The VVhore Unvail'd, &c.
GReat is the controversie at this day throughout
Christendom concerning the way of Worship and Salvation, and great is the confusion that is about Faith, and Religion,
&c. even amongst all professing Christianity; and many, and cruel are the murthers, that have been acted by them, one against another, about Faith, and Worship, since the Apostacy began; and since people forsook the right way, and went in
Cains way, and in
Balàams, Jude
ver. 11. For then persecution began amongst the profest Christians, and not before; and when the right way was forsaken, then people went into Envy, and then they withstood the truth; even as
Jannes, and
Jambres withstood
Moses; and then they began to be scattered (from the holy Mountain of the Lord, where nothings hurts, nor destroys) to the barren mountains, where they have been destroying one another; and there (in the dark and cloudy day of Antichrist's reign) they have been worshipping the many headed Beast; (that then arose) and also the Dragon, that gave power to the Beast to make War with the Saints; and they who have been worshipping upon one mountain, they have cryed salvation is here: And they who have been worshipping another head, or upon another hill, they have cried that salvation was to be found there: (For the seven Heads of the Beast are seven Mountains upon which the Whore sits, that drinks the Blood of the Saints.) And so they fell out one with another about the way of Salvation, & upon these barren Mountains (unto
[Page 44] which people are in looking for Salvation) the strife and the envy hath been: And there people hath been killing one another about the way, and themselves all out of the way, in an Antichristian, destroying, persecuting spirit, as their fruits declare; for the Spirit of Christ never led the true Christians to persecute any about Religion; neither doth any who are in the right way, kill and destroy mens lives about Religion; Nay, they that do so, are not true Christians, but of an Antichristian spirit; for I testifie in the Name of the Lord, and for God, that the Spirit of Christ doth not (nor never did) admit, or allow of persecution, or of destroying mens lives about Worship, and Faith towards God; neither are any of them true Christians (whatsoever they profess) that are found so doing.
For it is not a bare profession of Christ, and of zeal for his cause, and crying up Ordinances,
&c. that makes people true Christians, or that gives them acceptance with God, or will make them well-pleasing unto God; But, that which makes a man a true Christian, is (his obedience unto) that Spirit, which baptizeth into the true Faith, by which Righteousness is wrought,
Heb. 11.33. and into Christ, who is the Author of faith, and will bring him to have the mind of Christ (as the true Christians had) and will make him partaker of his divine nature, and will teach him to live soberly, righteously, and godly in this present World, and to do to all men, as he would they should do unto him, which is according to the Law and Prophets, that Christ came to fulfil: And indeed, there is nothing that can bring a man into this true Christian state, but only the working and operation of the Spirit of Christ in his inward parts, which all ought to obey and submit unto: For, the persecuting Jews, who were uncircumcised in
[Page 45] heart and ears, and did alwaies resist the holy Ghost; they professed as great Zeal for God, and his Cause, as the Apostate
Christians now do; and they look'd for the coming of the Messiah, of whom all the Prophets prophesied, and professed they would Adore him, and Reverence him, &c. and said,
That, if they had been in the dayes of their Fathers, they would not have slain the Prophets, Mat. 23.31. who prophesied of the coming of Christ; and so they had seemingly a great Zeal for God, and his Truth: But, alas! a Murdering spirit was found in them; for, notwithstanding they professed,
That they would not have kill'd the Prophets; yet they kill'd the Son, who was the end of the Prophets: And although the Prophets signified the Time when,
Dan. 9.24. and the Place, where the Messiah should be born,
Mic. 5.2. yet when he was come, according to the Prophets, which they profest; these Professing
Jews would not own him, nor receive him,
John 1.11. because he reprov'd their Hypocrisie, and their Murdering spirit,
John 8.40. but they Crucified and Slew Him.
