To the Right Honourable The Conncil of State.
The humble Petition of several Gentlemen, Justices of Peace, Ministers of the Gospel, and People, within the County of Lancaster, whose names are subscribed.
THat George Fox and James Naylor, are persons disaffected to Religion, and the wholesome Laws of this Nation; and that since their coming into this Country, have broached Opinions tending to the destruction of the relation of Subjects to their Magistrates, Wives to their Husbands, Children to their Parents, Servants to their Masters, Congregations to their Ministers, and of a people to their God: And have drawn much people after them; many whereof (men women, and little children) at their meetings are strangely wrought upon in their bodies, and brought to fall, foam at the mouth, roar, and swell in their bellies. And that some of them affirmed [Page 2] themselves to be equal with God, contrary to the late Act, as hath been attested at a late Quarter-Sessions holden at Lancaster in October last past; and since that time, acknowledged before many Witnesses; besides many other dangerous Opinions, and damnable Heresies, as appears by a Schedule hereunto annexed; with the names of the Witnesses subscribed.
- 1. George professed and auowed that he was equal with God,
- 2. He professed himself to be the eternal Judge of the world.
- 3. He said he was the Judge of the world.
- 4. He said he was the Christ, the way, the truth, the life.
- 5. He said, Whosoever took a place of Scripture, and made a Sermon of it, and from it, was a Conjurer, and his Preaching Conjuration.
- 6. He said that the Scripture was carnal.
James Milner, a follower of the said Fox, professeth himself to be God and Christ; and gives out Prophecies.
- 1. That the day of Judgment so all be the 15. day of Novemb.
- 2. That there shall never Judge sit at Lancaster again.
- 3. That he must ere long shake the foundations of the great Synagogue, meaning the Parliament.
Leonard Fell professeth that Christ had never any body but his Church.
Richard Hubberthorn wrot, that Christs coming in the flesh was but a figure.
The Answer of George Fox, to the Matters falsly charged upon him, by the Petition and Schedule aforesaid.
THat George Fox and James Nayler, are Object. Persons disaff [...]cted to Religion.
Answ. Whereas we are accused as Persons disaffected to Religion, it is false, for pure Religion we own in our souls, which is, to visit the Fatherless, and releive the Widows, and to keep our selves unspotted from the world, and dwelling in purity; this we own in our souls. But he that doth seem to be religions, and hath not power over his own Jam. 1. 26. 27. tongue, his Religion is vain; and that Religion we do deny; and all them that do profess the Scriptures in words, and live Mat. 23. 27. not the life of them, but live in drunkenness and uncleanness, envy and maliciousness: and all they that do profess Religion, Jer. 5. 31. and make a trade of the Scriptures, both Preists and People we do deny.
Object. Disuffected to the wholesome Laws of the Nation.
Answ. Justice (the wholesome Law of God) we own; and this is a terrour to the unjust, unwholesome, and unclean, and Rom. 33. 4. he that bears that Sword is a Minister of God: and who doth Isa. 33. 2. not obey the Law on God withie, then that takes hold upon him without, but who doth obey the Law of God within: it brings them from under the occasions of all Laws without: for it will not let man lye, not-let him be drunk, nor proud, nor follow oaths, nor cursed speaking, nor whore doms, quarrelling fighting, wrangling, nor railing: and every one who walketh [Page 4] in the Law of God, denies all that which is unwholesome: and that which is according to the course of the world: and they be all of one heart, and are all one in unity, if ten thousand: and have all one law written in their hearts: which those that live in uncleanness cast behind their back, and yet they prosess a law in words, but are not subject to the power of God: and such are they who do accuse their beethren which walk in the Law of God: and yet they pretend Justice: but there souls are not subject; for that soul that is subject to the higher power which is of God, denies all filthiness and corruption.
Object. That since their coming into this Country, they have breached Opinions tending to the destruction of the relation of Subjects to their Magistrates, Wives to their Husbands, (Children to their Parents, Servants to their Masters, Congregations to their Ministers, and of a people to their God.
Answ. We were moved to come into this Country of the Lord, and the Lord did let us see, that he had a people here before we came in it: But as for braaching Opinions, We deny: but those that prosess truth, and walk in it up to God, we own.
Opinions do tend to break the relation of Subjects to their Magistrates, Wives to their Husbands, Children to their Parents, Servants to their Masters, Congregations to their Ministers, and of a People to their God; But Opinions we deny, for they are without God: and there you are: and justice and purity is but one, and that we set up and own: purity and walking in the Spirit, doth make a separation from all uncleanness, and can have no fellowship with them who are unfruitful workers of darkness; but there is a separation from them; the Rom. 1. 2. one hath fellowship with God, and the other hath fellowship with darkness, which be unfruitful: the one is separated to God, the other is separated from God.
Object, Have drawn much poople after them many whereof, Men, Women, and little Children, at their meetings, are strangely wrought upon in their bodies, and brought to fall foam at the mouth, roar, and swell in their bellies.
[Page 5] Answ. The meetings of the people of God, were ever strange to the world; for it was as though some strange thing had happened 1 Pet. 4. 12. to the Saints: as ye read in the Scripture; which shew Psal. 71. 7. ye are in the same generation, wondring and stranging at the work of the Lord, despising and casting scandals, slanders, and false reports upon them: and where the works of God are now, they think them strange things now, as was then who Act. 13. 41. are alive in the flesh. It would be a strange thing to see one now sall down, as Paul fell down and trembled, and as Daniel fell down and trembled; and to see one a Habakkuk his belly to tremble, and his lips to quiver and as David to ly D o. 10. 9. roaring all the day long, who cryed i'l his sight was grown dim, and hi [...] flesh sailed of fatnesss, and till he could number his bones; Hab. 3. 16. and to see one as Isaiah, to rent his garment and his mantle and pluck his hair off his head, and off his beard, and sit down astonished, and would it not be strange to see such an Assembly as came to Isaiah, which had all trembling hearts? Hear the Word Ifa. 66. 5. of the Lord all ye that tremble at his Word Work out your salvation with fear and trembling; Before their faces the people shall be much pained: all faces shall gather blackness. The Prophets and Ministers of God have all one Spirit (accodring to Joel 2. 6. measure) and did encourage those that did tremble; wherein it shews that you have not the same Spirit, but seek to persecute, and fix scandals, and accuse them fa [...]. The Ministery of truth ever drew from all the Ministery of the world, and from under all the lawes of the world, up to God and from all the Gods of the earth: and then they witnessed that the Lord was their Lawgiver, the Lord was their King, the Lord was their Judge.
Ob. Geo. Fox professed and avowed that he was equal with God.
Ans It was not so spoken, as George Fox was equal with God: but the Father and the Son is one: I and my Father are one; and where the same is revealed, this is witnessed: but where the Joh. 14. 9. 16 sure is not made manifest and revealed, Christ is persecuted; for the world knows him not. Let the same minde be in you Phil. 6. 7. that was also in Christ Iesus, who being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equall with God, and yet made himself [Page 6] of no reputation: and this I witnesse to be fulfilled, for the same Spirit where it is equall with God: for be that sanctifieth and they that are sanctified are all of one; and it is God that sanctifieth; He that hath the Word of God hath God, for God is the word; and our fellowship is with God. There is a natural man, and there is a spirtual man: the first is of the earth earthly, Heb. 2. 1. the second is the Lord from heaven: The new man, which is created Jude. 1. after God in righteousnesse and true holinesse; and he that John. 1. doth righteousnesse is righteous, even as be is righteous. 1 Cor. 47. 48. And this I witnesse what the Scripure saith, Let no man deceive you. 1. Joh. 3.
