, nor to ap­pear much in the Town, before the Congregati­on was ended, for fear of giving cause to sus­pect the Design. This Letter doth not tell us what was the design of this famous As­sembly, but it lets us see, they had some great design in hand, and the Plot being [Page 231]discover'd at the same time, 'tis not hard to guess what it was: It hath been prov'd be­fore the House of Commons, that upon the first discovery of the Plot, one of the Lords accus'd to have had a hand in it, writ to a­nother of the same Lords then in Stafford­shire, that their designs were discover'd, and that he should use his best endeavours to conceal all such their Catholick Friends as were concern'd in that affair. This Let­ter was found by a Justice of the Peace in the house of that Lord to whom it was di­rected, upon the search made for Arms in Roman Catholick houses, and was produc'd to the Commons in Parliament with all the Witnesses, to whom it was shew'd the mo­ment it was found.

You have reason to wish, Gentlemen, that my Friend here had not been any better instructed than formerly in these matters, but had still continued under his mistake; that Oates and Bedlow had not chang'd their Religion, but remain'd Ro­man Catholicks after the Plot discover'd; for the pains he hath taken to inform him­self, have made him acquainted with many particulars which cannot please you, since they make it clearly appear there was a Plot.

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We might have easily known all this already, being taken all out of those Tryals printed in several Languages; but since you make use of them, you will allow me to do so; and give me leave to ask you whether the clearing of Wakeman, the Queen of England's Physitian, be not an evident proof that all your Witnesses are false Witnesses? For they are in effect no other. Oates and Bedlow charg'd Wakeman to have treated for fifteen thousand pounds, for poysoning the King: Here are two Wit­nesses, enough to Condemn a Man. Here is in question one of the principal Crimes laid to the charge of the pretended Conspi­rators, their design to make away the King, yet this man is acquitted by his Judges. It necessarily follows, your two famous Wit­nesses were taken for false Witnesses; and if they were not to be credited against Wake­man, why should they be credited against the rest?

Do not say, Sir, that the clearing of Sir George Wakeman is a proof of his innocence, or of the falshood of the Evidence; say rather, that the Chief Ju­stice who sate at that Tryal, hath been since impeach'd before the Peers of England in Parliament; and had the Parliament continued sitting, perhaps that Judge had [Page 233]smarted for it: The King was not very well satisfy'd of Wakeman's innocence after his Acquittal: For that Poyson Merchant ha­ving had the confidence to appear at Court after his enlargement, the King caus'd him to be turn'd out with shame.

There is one thing sticks still very hard with me as to this Plot; that of twelve or fifteen Persons who have been executed for the pretended Conspiracy, not one con­fest himself guilty in the least. When Men are ready to appear before God, the Mask falls off it self; the fear of Hell softens the hardness of their hearts: You shall not see a Malefactor but discharges his Conscience at his death; if some of them were hard­ned enough to deny to the death, yet sure one or other of them would have confess'd something; but there hath not been one of them who did not protest to the last he was innocent. Consider after what manner dy'd Stafford, and Plunket, the Primate of Ireland, who were Persons of Honour and Quality.

It surprizes me, Sir, to hear you make their obstinate Silence an Argu­ment of their innocence; every day we see Criminals, who to save their Credit, and have the pleasure of saying they dye inno­nocent, resist the most violent Tortures: [Page 234]Yet you cannot comprehend, how Men who have long fortify'd their Courage, and pre­par'd for an Enterprize, the most dangerous that may be, have the power to keep till death, a Secret, on which depends not only their Honour, but the preservation of all the Roman Catholicks in England: Had they confess'd themselves Guilty, they must have named their Complices; and in so do­ing, they would have destroy'd an infinite number of People, and render'd their Re­ligion abominable in the World, by making it appear, it inspires into its Votaries such horrible Sentiments, and gives Birth to such furious designs: These Considerations are of weight and strength sufficient to keep the weakest of Men from revealing a Secret of this importance. When the Powder-Plot was discover'd in 1605. not one of the Conspirators confest; and nothing had ever been prov'd upon them out of their own mouths, had not the Judges had the inge­nuity to cause Garnet and Hall to be im­prison'd in two Dungeons, where they could speak to one another; and in the Wall be­tween the Dungeons, there was a place they plac'd two Witnesses in, who heard all the Prisoners said, and gave so exact an Account of their Discourse, that they confest all: But would you know the cause they keep [Page 235]their Secrets so well? 'Tis the horrible Oath they impose on all those who enter into such Conspiracies: Read Mezeray, where I have left him open. The last of Ja­nuary, eight of the principal Conspirators were executed at London for High-Treason; not one of them accus'd the Priests or the Monks, for they were oblig'd to Secrecy by terrible Oaths. To satisfy you fully in this particular, I will let you see the form of the Oath administred to all those who en­tred into this last Plot. There is a Copy of it.