And this is the very State of the
Apostate Christians this day: For who is there now amongst them, but will profess as great Love to Christ, as the
Jews in Christ's dayes did to the Prophets, who prophesied of him? and who is there now among'st them, but will say; Had we been in
Pilate's dayes,
[...] would not have
crucified Christ, nor delivered him up to be crucified (as the Jews said of the Prophets) yet, notwithstanding their so saying, they do as the Jews did: for, now in this day of his spiritual appearance (which they profess they look for, and expect) they are found persecuting of him in his Members, under the sam̄e pretence, that the Jews persecuted him in their day,
(viz.) as a Blasphemer, &c. And so the Persecutors
[Page 56] were in all ages blinded by the godd of the World, who was a murtherer from the beginning; and though they could see the iniquities of their fathers and predecessors, in persecuting and killing the Prophets, yet the envy of their hearts was such, that they could not see their own iniquities, in persecuting and slaying the Son, who was greater than the Servants, whom their fathers slew: so, as I said before, it is not a profession of Christ, and his Ordinances, or zeal for his cause, that makes people true Christians; neither is God Worshipped upon any of those mountains where the persecuting and destroying one another is; but the Worship of God consisteth in obedience to that Spirit of Truth, which condemns all those works of darkness and cruelty,
and in his own Mountain of Holiness, where nothing hurts nor destroys, Isa. 11.9. And such is the Father now seeking to worship him, that will worship him there; and is now gathering his Sheep from off the barren Mountains, upon which the Whore sits, (where they have been scattered in the dark and cloudy day of Anchrist's reign, and where the Wars and Fightings are)
even to his own Holy Mountain, where they shall learn war no more, Isa. 2.4. And this is the work that the Envious, and Murtherous one opposeth, and bestirs himself with all his force and might, in his Instruments of Cruelty, and Men of War, arming of them with all kind
[...] weapons that possibly he can form, to fight against this Appearance and Work of God; for so it hath been, that since we (who are reproachfully called Quakers) were raised up to be a people, to bear Testimony for the Name of the Lord, and of the working of his Spirit and Power, we have alwayes been even as a Butt, for all the Archers of
Babylon (even from every Mountain) to shoot at: and our sufferings have not been only in our persons, and estates, as the
[Page 57] spoyling of our goods, and scourgings, and cruel mockings, and imprisonments (many unto death, as this Nation to her anguish must be made to know) but even all sorts of
Babylons Merchants, (or they that trades in every part of her, or within her Subburbs) have oft made it their business, to write and print against us, endeavouring thereby as much as in them lay, to render us odious, (to our own Nation, and to Nations about us) under pretence that we were Papists, and Jesuits, and that we propagated Jesuitical Principles, &c. but they being almost, if not altogether, weary of that work, finding it to be to no purpose, (for the truth which we profess hath still got ground, and flourisheth through all these things) now at last, the Papists, or Jesuits themselves, (who, I perceive have a secret hope of a day once more in this Nation,) they begin to put out their heads, and to print against us; and so both Protestants and Papists, even every head and horn of the Beast, after whom the whole World wonders, are found pushing against the Lamb and the Saints,
Rev. 17.14. For of late a certain Pamphlet accidentally came to my hands, written by a perfect
Roman Catholick, who subscribed his name
A. S. in which he seems to shew himself sensible of the great distractions that are throughout the whole
Christendom, about the true way of worship, and concerning the true Church; and first states a Question,
viz. which is this Church? &c. and afterwards makes it his business to prove the Church of
Rome to be this true Church, and that by divers Arguments by him stated in a Syllogistical manner: And I also finding the Author of the aforesaid Pamphlet therein smiting at the People of God called Quakers, and endeavouring to render them odious, by affirming they are led by a deluding spirit, &c. I found my self somewhat concerned to return a brief reply
[Page 58] to his chief Arguments therein produced, by which he hath in vain) endeavour'd to accomplish the aforesaid work by him undertaken.
A. S. His first Argument, produced to prove the Church of
Rome to be the true Church, consisteth of nine particulars, as followeth;
viz. That is the true Church, and no other, which is one, Holy Catholick, and Apostolick Church, Which is visible, infallible, inerrable, in which is power of miracles, out of which none can be saved; But the Roman
Pontificial, that is to say, the Faithful People, dispersed all the World over, in communion with the high Priest, Bishop, or Pope of Rome
is such, and no other; Therefore the Roman
Pontificial alone is the true Church.
Reply. To which I reply, that the true Church; of which Christ alone is Head, and Supreme Governour, is in it self one, holy, Apostolick Church, &c. I shall not go about to deny: But as touching that grand Question by
A. S. stated before his Argument here inserted
(viz.) which is this Church, &c. I answer, this is a thing indeed disputable amongst many, yea, amongst many thousands, yet not at all questionable, nor yet doubtful unto me; for I am well satisfied therein, and in all other things that appertain to the way of Life and Salvation, but that the Church of
Rome is the true Church, (as
A. S. affirmeth, and by his many Arguments hath endeavoured to prove) I do not acknowledge, but deny, and doubt not but I shall, in this short ensuing Treatise, prove the contrary, to the Satisfaction of every judicious Reader.
First, Although the true Church, of which Christ is in visible Head, is one yet the oneness of the Church of
Rome is not a sufficient Argument to prove her to be the true Church;
[Page 59] for wherein doth her oneness consist, farther then in Idolatry, Superstition, Murther, and such like abominations, of which much might be mentioned (which was never practised by the true Church in the Apostles dayes) but in these things the Church of
Rome is one: Witness her Worshipping Idols, or Images, bowing to that she calls her Altars, and the rest of her Supestitious Ceremonies; witness the Killing, Burning, or Drinking the Blood of so many Thousands, as she hath done for many hundred yeares past, as the whole
Christendom full well knows; therefore the Church of
Rome is not the true Church.
Secondly, And consider, was not the company of Priests one in
Hosea's dayes, who murthered in the way by consent? whom the Prophet compared, to troops of Robbers,
Hos. 6.9. And is not the Church of
Rome one as they were? for hath not she murthered many (by consent of most of her members) in the way that she is in? consider these things.
But then
A. S. saith,
That she is one in matters of Faith, and governed by one invisible Head, Christ; and by one visible Head, the Pope, the true Successor of Peter,
&c. and therefore she is the true Church.