Object. He professeth himself to be the eternall Iudge of the world.
Answ. He that was a Minister of God said, that the Saints 1 Cor. 6. 2. should judge the world, yea Angels: herein they do shew themselves to be no Ministers of God, who seek to persecute them who are judged of God, and justified by him; where judgement Mat. 12. 2 is brought forth unto victory, and set in the earth and that which is eternall hath judged all the carnal nature in himself and where it is judged there is no unity with it, where it is a live; and he [...] hath not [...]ue judgement, and hath not Sale Mat. 5. [...] in himself to [...] withall, is good for nothing, and he cannot endure that Christ should speak where he is made manifest. I am the nay, saith Christ; Christ; is but one in all his Saints, and he speaks in them; but he doth not say that George Fox is Christ: I am the way, the truth, and the life: Christ is the 1 Cor. [...] light, and ye are the light, and Christ liveth in you, and Christ Mark. 1 [...]. is the head of the man; and it is the Spirit of the Father that speaketh in you, and spoke in Christs, and he is but one in all his Saints, without are many Christ; Lo here, and lo there; but know you not that Christ is in you except ye be Reprobates and if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; and there Chirst Iesus speaks, the same Christ to day, yesterday and for ever. And Isa. 5. 20 thy judgement which is not eternal, is carnal; and with-evill thoughts thou judgest: thou puttest darkness for light, and light for aarkness; and here thou she west thy judgement to be carnall, and no Minister of God, but a Minister of the Letter, and not of the Spirit; for the Ministers of the Spirit [Page 7] have true judgment; and did imprison none, not persecute, as you do: but it is, that fools may utter forth their folly.
Object He said be was the way, the truth, the life.
Answ. The old man cannot endure to hear the new man speak which is Christ, and Christ is the way: and if Christ be in you, must not he say, I am the way, the truth, and the life? John 14. 6. Now if Antichrist speak, he is owned of the world; but he cannot witness it; while the old man reigns, the voice of John 10. 4. God is not known, nor Christ himself to speak in man, but Christs sheep know his voice.
Object. He said, whosoever took a place of Scripture, and made a Sermon of it, or from it, was a Conjurer, and his preaching was Conjuration.
Ans. He that puts the Letter for the light, when the Letter saith Christ is the light, he is blind; and they that say the Letter John 8. 12. and the Spirit are inseparable, when the Spirit saith the Letter is death, and killeth, and all that do study to raise a living thing out of a dead, to raise the Spirit out of the Letter, are Conjures, and draw points and reasons, and so do Jer. 23. 16. speak a divination of their own brain: they are Conjurers Jer. 27. 9. 10 and Diviners, and their teaching is from Conjuration, which is not spoken from the mouth of the Lord, and the Lord is against all such, and who are of God are against all such; for that Doctrine doth not profit the people at al, for it stands not in the councel of God, but is a doctrine of the Devil, and drawes people from God, but he that speaks from the mouth of the Lord turns people from their wickednes, but that Ministery which God hath not sent, and that assembly must be disaffected: for the Lord is coming to teach his people himself by his Spirit, Heb. 8. 11.
Object. George Fox said the Soripure was carnay.
Ans. The Letter of the Scripture is carnal, and the Letter is death, and killeth, but the Spirit giveth life, which was in them Heb. 7. 16. that gave forth the Scriptures, and that I witnes, which is eternal and not carnal; for the Jews which had the Letter, persecuted Iesus Christ the substance: and so do you now which have the Letter and not the Substance, there were Ministers of [Page 8] the Letter then, and Ministers of the Spirit, so there is now; the Col. 1. 27. same Christ being made manifest, is unknown to the world: for the whole world Lyeth in wickednes and Christ Jesus is a Mystery to the world, and is bid though you may profeses him, because the Letter speaketh of him; but ye persecute him where 1 Iohn 3. 8 be is made manifest, and where he is made manifest the works of the devil are destroyed, and there be speaks and is King, 1 Ioh. 5. [...] and is the way, and is the truth, and is the life; and he that hath Rom. 8, 11. the Son hath life and he that hath not the Son hath not life; and he 1 Cor. 6. 27. that hath the same spirit that raised up Iesus Christ, is equal 2 Cor. 6. 10. wth God: and the Scripture saith, that God wildwel in man & walk in man: as Iesus Christ which is the mystery, hath passed before, so the same Spirit takes upon it the same seed, and is the same where it is made manifest: according to the flesh, I am the son of Abraham, according to the Spirit the Son of God saith Christ. All the plotting of the Priests, is, and ever was, against Christ where he is made manifest: and the Boast shall Col. 1. 27 make rear with, the Saints, and with the Lamb; but the Heb. 2. 11. Lamb shall get the victory: praises, praises be to our God for ever, for evermore.
Obj. Richard Huberthorn writ, that Christs coming in the flesh was but a figure.
Ans. Christ in his people is the substance of all figures, tipes and shadows, fulfilling them in them and setting them free from them: But as he is held forth in the Scripture-Letter without them, and in the flesh without them, he is their example or figure, which is both [...], that the same things might be fulfilled in them, that was in Christ Iesus: for even her innto were 1 Pet. 2. 21. ye called because Christ hath suffered for us, leaving us an example 1 Pet. 4. 1. that we should follow his steps: for asmuch as Christ hath suffered 1 Pet. 1. 19. for us arm yourselves likewise with the same mind, Christ was our example in suffering and in holinesse, and as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation, Iohn 13. 15. because it is writen, Be ye holy as I am holy, he is our example in humility: I have given you an example (saith Christ) that ye should do even as I have done unto you: And as he is so are we in this World: He is our forerunner, Captain of our salvaton, [Page 9] and in all things our example. As they have done unto me so shall they do unto you. But all they who have not Christ dwelling in them, go about to persecute him in all them in whom he is made manifest, they neither follow him as an example themselves, nor suffer others to follow him as an example and walk in the same steps: but deny him both as the substance and example, of his people: but they who are taught of him do confesse him both as he is the substance of all things; and their example in all things: for without me ye can do nothing, saith Christ: and it is so I witnesse it.
And as for Iames Milner, though his mind did run out from his condition, and from minding that light of God which is in him, whereby the world takes occasion to speak against the Truth, and many friends stumble at it: yet there is a pure seed in him.
Object. Leonard Fell said that Christ had no body but his Church.
Answ. There is one body and one Spirit, even as ye are called [...]. 4. 4. into one hope of your calling: and Christ Iesus is the head of the [...]. 1. 18. Body the Church, and ye are made free from sin by the body of Cor. 5. 19. Christ: and Christ came to redeem his Church: God was in Christ reconciling the world to himself, for his bodies sake, which is [...]. 1. 24. his Church. For we are members of his Body of his flesh, and of [...]. 5. 30. his bones: this is a great Mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and his Church. And hath put all things under his feet, and gave [...] 22. 23. him to be the head over all things to the Church, which is his body, The fulnesse of him that filleth al in al, in whom also we are builed up together, for an habitation of God through the Spirit.
More Objections against George Fox charged upon him, by the Contrivers of the foresaid Petition; and Answered by him, as followeth.
Object. 1 THat he did affirm that he had the Divinity ossentiall in him.