Well Sir, and what say you of this? This comes from good hands; from a great house allyed to that of Eng­land: But had it fallen from the Clouds, we might have known it by the Character; had it been a forg'd piece, it must needs have been made by a Roman Catholick, and one deeply vers'd in the Cabal of these blind Zealots; for there is not a Protestant, and but few Roman Catholicks, who understand [Page 238]the style and conduct of this Cabal with so much perfection, as he must have done, who should invent this form of an Oath. And now, Sir, you may, if you can, draw from the silence of the Conspirators an Ar­gument against the truth of the Plot.

Since you are so much for answer­ing, I should be very glad, Sir, to hear what you have to say to the business of my Lord Howard, and the Earl of Shaftsbury: This last will be shortly convicted of ha­ving suborn'd Witnesses against the Queen of England, and the Duke of York, to make them Complices in the Plot. May not he who would have suborn'd Witnesses against the Queen and first Prince of the Bloud, be rationally presum'd to have su­born'd Witnesses against five or six pitiful Priests?

We hope, Sir, the innocence of the Earl of Shaftsbury will save him. Perhaps it will be objected, he may be more for a Republican Government, than may befit the Subject of a Monarchy; but we cannot believe him capable of the base actions he is charg'd with. If he miscarry, he will not be the first innocent person hath perish'd by the malice of false Witnesses: Can any thing be clearer, than that this Charge against him is a Counter-battery rai­sed [Page 239]by your Catholicks? Nothing can be more proper to make men suspect, that all hath been said of the Plot, is meerly fictiti­ous, than to produce men to testify, En­deavours have been us'd to suborn them: For if Endeavours have been us'd to suborn them, why not to suborn others? I won­der only this act of the Tragedy began so late: 'Tis true, we may see something of it in Wakeman's Tryal and in Dugdale's Depo­sitions: For this Witness tells us, he had seen a Letter sent from Paris to St. Omers, from St. Omers to London, from London to Tixal, wherein it was advis'd, That the Presbyterians should be accus'd of a Design against the King's Life, which would oblige those of the Church of England to joyn with the Catholicks to destroy the Presbyterians. Observe now the Event of this Counsel: The Earl of Shaftsbury is look'd upon as the head of the Presbyterians; the Presbyterians are the great Enemies of the Conspirators, and labour with most Zeal the Discovery of the Plot. We must destroy their Credit, say you, and charge them with the blackest of Crimes; and who are the Witnesses made use of against the Earl of Shaftsbury? They are all Roman Catholicks: Can you think it a hard matter in a business where the safety of a whole Party and of the [Page 240] Roman Religion is at stake, to find five or six persons who will Sacrifice themselves to save the honour of their Religion, and the Life of their Patriarchs? And how do they Sacrifice themselves? Their Ghostly Fa­thers perswade them, that to bear false Witness against Shaftsbury, the great Enemy of the Roman Church, is so far from being an offence to God, that they do him very considerable Service in it. So that instead of one or two, I believe they may find a hundred false Witnesses in this affair; and this is the cause honest men are so much in fear for the Life of that Lord. But let us suppose things to be as you would have them; let us put the Case that Shaftsbury is the most wicked of men; doth it follow, that because out of hatred to the Roman Religion, and for Excluding the Duke of York from the Succession, he would have suborn'd some Witnesses against the Queen and the Duke; he must therefore have fra­med and invented this long train of Con­spiracies and that multitude of particular matters of Fact, Letters, Meetings, and Consultations, that appear in the History of the Plot? Doth it follow, that because he would have suborn'd Witnesses, he must therefore succeed in it? Or if he hath had the fortune to find one Wretch or two ca­pable [Page 241]to be Suborn'd, is it probable he could have found out so great a number? Hath he search'd England and Ireland all over, to scum out for his purpose all the Rascals ca­pable to give and maintain a false Testimo­ny? How many Witnesses have been pro­duc'd about the Plot in Ireland? Hath the Earl of Shaftsbury Suborn'd them too? Is this probable, Sir, or will any man believe it?

This probably is all you have to say to us about the Plot in England; I think it high time to put an end to our Dis­course, it hath been somewhat long; you may well be weary of speaking as we are of hearing.

We should have had much more to say to you, if we were allow'd to speak, and could produce all the proofs the Cabal hath found the means to bury: Had we but seen Plunket's Tryal, we could with­out doubt have added many things to what you have heard: And if it were in our pow­er to discover the Mysteries of the Irish Plot, we should certainly stop their Mouths, who say, the reason of our ill usage in France, is that the King may revenge the Outrages, done to the Roman Catholicks in England.