Answ. 1. I answer; that she is perfectly united in matters of Faith, I utterly deny: witness the History of the Counsel of
Trent, which copiously relates the Divisions and Contradictions amongst them there about matters of Faith. But admit that it were so, that she were one in matters of Faith, that doth not prove her to be the true Church, unless she could prove her Faith to be the true Faith,
by which righteousness is wrought, Heb. 11.13.
And which is made perfect by works of righteousness, James 2.22. But the Faith of the Church of
Rome is not the true Faith, (as her works of unrighteousness
[Page 60] before mentioned clearly make manifest) therefore the Church of
Rome is not the true Church.
Secondly, That the Church of
Rome is governed by one invisible Head, Christ; that I also deny, and her fruits before mentioned, and that which I shall hereafter mention, sufficiently declares the contrary; and as Christ said to the Jews,
If you were of Abraham,
you would do the works of Abraham,
but now you go about to kill me; thus did not Abraham. So say I of the Church of
Rome, If she were governed by the one invisible Head, Christ, as the true Church was, then she would have the mind of Christ, (who came not to destroy mens lives, but to save them) as the true Church had, 1
Corinth. 2.16. but she hath not the mind of Christ: Witness her destroying the lives of many, not onely of those that believe not, but of those that believe: Therefore she is not governed by the invisible Head, Christ, and consequently is not the true Church, but the Whore that drinks the blood of the Saints.
Thirdly, But that the Church of
Rome is governed by her visible Head, the Pope, I shall not go about to contradict; for although that proves her to be one, in subjection to the Pope, yet it doth not prove her to be the true Church; because Christ never ordained a visible Head to his Church; but that the Pope is the true Successor of
Peter (as
A. S. affirms) that I do deny; and it remains for him to prove it, or for some of his Servant, to do it for him; for after
Peter was converted, he never gave consent to the murthering of any, as the Pope hath done many; Therefore he is not the true Successor of
Peter.
2. That the true Chu ch is holy; or (as
A. S. saith the spotless Body of Christ, that I do acknowledg; but the
[Page 61] Church of
Rome (of which the Pope is visible head) is not holy, nor the spotless Body of Christ.
1. For the spotless Body of Christ (the true Church) was baptized with the holy Ghost and with fire, the Spirit of Judgment and of burning, and thereby her filth and her spots were purged away from her, and she was washed from Idolatry and covetousness, &c. as the Apostles testified, 1
Cor. 6.11. and thereby she was fitted for Gods Kingdom, and was made to sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus, and had the mind of Christ, 1
Cor. 2.16. who came not to destroy mens lives, &c.
Luk. 9.56. But the Church of
Rome is not washed from Idolatry, nor free from Murther, as her worshipping of Idols or Images doth testifie; and as her killing and destroying about Religion, and Worship beareth witness (which the Spirit of Christ never allowed of, not the spotless Body of Christ never practised.) Therefore the Church of
Rome is not holy, nor the spotless Body of Christ.
And as to that affirmation of
A. S. in the third Number of his first Chapter
(viz.) Every man as he is Regenerated in Christ, and a member of his body, is holy, and a Saint, though as he is the Son of Adam,
be is a lyar and a sinner.
Answ. To this I answer, That the most part of all the Sectaries in the World will joyn with him in that particular; therefore he need not so much cry against them: but the True Church will not own that Doctrine, neither can I own it, because it is the Doctrine of Devils, and the Spirit of God testifies against it. For it is impossible for any man to be both a Saint and a sinner at one season: for if that could be, then might a man serve two Masters, which Christ said could not be,
Luk. 16.13. And the Apostle said,
He that commits sin, is the Servant of sin, Joh. 8.34. and is free from righteousness,
Rom. 6.22. So hath no
[Page 62] part in Christ, who is the righteousness of God. And whosoever loveth or maketh a Lye, shall not enter the Holy City; which is the true Church,
Revel. 21.27. Therefore is no member of it. Now let
A. S. consider his Ignorance, for according to his own confession, the true Church is built of living believers (elect and precious) but he that is a lyer and a sinner, is dead
(for the soul that sins shall dye, Ezek. 18.4.) Therefore, he that is a Lyer and a Sinner, is not a living Believer, nor yet holy, and a Saint: Yet I do not deny, but that he that is regenerated in Christ, and is baptized into him, and is thereby made a member of his spotless body, is holy and a Saint; for by and through the second
Adam, he is redeemed out of the first fallen
Adams state.
Well, but
A. S. saith,
That all the members of the Church of Rome
are baptized and sanctified in Christ, and that all her Institutes and Ceremonies, &c. are holy, and therefore she is holy.
Answ. I deny it, and he cannot prove it; for all who are baptized into Christ (and are sanctified in him) have put on Christ,
Gal. 3.27. and doth live holy, and have the mind of Christ, 1
Cor. 2.16. But the Church of
Rome hath not the mind of Christ, neither doth she live holy (as afore proved;) Therefore she is not holy. And as concerning her Institutions and Ceremonies, as Bowing to Images, and Altars, and such things we never read that the holy Church in the Primitive times, did practice such things; therefore we have no ground to believe they are holy.