Answ. For the word essential, it is an expression of thir own: but that the Saints are the Temples of God, and God doth dwell 2 Cor. 6. 1. in them, that the Scriptures do witnesse: and if God dwell in Eph. 4. 6. them, then the Divinity dwels in them: and the Scripture saith 2 Pet. 1. 4. Ye shall be partakers of the Divine nature: and this I witnesse: but where this is not, they cannot witnesse it.
Object. 2. That both Baptisme and the Lords Supper are unlawfull.
Answ. As for that word unlawful, it was not spoken by me: but, the Baptisme of Infants I deny and there is no Scripture that speaks of a Sacrament, but that Baptism that is into Christ, with one Spirit into one body: that I confess according to Scripture: and the Lords Supper I confess, and that the brend the Saints Gal. 3. 27. break is body of Christ: and that cup which they drink is the Ioh. 6. 53. 55. blood of Christ, this I witnesse.
Object. 3. He did disswade men from reading the Scriptures, telling them that it is carnal.
Answ. For disswading men from reading the Scriptures, that is false, for they were given to be read as they are, but not to 1 Cor. 2. 10. 16. make a Trade upon: the Letter is carnall, and killeth: but that which gave it forth is spiritual, eternall, and giveth life: and this I witnesse.
Object. 4. That he was equall with God.
Answ. That was not so spoken: but that He that sanctifieth, Heb. 2. 11. and they that are sanctified, are of one, and the Saints are [Page 11] all [...] Eph. 5. 30. this the Scripture doth witness: And ye are the Sons of God; and the Father and he Son are one; and they that are joyned to the Lord, are one Spirit, and they that are joyned to an harlot are on flesh.
Object. That God taught deceit.
Answ. That is false, and was never spoken by me; God is pure.
Object. That the Scriptures are Antichrist.
Answ. That is false, but that they which prosess the Scriptures, and live not in the life and power of them, as they did that gave them forth, that I witness to be Antichrist.
Object. That he was the judge of the world.
Answ. That the Saints shall Judge the world, the Scripture witness it, whereof I am one, and I witness the Scripture fulfilled. Cor. 6. 2. 3.
Object: That he was as upright as Christ.
Answ. Those were not so spoken by me; but that as he is, so are we in this present world: That the Saints are made the 1 Ioh. 4. 17. righteonsness of God: That the Saints are one in the Father and 2 Cor. 5. 21. the Son, that we shall he like him, 1 John 3. 3. and that all Ioh. 17. 21. 22. teaching which is given forth by Christ, is to bring the Saints to perfection▪ even [...] the measure of the stature of the fastness Eph. 4. 11. 12. 13. of Christ: This the Scripture doth witness, and this I witness, Where Christ dwels, must not [...]e [...] Temple?
Queries propounded to George Fox. by some of the Contrivers of the Petition, and by him Answered.
Query. WHether there be one individual God distinguished into the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost, or not?
Answ. Herein thou wouldst know, whether God be individual, yea or no, which is but a busie minde: for hadst thou the witness in thy self thou wouldst know that he is: but the Heathen know not God, and all that know him not, are Heathen living in the wicked imiginations of their own hearts; and that is thy condition: For God is a Spirit, and none know him but the Son, and he to whom the Son is revealed: the Son and the Word is one. He that hath ears to bear let him bear, what the Spirit saith, for thou, natural man, thou knowest not the things of God.
Qu. Whether a believer be justified by Christs righteousness imputed, yea, or no?
Answ. He that beleeveth is born of God: and he that is born of God, is justified by Christ alone without imputation.
Qu. Whether he that beleeveth that Christ hath taken away his sin, is clean without sin in this life, as Christ himself, or not?
Answ. He that believeth is born of God, and he that is born of God sins not, neither can he sin, because his seed remaineth in him, as he is, so are we in this present evil world.
Qu. Whether a Believer be without all sin in this life or not?
Answ. Christ being made manifest, is made manifest to take away sin, and in him is no sin at all; he that abideth in him, sins not; he that sins is of the Devil, and bath not seen him, [...] [Page 14] in the true Church of God there is no talk of such carnal things, Thou Sot, the Bread which the Saints break, is of the body of Christ; he is the bread of life. The Church is not the Steeplehouse but the Church is in God, and those that eat the bread of life, live for ever: the Church is in God, and the bread of life is there, and it shall continue for ever.
Qu. Whether Christ in the flesh be a figure or not; and if a figure, how and in what?
Answ. Christ is the substance of all figures; and his flesh is a figure; for every one passeth through the same way as he did, who comes to know Christ in the flesh: there must be a suffering with him, before there be a rejoycing with him. Christ is an example for all to walk after; and if thou know'st what an example is, thou wouldst know what a figure is, to come up to the same fulness.
Qu. Weether there be any Heaven or Hell, for the Elect or Reprobute after death, but in man in this life or not?
Answ. There is no knowledge of Heaven or Hell; but through death the wicked shall be turned into bell, and all them that forget God, there to be tormented; there is a hell, thou shalt finde it: Heaven is God Throne; and Heavenly notions within shall be shaken: for God is pure, and nothing that is unclean shall stand before him: and he hath said he will dwell in man.
Qu. Whether the Ministration of the Ministory by man is to continue till the end, or not?
Answ. The Ministration of the world is the Ministry of man, and doth not lead to an end, but keeps in time, and that must have on end; for it is not of God. The Ministery of God is to draw people up to himself: but that is not of man, nor by man nor according to man: or Paul was made a Minister according to the wil of God, who had not received it of man neither was it taught him of man, and was a Minister of the Spint but the Ministers of the world receive their learning as Oxford and Cambridge, and are taught of men, and speak a divination of their own brain, which is conjuring: and bewitch the people with those things which are carnal: as, to sprinkle Infants, and tell [Page 15] them of a Sacrament which there is no Scripture for; and saying they are the Ministers of Christ, and act those things which he forbids; as to have the chiefest place in the assemblies, the uppermost room at feasts, the greeting in Markets, and to be called of men Masters, and with pretence make long prayers, which Christ forbids, and profess and say, they are the Ministers of Christ: wherein they shew themselves to be Antichrist. And see if thou do not uphold these Antichrists, and say they are the Ministers of Christ.
Qu. Whether the written Word, I mean the Scriptures be the power of God unto Salvrtion, to every one that believes, or not?
Answ. The written Word is not the power of God, not the Scriptures are not the Salvation; but he that doth believe hath the life of them. Who is born of God, shall never dye; as it is written, he that believeth is born of God, and he that is born of God hath the witness in himselfe, that God is the cause of mans Salvation, and not the Scripture nor the Letter.
James Naylers Answer, and Declaration, touching some things charged upon him, by the men aforesaid.
HAving heard of divers untruths cast upon me, by some of the Priests in their high places, though I stand only to the Lord in respect of my selfe; yet left any that love the truth, should be led on by these salfe reports to speak evil of those things they know not; I shall lay open the truth, as it is revealed in me, touching those things whereof I have bee; falsly accused.