Gentlemen, if you please, before we make an end, because I am in the humour of making Retractations and Con­fessions, [Page 242]I will confess t' you, that speaking last year of the death of King Charles the 1st, and how great a share the Jesuits had in his Death, I gave you but a very imper­fect account. I have since search'd into the bottom of that affair; and, if you please, will acquaint you what I have learnt. Du Moulin's An­swer to Phila­nax Anglicus. pag. 58. I must tell you then, that 'tis known when the late King of England was Be­headed, there was a Roman Priest a Confessour, who having seen the King's Head cut off, flourish'd his Sword, and with Demonstrations of extraordinary joy, cryed out, Now we are rid of our greatest Enemy. There is proof, that the News of the King's Death being come to Roan, and discours'd in a great Company of men very well instructed in the Myste­ries of the Zealous Cabal; one of them spoke thus: Pag. 58, 59. The King of England had promis'd us at his Marriage, that the Catholick Religion should be re-esta­blish'd in England, and because he put it off from time to time, we often call'd upon him to perform his promise; we were so plain, as to tell him, That if he did it not we should be forc'd to make use of means to destroy him: We gave him fair warning, and because he would not follow our advice, nor keep his [Page 243]Word with us, we have kept ours with him. A Gentleman of honour, a Protestant, who was in the Company, gave me this Relation. The Author who produces this Proof, pro­duces also a Letter from a Secretary of State, who was actually in the Service of the Crown, when the Accusation was brought against the Jesuits about the Death of the King; this Secretary, whose name was Morrice, in answer to a Letter from the Author of the Accusation, says to this pur­pose. I am not allow'd, nor does it become me to make Conjectures, or draw Consequences from the Orders his Majesty gave me concer­ning you, beyond what he hath precisely exprest. You know in what trust and capacity I serv'd his Majesty, Pag. 64. and what it was my duty to say, and whereof to be silent: But this I may safely say, and will do it confident­ly, that many Arguments did create a violent suspicion, very near convincing Evidences, that the Irreligion of the Papists was chiefly guilty of the Murder of that Excellent Prince, the Odium whereof they would now file to the account of the Protestant Religion. The same Author adds, That a Protestant, a little before the King's death, met upon the Road from Roan to Diep, a Company of Jesuits, who taking him for a Catholick, told him they were going into the Army [Page 244]of the Independants in England, and that they would make work enough there. An English Lady at Paris, being seduc'd by a Jesuit, turn'd Roman Catholick; soon after came the news of the King of England's Death: The Jesuit visiting the Lady, found her all in Tears for this lamentable Acci­dent. Madam, says the Jesuit smiling, you have no reason to lament what hath happened, the Catholicks are delivered of the greatest Enemy they had, and his Death will be much to the advantage of the Catholick Religion. The Lady angry at this discourse, sent the Jesuit packing down Stairs, and conceiv'd such horrour against the Roman Catholick Religion, she would never after endure to hear speak of it. A very understanding Man visiting the Monks at Dunkirk, that he might sound them what they thought of the King's Death, said, That the Jesuits had labour'd much to bring about that great work: A Monk answer'd, That the Jesuits always assum'd to themselves the credit of every great Work; but that their order had contri­buted to this as much if not more than they. 'Tis certain there was an universal Joy in all the English Seminaries on this side the Sea, for the Death of the King: They thought themselves so sure of their Designs, that the Benedictines were taking care how [Page 245]to prevent the Jesuits from possessing them­selves of the Lands belonging to their or­der; and the Nuns quarrell'd among them­selves who should be Lady Abbesses: To conclude, the same Author reports, That he offer'd to prove in due course of Law, Pag. 61, 62. his Charge against the Jesuits for the Death of the King; but that he was unwilling to publish his Proofs before hand, lest those who were guilty of the Charge, might have opportunity to get them out of the way or destroy them. I do not understand English, but I got a Friend of mine who does, to Translate me this Book, being, an Answer to a Book, en­tituled, Philanax Anglicus. I remember these Particulars in it, which, in my opini­on, sufficiently prove, that the Charge of the King's Death on the Roman Catho­licks, is not altogether groundless; but I begin to be sensible we abuse your patience: Therefore, Gentlemen, we will break off here, and take our Leaves.

I wish'd them gone a quarter of an hour ago: The Lawyer, as he took out of his Pocket the Oath he gave us to read, dropt a Paper I took up, and having half open'd it, I spy'd written a top, To the King: I folded it up again and he never perceiv'd me: I long extreamly to see what it is: Let's read it.

What think you of it, Sir?

I am not surpriz'd at it; these poor People are so restless in their misery, 'tis no wonder they toss and tumble themselves e­very way; but they are very simple, if they think they can find a way to convey such a Paper to His Majesty, the Avenues are all block'd up. And should it come to the Kings Hands, he is beset round with those shall take effectual order he shall not alter his Mind: I should think it best to let them have it again, but that if you restore it, they will [Page 256]bevex'd we have seen it. 'Tis better pre­tend we know nothing of it, nor say a word of it to them; they will think they have lost it elsewhere.

I will be advis'd by you. Fare­wel, Sir, 'tis high time to leave you to your Repose.