3. That the true Church is Catholick or Universal, I shall not go about to deny: but I do deny that the Universality of the Church of
Rome, is a sufficient Argument to prove her to be the true Church; for consider.
[Page 63]1. What Church is more Universal then the great Whore (the false Church) who hath a name written,
MYSTERY BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS, AND ABOMINATION OF THE EARTH, Rev. 7.5. Who sits upon the many waters, which are Nations, Kindreds, Tongues, and People?
Rev. 17.15. And did not the Whole World, wonder after the Beast, that carries the Whore?
Rev. 13.3. And did she not sit as a Queen over them all, with her (fair Profession, or) golden cup in her hand, full of Abominations, and Filthiness of her Fornication?
Rev. 18.7. and 17.4. And did not all the Inhabitants of the Earth, and the Kings of the Earth drink of the Wine of her Fornication, and commit Fornication with her,
Rev. 18.3.
& 17.
[...]. (Mark) how universal was this great Whore, the false Church, and how confident she was? for she said in her heart,
that she should see no sorrow, Rev. 18.7. And did she not
glorifie her self, and reign over the kings of the Earth? Rev. 17.18. mark this thing. Is not this the very state of the Church of
Rome now at this day? doth she not reign over the Kings of the Earth, and over the Inhabitants of the Earth? and hath she not so done long, even for many ages? Witness
Fox his
Acts and
Monuments, the first
Volume, which copiously relates the Authority she hath exercised over Kings, and how Pope
Adrian made
Fredricus the Emperour hold his stirrup while he got upon his horse; yea, and shent him for his pains, because the poor Emperour (not being us'd to that work) held his stirrup on the wrongside of his horse.
And again, Did not the great Whore (which
John spake of)
drink the blood of the Saints and Martyrs of Jesus? as Rev. 17.6. And was she not to have blood given her to
[Page 64] drink? And hath not the Church of
Rome drunk the blood of many thousands of the Saints and Martyrs of Jesus? Surely the Histories of many Generations past will testifie she hath: Therefore she is not the true Church, but the Whore.
And have not many Nations gone into her, and committed fornication with her? and doth she not sit upon many Waters? the People, Kindreds, Tongues, and Nations? and this kind of universality she makes use of, as an argument to prove that she is the true Church: which may be truly said to be a part of her Witchcrafts and Sorceries, with which she hath long bewitched the Nations, even all this long night of Apostacy, in which Antichrist hath reigned, who hath blinded the invisible eye in people, and with this same pittiful shallow stuff she would fain still blind that eye which God hath opened in us: But blessed be the Lord, the day is dawned which makes all things manifest.
Secondly, And farther, consider what a slender, or blind Argument it is, to plead universality to prove the Church of
Rome to be the true Church. Surely
A. S. did not consider, that they are many, who goes in the broad way that leads to destruction, and that the whole World wondred after the Beast that carries the Whore, the false Church; neither did he consider that they are but few who finds (and walks in) the straight way which leads unto life; for had he considered these things, he would have been ashamed to have produced such an Argument to prove the Church of
Rome to be the true Church. But its clear that the universal Church of
Rome sits upon the many Waters, and reigns over the Kings of the Earth, and goes in the broad way; Therefore she is not the true Church, but the Whore.
[Page 65]Fourthly, Again, That the true Church is Apostolick, and built upon the Foundation of the holy Apostles and Prophets,
Eph. 2.20. and was propagated through the World by the Apostles, that I acknowledge, but that the Church of
Rome is Apostolick, or had her beginning in Christ and his Apostles, (as
A. S. affirmeth) or that she was propagated through the World by the Apostles, in that discipline (Ceremonies, worshipping of Idols, or Images, Murthering the People of God, &c.) in which she now stands, that I do deny, and its Abomination in
A. S. to affirm it. For consider;
First, When, or where did Christ, or his Apostles begin the practice of Bowing to Images, or Worshipping Idols? or when did any of them Bow to an Alter of Wood, or Pray with a String of Beads, or Pray to Saints, or carry a Silver, or Wooden Cross about with them, or Murder any because they were not of their Faith? The Church of
Rome cannot prove that ever Christ or his Apostles began, or practised any of these things; nor that they were in being in their dayes, we defie them; but they are inventions set up in the false Church, in the dark Night of Apostacy, that hath been over the Nations since the Apostles dayes, and are practised in the Church of
Rome to this day; Therefore she is not Apostolick, but Apostate like.
Fifthly, That the true Church, or the Members of it are visible, I shall not deny; and that she is the Light of the World, I do confess; but that the Church of
Rome is the true Church, or the Light of the World, because she is visible, that I do not acknowledge, but deny; for although the true Church, or the Members of it, are visible, yet so is the Whore also.