First, Concerning Jesus Christ, that he is the eternal word of [Page 16] God, by whom all things were made, and are upholden; which Rev. 19. 13. was before all time, but manifested to the world in time, for the 1 Ioh. 1. 2, 3, 4 5. recovery of left man: which Word became flesh, and dwelt amongst the Saints, who is the same, yesterday, to day, and for Ioh. 1. 14. ever; who did and doth dwell in the Saints; who suffered, and rose again, and ascended into Heaven, and is set at the right hand o God, to whom all power is given in heaven and in earth, Eph. 1. 20. who fill all places; is the light of the world, but known to none but to those that receive and follow him, and those he lead up to Ioh. 8, 12. God, out of all the ways, works and worships of the world, by his pure light in them, whereby he reveals the man of sinne; 2 Thess 2. 8. and by his power casts him out. And so prepares the bodies of the Saints a fit Temple for the pure God to dwell in with whom dwells no unclean thing? and thus he reconciles God and man: 1 Cor. 3. 16, 17. and the image of God which is in purity and holinesse, is renewed: and the image of S [...]an, which is all sin and uncleanness, is defaced: and none can witness Redemption, further then Christus thus revealed in them, to set them free from sin: which 2 Cor. 5. 18. 19. Christ I witness to be revealed in me in measure, Gal. 1. 16. 2 Cor. 13. 5 Col. 1. 27. Col. 3. 10.
2. Concerning the Scriptures, That they are a true Declaration of that word which was in them that spoke them forth, and 2 Pet. 1. 20. 21. are of no private interpretation, but were given forth to be read and fulfilled in the Saints, as they were given forth by the Rev. 22. 18. Holy Ghost, without adding or diminishing; and were not given forth for men to make a Trade on to get money by: but as they are they are profitable for Doctrine, for reproofe, for correction, 2 Tim. 3. 16. 17. for instruction in righteousness, that the may of God may be perfect throughly furnished unto every good work But they who trade in the Letter, and are ignorant of the M [...]y▪ deny all perfection: and none can rightly understand the Scriptures but thay who read them with the same spirit that gave them forth; 1 Cor, 2. 14, 15. for the [...] man understands not the things of God, for they are spiritually discerned.
3. Concerning Baptisme: the true Baptisme is that of the spirit, with the holy Ghost, and with fire: Baptized by one spirit into onebody: not the washing away the filth of the flesh, but [Page 17] the answer of a good conscience towards God by the resurrection Acts 1. 5. Jesus Christ; without which no other Baptism can save us, they being out figures or shadows; but this Baptism of Christ Gal. 3. 27. is the substance, whereby we are baptized into his death; and those that are bapized into Christ have put on Christ.
4. Concerning the Lords Supper: The true Supper of the Lord is the spiritual eating and drinking of the flesh and blood Mat. 26. 26. 28. of Christ spiritually; which the Spirituall man only eateth, and is thereby nourished up unto carnall life: without which Iohn 6. 51. 53, 54, 55; 56. eating there can be no life in creature, profess what you will; and all who eat of this bread, and drink of this cup have reall communion in Christ the head, and also one with 1 Cor. 11. 24. 25. another, as members; and are of one heart, and one minde, a compleat body in Christ. Now the world who take onely Col. 2. 10. the outward fignes, and are not brought in discerning of the Lords body, eat & drink domnation to themselves, become guilty 1 Cor. 11. 27, 28, 29. of the body and blood of Christ; and cals this a Communion, but lives in envy, strif, and debate, fighting, and going to Law one with another, for earthly hings.
5. Concerning the Resurrection: That all shall arise to give an account and receive at the last day according to their works, Iohn 5. 29. whether good or evill. These bodies that are dust, shall turn to 1 Cor. 15. 38. dust, but God shall give a body as pleaseth him; that which is sown in corruption, shall be raised in incorruption; it is sown a 1 Cor. 15. 42, 43, 44. naturall body, it is raised a spirituall body; and as we have borne the image of the earthly, so we shall hear the image of the Rev. 2. 6. heavenly: but flesh and blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of heaven; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption; for we 1 Cor. 15. 20. must be changed. But they who cannot witnesse the first Resurrection within themselves, know nothing of the second, but by heatsay; and therefore, say some of your Teachers, that Christ 1 Cor. 15. 47. is in Heaven with a carnal body. Now that Christ who is the si si it fruits, should be in Heaven with a carnall body, and the Saints with a spirtuall body, is not proportionable.
6. Concerning Magistracy: It is an Ordinance of God, Ordained for the punishment of evil doers, and an encouragement for them that do well; Where Justice and righteousnesss is the [Page 18] head, and ruleth with out partiality, that Land is kept in peace; and those that judge for the Lord, I honour as my own life, not with a sluttering honour, putting off he hat and bowing of the knee, which is the honor of the world, having mens persens Jude 16. in admiration because of advantage for self ends; but from my heart, for conscience sake, as to the power which is of God, not to mens persons, for the Scripture saith, he that respects persons commits sin, and is convinced of the Law as a transgressor; and the Apostle Iames commands the Saints, not to have the Jam. 2. 9. faith of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory, with respect of Iam. 2. 1, 2, 3, 4. persons for saith he such are partial in themselves, and become Iudges of evil thoughts: And saith Paul, Let every soul be subject to the higher power; for saith he, there is no power but of God: the Rom. 13. 1. 2. powers that be are ordained of God: and that whosoever resistesh the power, resisteth the Ordinance of God: and faith. We must needs be subject, for conscicence sake: and therefore though the Rom. 13. 5. Prophets wer often sent by the Lord, to pronounce judgement against unjust men, who had the power committed to Hosea 5. 12. them, and did not judge for God, but for self- ends; yet they never attempted any violence against them but used [...]l means to perswade them to leve mercy, do justice and walk humbly with Mica 6. 8. God, that they might be established, [...] the wrath of God truned from them; for those that be of Go, cannot rejoice in the sufferings of any, but would have all to turn, and find mercy.
7. Concerning the Ministery: The true Ministers of Jesus Christ 2 Pet 1. 21. have always been, and are still, such as come not by the will of Eph. 4. 7. 6. 11. man, but by the will of God, neither are they fitted to the work by any thing of man, but by God alone: for the true Ministry it the gift of Iesus Christ, and needs no addtion of human help 1 Cor. 12. 7. and learning; but as the work is spiritual, and of the Lord 1 Pet. 4. 10. 11. so they are spiritually fitted only by the Lord, and therefore he chused Herdsemen, Fishermen, and Plowmen, and such like: and as he gave them an immediate Call, withon the leave of man: so he fitted them immediatly without the help of man: Mat, 10. 8. and as they received the gift freely, so they were to give freely: And when ever they found any of the false Ministery, that taught for hire, cryed out against them, and pronounced woes against [Page 19] them, and shewed them that they lay in iniquity, because Acts 8. 20 they thought that the gift of God could be bought and sold for Ioh. 10. 13. money: and Christ calls them hirelings, and saith they care Mica 3. 10 not for the sheep: and Micab cryes out against the Priests that taught for hire; and (saith he) they build up Sion with blood, Ior. 5. 30, 31. and Jerusalem with in quity: and Jeremiah cryed out against Ior. 6. 13. the Priests in his days, that hear rule by their means, and calls it a horrible thing; and saith that, from the least of them to the Isa. 56. 10. 11 greatest, they are all given to covetousness: And Isiah cryes out against those in his days, and calls them greedy Dogs, that can never have enough; and saith he, they all look for their gain from their quarter. And Peter saith, of such as should come, 2 Pet. 2. 3. that they [...]hrough covetousness should make merchandize of the people; and saith they have hearts exercised with covetous practises, 2 Pet. 2. 14. 15. who have for saken the right way, and have followed the the way of Baalam, who loved the wages of unrighteousness: And 2 Cor. 11. 15 Jude cryes Wo unto them, for they go on in the way of Cain in his Jude 11. murder, and run greeddy after the error of Balaam for reward But those that were sent out by Christ, counted & their gain to make the Gospel without charge; nei he ever had they any set 1 Cor. 9. 16. 17. 18. means but went about, having no certain dwelling place; never were masters, but servrnos to al for Christ, sake: nor ever 1 Cor. 4. 11. went to Law for Ty [...]hes, or any other earthly thing.
Now all people try your Priests by the Scriptures, whether they be of God or of the world, and never think to hear the 1 Iohn 2. 3. 4, 5. 6. Word of the Lord from their mou [...]hs, who walk con rary to the Scriptures: for such were never sent of God: for had they 2 Ioh. 9. 10. been sent of God, they would abide in his doctrine: and saith Iohn. Such have not God, but he that abideth in the Doctrine of 2 Ioh. 9. 10, 11. Christ, hath both the Father and the Son. And if there come any to you, and bring not this doctrine, you are forbidden to receive them into your house, or bid them God speed: her of you do, you are partakers of their evil deeds. And unto the wicked saith God, What ha [...] thou to do to declare my statuter, or that thou should'st Psal. 50. 16. 17. take my Covenant into thy mouth? seeing thou hat st instruction, and castist my Words behind thy back, and art a partaker with the Thief, the Adulterer, E [...]l-speaking, Slandering and Deceit; Psal. 50. 21. and such as these, think God to be like themselves.
Divers particulars of the persecutions of Iames Nayler, by the Priests of Westmerland.
IAmes being at a meeting at Edward Briggs house on the first day, where many people met, he was desired by divers friend to meet the day following at Widow Cooks house, about a mile from Kendal, whereof the priests having notice, raised the Town of Kendal against him; but being long in gathering together, the meeting was done; but spies being out upon the Steeple top, and other places, notice was given what way James passed from thence: and coming down towards Kendal, two Priests being accompanied with a Justice of peace, and some other Magi rares of the Town, with an exceeding great multitude of people following them, met him, saying, Nayler, I have a message from the Lord Jesus Christ to thee, but that there is not a con eniens place. To which Iames answered, The Lord Iesus Christ is no respecter of places. Them ssage that he had to declare, was this: I conjure thet that thou tell me by what power thou inflictest such punishment upon the bodies of creatures. Iames answered, Dost thou remember who it was that did adjure Christ to tell if he were the Son of God, and asked by what authority he did those things? for Jemes saw him to be one of that generation but the Priest still conjuring him to tel by what power he did it; Iames answered, Dost thou acknowledge is to be done by a power? Yea (saint he) I have the Spirit of God, and thereby I know it is done by a power. Iames said, If thou have the Spirit of God his sayest thou hast, then thou canst tell by what power, it is done [...]he [...]riest said, When God comes, [Page 21] he comes to torment the souls, and not the bodies. James said, He comes to redeem the souls.
But after much jangling, the Priest began to accuse him before the Justice and Magistrates of many things; As that he taught people to turn their Bibles, Children to disobey their Parents, Wives their Husbands, People to disobey their Magistrates and such like accusations. To which James answered, Thou art a false accuser, prove one of these things if thou canst, here, before the Magistrates. But not being able to prove any one, he began to accuse James for holding out a light that doth convince of sin, Which, Saith the Priest, all have not. To which James said, Put out one in all this great multitude that dare say he hath it not. Saith the Priest Thes are al Christians, but if a Turk or Indian were here, he would deny it. James said, Thou goest far for a proof, but if a Turk were here, he would witness against thee.
The people beginning to fight, the Priest turned away, saying, Here will be a disturbance. Said James, These are thy Christians, and this is the fruits of thy Ministery. But the Justice with some other, did endeavour to keep the rude people off him, so that they could not come to their purpose there: but he being to passe over the Bridge, and throughth Town, they that were of the Priests party ran before, sweaning they would throw him off the Bridge into the water, but comming thither, and seeing heir purpose, he was encouraged in his God, who gave him assurance of protection, and did wonderfully keep him, and those that were with him: for when he came unto the Bridge, the word of the Lord came unto him, and he was made to cry out against their rage, and the power of the Lord was with him, so that he received no harm, though he was made to speak all along, and in the Market place, and til he came out of the Town. But the raging people continued shouting crying, and throwing of stones at him a quarter of a mile out of the Town: But such was the power of the Lord, that neither he nor any with him, received any harm. The work was wonderful, and we were brought much to admire it, end praise the Lord, who is blessed for euer and ever.
[Page 22] Another time Iames being desires of many Christian friends to be at a meeting at Orton, there to wait upon the Lord for, what he would make known to his people, did accordingly; and many friends and brethren accompanied him; but the Priests having intelligence some days before, five of them were gathered together, and many people from all quarters. A friend in the Town desired Iames to come to his house; and being come into his house, a message was sent from the Priests, desiring him to come into the field, under pretence for a more convenient place for the great multitude. To which Iames answered, It is my desire that all may be edified: and comming into the field, the Priests came with a great multitude, and asked him by what authority he came thither, and had gathered together so many people to break the peace; and tempting him, said Wilt thou he bound that none here shall break the Peace? To which Iames answered. We come not hither to create offences, but if any break the Law, let him suffer by the Law: for he perceived they intended violence, as it appeared afterwards.
But seeing they could not prevail in that, mother of them desired him to go into the Church, as he called it, tempted him, saying, The people may all sit and hear better: But Iames perceiving their deceit, said, All places were alike to him: he would abide in the field. Wherein they pulled out an Ordinance of Parliament, forbidding any to speak, but such as were authorized to speak either in Church or Chappel, or an publick place; and bade him speak at his peril, as he would an wet the contempt of it. To which he answered, saying, This is not a publick place. No? said one of the Priest, Is not this a publick place the Town field? and charged the Constable of the Town to do his office, and examined his authority: Iames answered, Those that are sent to declare the things of God, have not their authority from men. But they bad him prove that. He said, Paul received not his commission from man; nor by man: To which one of [...] answered, That was his Gospel, but they would prove saint Paul had a call from man to preach; and for that end [...] that place in Acts 13. 2. where the Holy Ghost sad, Separate me Barnabas and Saul; and the Apostles laid their hands upon [Page 23] them, which, said one of them [...] Presbytery; [...] was the laying on of hands of the [...]; But when he had found that place, James asked him it that was Pauls call to the Ministry (three times) but he answared nothing. Then said James, If that was his call he had preached long without a call before that; and instanced to prove it Gal. 1.
Whereupon that business ended; But another Preist stood up, and said, Thou oughtest to give an account of thy Faith to every one that a keth; whereupon he asked divers questions: whereunto James answered, in so much that some that stood by cryed out, Answer not all but ask him some, A while after Iames asked him how he would proved himselfe a Minister of the Gospel, and live upon Tithes? To which he would not answer. Then said Iames, Neither will I answer thee if thou ask me twenty more.
The next question he asked was, Whether Christ was ascended or no? but Iames said, I will not answer thee. Whereupon he cryed out to the people and said he denies the humanity of Christ; and made a great out cry among the people of it. But the people cryed out, saying, Let us hear him; you have often told us many things against him: let him speak, and then if he speak not truth, you may then reprove him, Iames hearing the desire of the people, began to speak, and the people gave audience, and were very silent. But beginning to hold out Christ alone to be the Teacher of his people in spirit and truth, one of the Priest cryed out, I cannot endure to hear this Seducer any longer. Vpon which Iames said, Prove me a Seducer before all this people, or else thou art a false Accuser. But he had not one word to say against any thing that he had spoken: But said, If thou wilt not answer me that Question I asked thee, I will call thee a Seducer as long as I live.