[Page 66]But then some will say, How are they then to be distinguished? First, I answer,
By their fruits? as Christ said,
men do not gather grapes of thorns, nor figs of thistles, Matth. 7.16.
neither can one Fountain, send forth bitter Water and sweet, James 3.12.
nor a good Tree cannot bring forth bad fruit; But the visible Church of
Rome brings forth bad fruits, and sends forth bitter Waters, as the Cruelties exercised by her, and the Murthers she hath acted for Ages past testifieth; and as the Idolatries exercised in her to this day (as before mentioned) witnesseth: For such things was never exercised by, nor in the true Church, in Christs nor the Apostles dayes; therefore though the Church of
Rome be visible, yet her fruits testifieth, that she is not the true Church.
Secondly, Again
A. S. saith, (and diabolically affirms in the second Page of his pretended Reconciler of Religions)
That the true Church is composed of both good and bad, wheat, and tares; which I do abominate to acknowledge, and is blasphemy in him to affirm: for the true Church is built of
Living Stones, 1 Pet. 2.5.
Elect and Precious; or (as
A. S. affirmeth) of living Believers: but no living Believers can be truly called the bad, nor the tares, but elect and precious; and all that are living, or precious, are the good; therefore the true Church is built of the good only.
Thirdly, but if the Church of Christ (which
A. S. in his second page, affirmeth is the Kingdom of Christ) be composed of both good and bad, then according to his own affirmation, the Kingdom of Christ is part good, and part bad, which is horrid blasphemy in
A. S. to affirm.
Oh gross darkness and confusion! Art thou a Member
[Page 67] of the Church that calls it self the light of the World? Oh, dark, dull, gloomy light! the Lord God Almighty bring all his people out of that dark Cell, that they may walk in his marvellous Light, which makes all things manifest of what sort it is.
Fourthly, But if you say that Christ likened the Kingdom to a Net that was cast into the Sea, which gathered of all Kinds;—I answer he did so; yet when it came to Land, there was none composed, or gathered into the vessels, but the good only, and the bad were cast away,
Matth. 13.48. Therefore the true Church is not composed of both good and bad, but of the good only.
Fifthly, but if you object, that the tares and wheat were both to grow together in the Fleld; I answer, they Were so untill the Harvest;
(and the Fleld is the World, Mat. 23.39. but the true Church is not of the World,
Joh. 17.14.) but when the Reapers were sent forth (which were the Angels, that had the Gospel to preach,
Rev. 14.6. who went to disciple people, and to baptize them into the true Church,
Mat. 28.19.) Their Commission was to compose or gather the Wheat only, and to seperate the Tares from it, and to bind them in bundles for the Fire,
Mat. 13.30. and therefore the true Church is not composed of both Wheat and Tares, but of Wheat only.
Sixthly, Farther, If you say that there were some in the true Church, in the Apostles days, that were false brethren, and these were bad; I answer, Though they were amongst them, yet they were not of them: as the Apostle said, 1
Joh. 2.19. Therefore the true Church is not composed of both good and bad, but of the good only.
[Page 68]But to return to the fifth part of
A. S. his Argument, where he saith,
That the Church of Rome
is known to the World, in her Bishops, Pastors, and Believers, &c. And therefore she is visible.
Answ. Although that proves her visible, yet it doth not prove her to be the true Church, but the contrary; For the true Church, that was the light of the World, was not known to the World,
John 17.14. but the visible Church of
Rome is known to the World, (as
A. S. himself affirmeth) therefore she is not the true Church, but the contrary.
Again, the true Church wrestled not with flesh and blood, neither were her weapons carnal, but spiritual, and she wrestled with spiritual wickednesses that were in the high places, and broke down the strong holds of iniquity, 2
Cor. 10.3, 4. but the Church of
Rome wrestles with flesh and blood, and kills mens bodies about Religion; as the whole
Christendom knoweth; and the spiritual wickednesses are still standing in her, as afore proved, and as all the World sufficiently knows; therefore she is not the true Church.
Sixthly, The infallibleness of the true Church, of which Christ is supreme Head & Governour, I do not go about to deny; but that the Church of
Rome is infallible, that I do deny. For,
First, Although
A. S. hath affirmed, that she hath alwayes remained since Christ's time unto this day, without interruption &c. yet he never proved it; neither can he do it; for, as before I have said, we never read that the true Church in Christ's dayes was found in such things; neither was such things then found in her as is now found in the Church of
Rome, and which the Church of
Rome is now found in: by which it is clear, that
[Page 69] she hath not alwayes remained since Christs time in the state she now stands.
Secondly, But if she hath alwayes remained, since Christ time to this day, without interruption (as
A. S. saith she hath) then she cannot possibly be the true Church; for the true Church was interrupted since the Resurrection and Ascension of Christ, (and yet remained, as hereafter I shall shew;) and in the Apostles dayes her interruption began, and some of the Apostles foresaw it, and said,
of your selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, Acts 20.30. and when they were arisen,
they withstood the truth, as Jannes
and Jambres
withstood Moses, 2
Tim. 3.8. so here the interruption of the true Church began: and after this
John saw the Dragon (interrupting, or) persecuting her into the Wilderness,
where she had a place prepared of God, that they might feed her there, a thousand, two hundred, and threescore dayes, Rev. 12.6. and ver. 13, 14. concerning which, I shall have occasion to speak more hereafter; so on this wise the true Church was interrupted since Christs dayes: But
A. S. saith, that the Church of
Rome hath always remained since Christs time without interruption; Therefore she is not the true Church.