Whereupon seeing there could be no peace there, nor liberty to speak, they desired Iames to goe into the house, and they kept closed about him, to keep him from violence of some that came along with the Priest, but they raged so, that he [...] other friends received stripes, & with much ad [...] got to the house: But the raging Sodomites waited about the door to do mischief, [Page 24] and kept shouting about the house all the while he was speaking but the house being filled with people, they could not come to their purpose: and the Lord so ordered it in the Evening, we came away without any more harm: but not long after, there came some of the Priests party about the house, and asked if Nayler was gone: and when they heard he was gone, they said, He may thank God of that. Thus by the wisedom of God he escaped their violence at that time.
But the Priests missing of their purpose there, the next first day after, they prepared their Sermons suitable to what they intended, possessing the people that he was a blisphemer, and denied the Resurrection, and the Humanity of Christ, and all Authority: and that the Parliament had opened a gap for blasph [...]my, and as it was said by some of their Hearers, they did God good service that would knock him down. Thus having stirred up the ruder sort, the next day they prevailed with one called a Justice of Peac [...]: the Priests son got him to come twelve miles from his own house: he was one, as some say, that had been in actual arms against the Parliament, for bringing in of the Scots: and having armed a great multitude against the next morning, they came very early to the house where he was, where many Christian friends would have met that day, and asked for Nayler, threatning to knock out his brains against the stones in the wall and that they would pull down the house, if he would not come out: though the door was never shut against them. But some of them came into the house, and commanded him to come forth, under pretence to dispute with the Priest. But James [...] what they intended, answered, You did not use me so civilly the last time I was amongst you; but if any have a mind they may come in the doors are open. Which answer they told the Priests, whereupon they rushed violently in, and took him by the throat, haled him out of the door into a field, where was a man whom they called a Justice, and with a Pitchfork struck of his Hat, and commanded him to answer to such Questions as the Priests would ask him. Whereupon the Priest began to ask many Questions, as concerning he Resurrection, the Humanity of Christ, the Scriptures, and divers other Questions, [Page 25] as the Sacrament, and such like, to which he answered, and proved by Scripture, But at last being asked if Christ was in him, he said, he witnessed him in him in measure. The Priest asked, if Christ was in him as man, Iames said, Christ is not divided; But he urged him to tel whether Christ as man was in him or no. He answered, Christ is not divided; for if he be, he is no more Christ: but I witnesse that Christ is in me, who is God and man in measure. But the Priest said, Christ is in Heaven with a cunnal body. To who said Iames, Christ filleth Heaven and Earth, and is not carnal but spiritual: for if Christ be in Heaven with a carnal body, and the Saints with a spiritual body, that is not proportionable; neither was that a carnal body which same in among the Disciples, the doors being shut: for Christ is a Mystery and thou knowest him not.
Then after much jangling and tempting, the Priest not having got the advantage he waited for, he cryed out unto the people not to receive him into their houses: and alledged that in the second Epistle of Iohn v. 10. Now how suitable that place was for his purpose, all people may see, who have eyes: for there they are forbidden to receive any into their houses, but such who abide in the Doctrine of Christ, and confesse themselves that they had both the Father and the Son, and preach that Doctrine. But the Priests say that is blasphemy.
Theo the Priest turned away from him: upon which the armed multitude began to be violen; against divers friends that were there. Iames hearing friends & cry out, said to the Justice, You will surely set us peaceably into the house again: but seeing him to go away, and leave them in the hands of the rude multitude, he gave himself up, saying, The will of the Lord be done.
Vpon which the Justice turned again, saying, We will see him in the house again: and going towards the house many friends kept close about Iames, exposing their own bodies to the danger of their weapons, to fax him harmlesse; and so with much ado we go into the house, not receiving much harm Which being done, and as Iames was pray sing the Lord for his wondrous deliverance from their malicious intants, some heard them say, If we let him go thus, all people will run after him. Whereupon [Page 26] they agreed that he should be brought before the Justice again, and came with violence, and holed him out again. Then the Justice and the Priest getting a horseback, they caused him to run after them to an Alehouse on the other side the water, where they went in, not suffering one [...]riend to go in with Iames; and when he came before the Justice he told him, if he would not put off his hat, he would send him to prison, and also because he Thoued him; for the Justice said, My Commission runs Ye. To which Iames answered, I do it not in contempt, for I own Authority, and honor it according to the Scriptures: But I find none such honor commanded in Scripture, but for bidden. Then they concluded to commit him for that, and also as a wandering person, and said none there knew him whence he came; for those who knew him were kept out. Then said he to Arthur Scaife Thou knewest me: I was in the Army with thee eight or nine years. It is no matter, said the Justice, thou art no Souldier now.
Then they writ a Mittimus to send him to prison, and carried him to Kirkby Steven that night, and shut him up in a Chamber, and set a guard upon him; but divers of our friends following into the Town, where a great multitude was gathered together for meeting, then did the people come from the Steeple-house, where another had been preaching: for divers of the Priests were gathered together that day: some preaching, some plotting, and some persecuting. Iezabels fast was a preparation for Naboths death. But friends not being suffered to go into the house where Iames was, they abode in the streets: and some of them being moved to speak to the people, the Priests perceiving the people to give audience to what was spoken, made complaint: Whereupon some were sent forth, and with violence fetched in one Francis How gill a friend, who was speaking to the people, and brought him into the high Priests hall, where were five Priests assembled, with many other of their party, but not one friend. And bringing him before the Justice, he was commanded to put off his hat. He answered, I know no such Law. The Priest said, He wil tread both Ministery and Magistracy under his feet. He said, Thou art a false Accuser, prove wherein. But one that stood by, [Page 27] took off his hat, and cast it into the fire. Then said the Justice What is this thou speakest against the Ministers? He answered, What hast thou to accuse me of? Whereupon one affirmed that he said, All the Ministers that taught for hire, and in Steeple houses, were enemies, and lyars against Jesus Christ, and no Ministers of Iesus Christ. Vpon that the Justice said, Thou speakest against the Law; for the Law gives them their maintenance He said, I me adle not with the Law, but with their practise. Then said Francis to the Priest, Didst thou ever know a Minister of Iesus Christ that was a perfecutor, or did Labour to imprison any? And after some more discourse, he said to the Priest, I have seen a great deal of tyranny and persecution in this days actions. Then said the Justice to the people. Take notice, he saith the Law I act by is tyranny and persecution. To which the people asse [...]ted. Then said Francis, Thou maist give out to the people what thou wils, but I speak not of the Law, but of you actions. Vpon that, he was sent to prison, a guard of eight men were set over them, who spent the night in drinking, swearing, and filchy and unclean talking: and the more they weye desired by the people to take heed of sin, the more filthy they did appear: but these are the sittest inst umenis so acting the Priests intentions, being members of their Churches. The next day hey were guarded to Appleby: but some friends following, could not be suffered to pass on the streets that way, so great was their envy against all that set their sace that way. And the Prisoners being brought thuther, much m ans was used that none should come at them but such as was sent to tempt them. There they were kept until the Sessions, in which time they sent up and down the country to seek for any wh would witness any thing against them and improved their u most interest for then advantage. A July was chosen, divers of them were resolved on the business, [...] that it was told the Prisoners what would become of them: before the day of examination came: and it was accordingly: For the day came, and judgement passed: but the Prisoners [...] saw their Accusers, not know who they are, but against the day, the Priests had prepared three large Petitions, stufe we most filthy untruths and slanders; raised out, of the botton la [Page 28] pit: but not one of them proveth, though one of the Justices sa [...] to them. [...] is fit they should be proved, neither was there any thing in them, which they could charge upon the Prisoners, save onely whenth power of the Lord had manifested at their meetings, in shaking proud flesh, and pouring out his spirit upon many, especially, as they said, upon little Children; which the Priests concluded was Sorc [...]ry and Witchery, and of the Devil: hereby declaring themselves to be of that generation who called the good man of the house Belzobub; and if they should not do the same to them of his houshold, the words of Christ could not be fulfilled.