Thirdly, And whereas
A. S. farther saith,
that the Church of Rome
shall always remain to the end of the World; and therefore she is infallible.
I answer, He hath not at all confirmed that by any proof, neither hath he any farther proof than his own affirmation; except he would produee that saying of the Mother of Harlots, (viz.)
I sit as a Queen, and am no Widdow, and shall see no sorrow, Rev. 18.7. And indeed that would be a very pittiful Argument to prove the Church of
Rome infallible; but none other can he produce (except he could first prove her to be the true Church,
[Page 70] which he is never able to do; his best Argument by which he hath undertaken it, being already confuted) Therefore we have no more cause to believe his Affirmation, than we have to believe the sayings of the forementioned Mother of Harlots, for they are both alike to us; and though she said, she should see no sorrow, yet
John (who was in the Spirit of the Lord) said,
that in one day her Desolation should come, Rev. 18.8. And although
A. S. saith,
That the Church of Rome
shall alwayes remain to the end of the World; yet I say, in the Name of the Lord, and by the same Spirit that
John was in, That the one day, of which
John spake, is already dawned, in which the Desolation of that Great Whore, the Church of
Rome shall come; and as surely, as when
Sodom was overthrown, the Cities round about it were overthrown also, 2
Pet. 2.9.
Jude ver. 7. so certainly, when this great City
Babylon is overthrown, and made desolate, the Suburbs thereof shall be overthrown, and made desolate also. The Mouth of the Lord hath spoken it, and therefore she must fail in her Prophesies, and cease in her Beeing, which, as
A. S. saith, the true Church cannot.
Fourthly, And farther, the Church of
Rome is variable in her Judgments, as the diversities of Councels that she hath held concerning matters of Faith, beareth witness; for the following General Counsel hath oft-times excluded that, which was concluded on by the former: and surely both cannot be infallible, they being quite contradictory one to the other. Read the 15th chapter of
F. H. his Book, entituled, THE GLORY OF THE TRUE CHURCH DISCOVERED, &c. wherein the contradictions of the General Counsels which the Church of
Rome hath held, are sufficiently made manifest; so that I need not trouble my self to insert them here: and
[Page 71] thereby its evident enough, that the Church of
Rome is not infallible.
Fifthly, Again, if
A. S. or any other, could prove that the Church of
Rome had alwayes remained since Christs time; yet, as aforesaid, that is not a sufficient Argument to prove her infallible, or that she cannot fail, nor cease. For consider, the Dragon, that old Serpent, called the Devil, who was a Murtherer from the beginning, (who gave power to the Beast that carries the Whore, that drinks the Saints blood, that said she should see no sorrow) was before the dayes of Christ's appearance in the flesh, yet the Dragon is not infallible; But the Church of
Rome is upheld by the Murtherer, or carried by the Dragons power in the Beast, as the Murthers acted by her beareth witness; therefore she is no more infallible than the Dragon is.
Seventhly, And as to the 7th part of
A. S. his Argument, wherein he saith,
The True Church is inerrable, and then saith,
that the Church of Rome
is this inerrable True Church: for all the Sectaries, Schismaticks, and Hereticks in the World, saith he,
could never yet shew wherein she erred, nor ever shall: Therefore she is inerrable.
Answ. 1. I answer, although the Hereticks could not prove that the Church of
Rome hath erred, yet there are many, who are members of the true Church, of which Christ is Head, and supreme Governour alone, that can prove wherein she hath erred, and doth still grosly err from the Doctrine, Practice, and Discipline of the true Church, as it stood in the Apostles dayes: for the Apostle in his dayes said,
Let every man be fully perswaded in his own Conscience, Rom. 14.5. and did not go about to force People to conform to such things, that they were not perswaded of in their consciences, nor to compel them by
[Page 72] outward Laws to conform thereunto; but the Church of
Rome doth not admit, that every one should walk or act, according as they are perswaded in their own Consciences, but goes about by outward Laws to compel them to conform to that which she calls her holy Ordinances and Institutions, which many, for conscience sake towards Gods, dare not conform to, because they know them to be invented Idolatries; and they, who cannot for Conscience sake submit to her Impositions, or drink of her Cup of Abominations, then to be sure she will drink their Blood: Witness the Blood she hath drunk (for above this thousand years past) of them that could not, for Conscience sake towards God, conform to her Ordinances: And therefore she hath erred from that Spirit which was in the true Church, and from the Apostles Doctrine, and is still in the Error.
Secondly, In the true Church in the Apostles dayes, every one, as he had received the Gift of the Spirit of God, so he might Administer, 1
Pet. 4.10. and the Prophets might speak two or three; and if any thing was revealed to him that stood by, he might speak, and the first should be silent, 1
Cor. 14.29, 30, 31. But this is not the order of the Church of
Rome, as is sufficiently manifested to all
Christendom; therefore she hath erred from the Apostles Spirit and Order, and is still in the Error: And thus I might produce many more Arguments, to shew wherein the Church of
Rome hath erred, and doth err, only my desire is to be as brief as may be, so that satisfaction may be given: for which I doubt not but this is sufficient, as to that particular.
8. And as concerning Miracles in the true Church, I do confess and bear witness, that there are Miracles wrought in her daily; but that all Miracles are an Argument sufficient
[Page 73] to prove a people to be the true Church; that I do not acknowledge, but deny: For,
First, the Magicians of
Egypt could by their Sorceries, or Inchantments imitate those things in the sight of the
Egyptians, that
Moses and
Aaron did by the Power of God,
Exod. 8.7. and the false Prophet he wrought lying Miracles before the Beast that carries the Whore, insomuch that he caused fire to come down out of Heaven in the sight of men,
Rev. 13.13, 14. and
chap. 19.
ver. 20. And this the Whore might have said was done in confirmation of her faith & doctrines; (as
A. S. doth) yet nevertheless it was done by the Dragons power, who was a Murderer from the beginning; For he gave power to the Beast (that carries the Whore) to do such things,
Rev. 13.2. and therefore the Miracles in the Church of
Rome (if now there be any) is no infallible evidence to prove her to be the true Church. Well,
2. But then it may be some will say, that this is harsh judgment, and how can you tell but that the Miracles wrought in the Church of
Rome, are wrought by the Power of God? or how can you distinguish between Miracles wrought by the Power of God, and Miracles wrought by the Dragons power.
Answ. I answer, we have an infallible way to judge in this particular; For, all Miracles wrought by the murdering power, are not wrought by the Power of God, but by the Dragons power, for the Dragon, that old Serpent, who is called the Devil, was a Murderer from the beginning, (but Christ the Power of God, is not a murdering power,
for he came not to destroy mens lives, but to save them, Luke 9.56. Therefore the Miracles wrought by Christ, the Power of God, are not wrought by a murdering power) But the Miracles of the Church of
Rome (if now there be any)
[Page 72]
[...]
[Page 73]
[...]
[Page 74] are wrought by a murdering power; for the many murders she hath acted, sufficiently testifieth to the whole
Christendom, that a murdering power rules in her: By which its clear, that the Miracles wrought in the Church of
Rome,) if there be any) are wrought by the Dragons power, and not by the Power of God: So that my judgement concerning the Miracles in the Church of
Rome is not harsh, but according to the Spirit of Truth and sound Reason.
Thirdly, but for all
A. S. in his Epistle Dedicatory, hath made such a great noise about Miracles wrought by a Roman Catholick Priest in and about
London and
Westminster, yet when he comes to prove that the Church of
Rome is powerful in Miracles, then he doth just as much as nothing, but takes an easie way to get out from that thing, which seemingly he undertook to go thorow with, by referring of us for a witness of his Affirmation to
nostre dame de Loretto, nostre dame de Montague, nostre dame de Hall, and to the whole World,
&c. Now what a pittiful proof or witness is this, which
A. S. directs us to; For as the Apostles saith,
the whole World lies in wickedness, 1
John. 5.19. and wonders after the Beast, by whom lying Miracles are wrought,
Rev. 13.3. So that the Miracles which the World bears witness to, are lying Miracles; for the World knows not Christ, nor his Church, 1
Joh. 3.1. by whom true Miracles are wrought; for when Christ wrought Miracles amongst the World, they did not bear witness to him, but said he did it by the Prince of Devils,
Mat. 9.34. So that the witness that
A. S. calls for, confirmeth my forementioned Affirmation,
viz. That, the Miracles in the Church of
Rome are wrought by the Dragons power in the Beast, and false Prophet, that the whole World wonders after.
Fourthly, and for
nostre dame de Loretto, and the rest mentioned,
[Page 75] they signifie nothing as to our satisfaction in this particular, because they are altogether unknown to us; neither can we attain to a certain knowledge of them, if we would; for the information of the Church of
Rome is to us no satisfaction; so as I said before (that
A. S.) for matter of proving his Affirmation, hath done just as much as nothing; only made a shew, like a Cloud without Rain: But methinks, if there were so many Miracles wrought daily, by a Roman Priest about
London, &c. as
A. S. seems to make a noise of; he should have instanced some of them particularly for our satisfaction: but seeing he hath not instanced any, we have just cause to believe, that there are none at all.
Ninthly, So to proceed to the ninth part of
A. S. his first Argument,
viz. Out of the True Church none can be saved.
I answer, That thing I do not at all deny, for all that are saved are of the true Church; but that none can be saved out of the Church of
Rome, that I do deny; for the Church of
Rome is not the true Church, but the Whore that drinks the Blood of the Saints, as afore-proved; therefore out of the Church of
Rome people may be saved. Wherefore let all who expect or desire Salvation make haste out of this great City
Babylon: And run for your lives towards
Jerusalem, the holy City, the true Church, the Lambs Wife, in whose Light the Nations of them that are saved must walk,
Rev. 21.24. lest you perish within the Borders of
Babylon, whose desolation shall certainly come in one day: Yea, Death, and Mourning, and Famine, for strong is the Lord, who (is now arisen and) judgeth her.