Likewise they had gathered up all reports, true or false of things done by many that the Prisoners had not seen the faces of, nor ever know; thinking thereby to make them odious to the people. They also brought two Priests our of Laneashire, to swear things that another man had spoken in the presence of sour Justices of the peace, and for which the man had been tryed and cleared: And these they brought, thinking to adde afflictions to the Prisoners bonds. But he is kept in great peace and joy, having not any comfort from man, but from God, who hath appeared to him in this condition, and hath given him assurance of his love, in whom he rests. To whom be praise, honour and glory, for ever
Amen.
The Examination of James Nayler, upon an Indictment of Blasphemy, at the Sessions at Appleby, in January, 1652.
Put off your hats.
I do it not in contempt of Authority: for I honor the power as it is of God, without respect of persons, it being forbidden in Scripture. He that respects mens persons commits sin, and is convinced of the Law as a Transgressor.
That is meant of respecting per [...]ons in judgment.
If I see one in goodly apparel, and a Gold Ring, and [...] one in poor and vile Raiment, and say to him in fine a parel, Sit thou in a higher place then the poor, I am partial, and judged of evil thoughts.
If thou wert in the Parliament house, wouldst thou keep it on.
If God should keep me in the same mind I am in now I should.
I knew thou wouldst contemn Authority.
I speak in the presence of God, I do not contemn Authority, but I am subject to the power, as it is of God, for Conscience sake.
Now Authority commands thee to put of thy hat, what s [...]y [...]st thou to it?
Where God commands one thing, and man another, I am to obey God rather then men.
See whether the Law commands i [...], or your own wills.
The Indi [...]ment was read, wherein Iames was indited for saying that Christ was in him, and that there was but one word of God.
Where wast thou born?
At Ardislaw, two miles from Wakefield.
How long livedst thou there?
Vntil I was married then I went unto Wake [...]ld Parish
What Profession was thou of?
A Husbandman.
Wast thou a Souldier?
Yea; I was a Souldier betwixt eight and nine years.
Wast thou not at Burford among the Levellers?
I was never there.
I charge thee by the Lord that thou tell me whether thou wast or no?
I was then in the North, and was never taxed for any Mutiny, or any other thing while I served the Parliament.
What was the cause of thy coming into these parts?
If I may have liberty I shall declare it. I was at the Plow, meditating on the things of God, and suddenly I heard a voice, saying un [...]o me, Get thee out fr [...]m thy Kinred, and from thy Fathers house: and I had a promise given in with it. Whereupon I did exceedingly rejoyce, that I had heard the voice of that God which I had professed from a Child▪ but had never known him.
Didst thou hear that voice?
Yea, I did hear it, and when I came at home, I gave up my estate, c [...]st out my money, but not being obedient in going forth, the wrath of God was on me, so that I was made a wonder to all, and none though I would have lived: but (after I was made willing) I began to make some preparation; as apparel, and other necessaries, not knowing whither I should go. But shortly afterward going agate-ward with a friend from my own house, having on an old Suit without any money, having neither [...]aken leave of Wife or Children, nor thinking then of any journey, [...] I was commanded to go into the W [...]st, not knowing whither [...] should go, not what I was to do there, but when I had been [...]here a li [...]tle while, I had given me what I was to declare; and [...]ver since I ha [...]e remained, not knowing to day what I was to [...]o to morrow.
What was the Promise thou hadst given?
That God would be with me: which promise I find made [...]ood every day.
I never heard such a call as this is, in our time?
I believe thee.
Is Christ in thee?
I witness him in me: and if I should deny him before men, he would deny me before my Father which is in heaven.
Spiritual you mean.
Yea, Spiritual.
By faith, or how?
By faith.
What difference then between the Ministers and you?
The Ministers affirm Christ to be in heaven with a carnal body, but I with a Spiritual body.
Which of the Ministers say Christ is in heaven with a Carnal body?
The Minister so called of Kirkby Steven.
Priest Higginson stood up, and affirmed it again openly before all the Court.
If Christ be in heaven with a carnal body, and the Saints with a spiritual body, it is not proportionable; neither was that a carnal body which appeared among th [...] D [...]ciples, the doors being shut, and appeared in divers shapes.
Was Christ man or no?
Yea, he was, and took upon him the se [...]d of Abraham, and was real fl [...]sh and bone; but is a Mystery not known to the carnal man; for he is begotten of the immortal seed, and those that know him, know him [...]o be spiritual; for it was the VVord that became flesh, and dwelt amongst us: and if he had not been Spiritual, he had not wrought by Redemption.
Is Christ in thee as man?
Christ filleth all places, and is not divided: Seperate God and man, and he is no more Christ.
If we stand to dispute these things, we should have the Ministers.
Perceiving Priest Higginson offended, because he had told of his saying that Christ was in heaven with a carnal body, I [...]s said, Friend I had not [...] thee, had I not been asked what was the difference between the Ministers and me; for I am not [Page 32] come to accuse any, for I am against accusations.
Wast thou not of a Kirk about Saw [...]by?
I was a member of an Independent Church at [...] church.
Wast thou not excommunicated for thy blasphe-mous opinions?
I know not what they have done since I came forth; but before I was not to my knowledg [...].
Col. Brigs. cal [...]ed of Mr. Coal, saying, Did you ere hear such a call as this? did you hear it?
Yea, I heard part of it.
Didst not thou write a paper, wherein was mentioned, that if thou think [...]st to be saved by that Christ which dyed [...] J [...]us [...]l [...]m, thou art [...]?
If [...] Christ neerer then Jerusalem, I shall have [...] by hi [...]: but I own no other Christ but that who witnessed [...] go [...]d con [...]ion before Pontius P [...]late; which Christ I witn [...]s in [...].
Wilt thou deny thy hand?
I will not deny [...]y hand, if I may see it; and I desire tha [...] I may have so much fa [...]our, that tha [...] paper may be kept as an evidence either with or against me.
[...] Petition being read, wherein was something against quaki [...]g and trembling.
How comes it to passe that people quake and tremble.
The Scriptures witness the same condition in the Saints formerly; as David, Daniel, Habakkuk and divers others.
Did they fall down?
Yea some of them did so.
David said all his bones were broken, but they were whole.
So are these now.
Moses trembled; for he saw the face of God and all Israel.
Did all Israel see the face of God? that crosseth the Scriptures.
They saw his glory. shall see the Lord with these eyes; putting his fingers [...].
They [...] first be made spiritual. he cannot be seen with [...] eyes, for [...] Spirit, and no flesh can see God, and live.
That light by which I am justified, is a created light.
That light by which I am justified, is not a created light.
That is true.
To the Word. What sayest thou to the Scriptures? are they the Word of God?
They are a true Dediration of the word that was in them who spoke them forth.
Is there not a written Word?
Where readest thou in the Scriptures, of a written Word? The word is spiritual, not seen with carnal eys: but as for the Scriptures they are true, and I witness them true, in measure fulfilled in me, as lar as I am grown up.
Why dost thou distrub the Ministers in their publick worship?
I have not disturbed them in their publick worships.
Why dost thou speak against Tiths, which are allowed by the States.
I meddle not with the States: I speak against them that are hirelings, as they are hirelings: those that are sent of Christ, never took Fiths, nor never sued any for wages.
Dost thou think we are so beggerly as the Heathens, that we cannot afford our Ministers maintenance? We give the us it freely.
They are the Ministers of Christ, who abide in the Doctrine of Christ.
But who shall judge? how shall we know them?
By their fruits you shall know them they that abids not in the Doctrine of Christ. make it appear they are not the Ministers of Christ.
That is true.
Accusations against To. Lawson, by him answered.
THat Ioh. Lawson of Lancaster did affirm, December the fourth, 1652.
Object. That he was dead, and rose again.
Answ. Thou art a witness against him that is risen from the dead, whereof the Apostles were witnesses. Here thou shewest thy selfe to be a witness against the living, and shewest thy self to be in the death, and no Minister of Christ: for the Ministers of Eph. 2. 1. Chost justified them which were raised from the dead: Even when we were dead in trespasses and finnes hath he quickened us together with Christ, and hath raised us together, and hath made us to fit in heavenly places in Christ Jesus. Like wise reckon you also your selves to be dead indeed unto sinne, but alive unto God, through Jesus Christ: for in that he died, he died once unto sinne: in that he lives, be lives unto God. Here thou Rom. 6. 10. 11. shewest thy selfe to be no Minister of Jesus Christ. He that be lieveth, hath passed from death to life, because he lovet is his brotisren: Here thou shewest thou dost not believe, but art in the death and art in envy: so thou shewest forth thy selfe to [...]e [...], and hatest thy brethren: We know that we are translated from d ath unto life, because we love our brethren, be that loveth not his brother, abideth in the death: and there thou art. Whosoever hateth his brother, is a man-stayer: and you know that no man stayer hath eternal life abiding in him, 1 Ioh. 3. And [...] is thy condition, and here thou art an An [...]ichrist in the world; envying those who are raised from the dead: and thou [...] to bring them to the death, whom God hath raised from [Page 35] the death. Thou hast not seen thy selfe to be the Prodigal; ye Luk, 15. 24. the Scripture faith, This my Son was dead, and is alive againe but thou art withput God in the world.
Object. 2. That the day of judgement was past.
Answ. Christ speaks. The bruted reed he will not break the Mat. 12. 20. smoaking flax he will not quench, till he bring forth judgment into victory. Here thou shewest thy sel [...]e to be ignorant of the Scripture: but only as a near-sayer thou speakest, and the outside of the Letter, and not Christ; and canst not witness him, who beings forth judgement into victory, but standest as a witness against them who witness the Scriptures fulfilled in them, and Chri beinging forth judgement into victory: and here thou shewest thy se [...]e to be unacquainted with Christ, and thy nakedness and ignorance thou makest appear.
Object. 3. That he had been in Hell, and is now in Heaven.
Answ. Here thou shewest thy selfe to be a witness against the holy men of God. Jonah saith, Ou [...] of the belly of He [...]l cryed Jon. 2. I, and thou heardest my voice, and the Lord delivered him out of Hell; and might n [...]t [...] co [...]f [...]s [...]? thou H [...]pocrit. For thou wilt not leave my soul in Hell, neither will thou suffer thy Ps. 16. 10. boly One to see corruption. Thou hast delivered my son out of death: bless the Lord, my soul, and all that is within me bless Ps. 103. 1, 2. his holy name. How derest thou profess the Scriptures, and the holy men of Gods conditions, which were raised and brought our of death; and witness the holy me lot Gods condition, thou persecutest then? O thou blind my pocrite I here thou shewest thou never lawest Holis mouth yet, therefore thou never cryedst in Hell yet.
Object. 4. That he was came to the infinite company of the first born, and the spirits of just men made perfect.
Answ. Paul said (who was a Minster of God) But ye are come to Mount Sion and to the City of the living God, the Heavenly Heb. 12. 22. Ierusalem, and to an innumerable company of Angels, to the general Assembly and Church of the first born, which are written in heaven; unto God the Iudge of all, and to the spirits [Page 36] of just men made perfect. Paul was a Minister of Iesus Christ by the will of God, who encouraged the Saints who were brought hither: but thou new perseeutest them, and art a witnes against them that confess they are brought hither: here thou shewest thou hast the spirit of error, openly: and art no Minister of God, no not of the Letter; but art against the Letter as it speaks, persecuting them that have the life of it.
Object. 5. That he had heard the last Trumpet sound, and seen the new Ierusalem.
Answ. Here thou shewest forth thy spite and venome; If Iohn was here, which saw the great City and holy Ierusalem descend out of Heaven from God (Iohn said, I saw the holy City, New Ierusalem come down from God out of Heaven) thou wouldst be a witness against him; and thou shewest thy self in the generation that was ever persecutors slandere's & opposers of the power of truth. Where the same spirit is that was in Iohn, he sees these things now, as he did then, but where the same spirit is not, which thou shewest thou hast not, but a contrary spirit that pesecutes them which do see those things: but is as a dog to bite and devour. Iohn saw the last Trumpet sound, which shews thou art not come to the first. Blow the trumpet in Sion, sound Joel 2. 1. an allarum in my holy mountain: let all the inhabitants of the earth tremble. Here be thou a witness against thy self, that thou art a witness against the truth, and in the generation of them that ever slow the righteous [...]eed.
Obj. 6. That John Lawson said he had seen God face to face.
Ans. Here thou shewest thy self to be a witness against them that know God, and makest thy selfe manifest to be a Heathen: [...] all are Heathens [...]at do not know God; and no man knoweth God, saving he that is born of God; and who ere born of God are owners of the Truth, and not against it, but against the deceit. Iacob said, I have seen God face to face. Isaiah Gen 32. Isa. 6. 5. and, Mine eyes have seen the King the Lord of Hasts. Iob and, I have heard of thee by the hearing of the care: but now Job. 42 5. [...]ne eyes have seen thee. And God spake to Moses face to Exod 33. 11. [...]. Here you may take your oaths, and swear against Iacob, [...]gainst Isaiah, against Iob, and against Moses. Where the [Page 37] false spirit is made manifest: and who are born of God, know God face to face, as they did: but they who are born of the flesh, persecute them who are born of the spirit: and there you shew your selves to be taking oaths and swearing against them that know God, seeking to bring them to prison or bondage: for you never read in all the Scriptures, that the Prophets or the Apostles took their oaths against any which confessed they had seen God, or put up a Petition to the Magistrates, or witnessed it with oaths against any of them: the Ministers of God said, Swear not at all. And here you shew your selves to be no Ministers of God, but without God: for the Ministers of God are to bring people to know God, and to the Church in God, and to the heavenly Jerusalem, and to the innumerable company of Angels, and Ministers to that which is in prison, and in death, but if any come to witnesse these things fulfilled, you are witnesses against them with oaths and would bring the bodies of such into prison, where the seed of God is raised out of prison within: shewing your selves to be Antichrists, persecuters of the power of Truth, and beasts which shall make war against the Saints, and against the Lamb: but the Lamb shall get the victory.
Job cryed when the Lord hid his face: and David cryed when the Lord hid his face, and said, O Lord, I will seek thy face. And here you shew, you neither know his face, nor have seen it: but are persecuters of them who know it and seek it.
Praises, praises be to the Lord for ever.