The Mystery of the Whore farther discovered.Well, But if the Church of
Rome saith, That she doth not drink the blood of the Saints, but the blood of Hereticks, &c. and therefore she is the true Church.
[Page 76]1. I answer, so, or to that effect, said the Destroyers and Murderers in all Ages, even they that put Christ to death; they did it not in their own account, as he was the Son of God, but as a Blasphemer; and the Apostles were persecuted as Spreaders of Heresie, and Shedders of Sedition, and not as Saints and Servants of the Lord, in their Adversaries account,
Acts 24.5. and thus the murdering persecuting spirit hath in all Ages, as at this day sought to shelter it self, but this covering must now be ript off, for the Power of God is arisen that rends the vail of Darkness, and the Day is dawned that makes all things manifest.
2. And further; If they were Heretick,
&c. whose blood the Church of
Rome drinks, yet that doth not argue that she is the true Church, but the contrary; for the true Church did never drink the blood of Hereticks, nor persecute any, because they were Hereticks; but the greatest punishment that ever Christ appointed for Hereticks, was, that they should account them as
Publicans, and
Heathens, Mat. 18.17.
3. So its clear, that Christ the Power of God, and the true Church that had the mind of Christ, did never kill, nor persecute any because they were Hereticks, or did not believe, nor yet because (after they believed) they made shipwrack of faith; but laboured in the Spirit of Love and Meekness, to restore them, and to convince them by sound Doctrine; but if they refused to receive admonition, or to submit to the Church after due admonition given, then they let them receive the punishment aforesaid, and refused to have fellowship with them, and this was the greatest punishment that ever the true Church inflicted upon any, though they were Rebellious, and this was the way to make true Believers of people, which force and compulsion, by penal Laws will never do: though its true, compulsive
[Page 77] Laws may make many of them Hypocrites, who fears man more then God; but they who fears not man that can kill the body, and can do no more, but fears the Lord God almighty above all, such will not bow to the compulsive Laws of men, which violates the righteous Law of God in their own hearts, (no more then
Shadrach, Meshach and
Abednego would bow to the Image that
Nebuchadnezar set up) though for their stedfastness they suffer the pangs of death, as many of their Predecessors have done, whose blood the Church of
Rome hath drunk.
Thus much in brief to the nine particulars of
A. S. his first Argument, by which (I perceive) he thought he had infallibly proved the Church of
Rome to be the true Church; but what his Argument is worth for his purpose, let all who reads this judge.
And the next thing he undertakes, is, to prove
Peter to be the Rock or Foundation upon which Christ built his Church; and to accomplish this design, he rambles through several Languages, into which the Scripture hath bin translated; and in the conclusion he saith (a great lie)
to Peter
then Christ said, upon thee I will build my Church, &c. when none of the several Languages (which he makes use of to prove it) say any such thing, according to his own interpretation of them; and indeed its blasphemy in
A. S. to affirm it: But then he saith,
That Christ is the primary Rock, and Peter
the secondary Rock.
Reply. But how can that be, that
Peter should be a secondary Rock, for
A. S. cannot prove that God ever ordained, or appointed a secondary Rock to build his Church on, (neither do we in all the Scriptures read of a secondary Rock once mentioned) for the Apostle affirmeth the contrary, saying,
Another Foundation can no man lay, then that which is already laid, 1 Cor. 3.11.
which is Jesus
[Page 78] Christ: So he is the first, and the last, the beginning and the end; and
A. S. his Affirmation is nothing worth for his purpose: nay, its worse then nothing, for it discovers his Deceit and Ignorance, though I perceive his intent and aim was to gratifie his Master the Pope, by pleading his Supremacy, under pretence of setting
Peter above the rest of the Apostles, when indeed, its manifest enough, that his intent was to set up the Pope, as Lord and Master over Gods Heritage, Gentile like, contrary to that saying of our [one] Lord Christ,
viz. Be not many Masters, for one is your Master, even Christ, and all ye are brethren, Mat- 23.8. So that
Peter was not set up as a visible head over, the Church of Christ, as
A. S. saith the Pope is over the. Church of
Rome, neither was
Peter above other of the Apostles, but a fellow-Servant with them, and they all fellow-workers together with Christ, 2
Cor. 6.1. and
Paul was not at all inferiour to
Peter (in relation to his spiritual authority) for he himself said (yet not boastingly, but truly)
that he came not behind the very chiefest Apostles, 2
Cor. 12.11. So that
Peter was no more the Rock then
Paul was; and what was
Paul; or what was
Apollo; or
Peter either, but Ministers by whom the Church believed, 1
Cor. 3.5?
So it was not the work of the Apostles to set themselves one above another, for
they abased themselves, that the Lord Jesus Christ might be exalted: Neither did they preach themselves,
but Jesus Christ the Lord, and themselves Servants, &c. 2
Cor. 4.5. by which it appears that the Pope doth not truly succeed
Peter in the same spirit that he and the rest of the Apostles were in, who had the Spirit and mind of Christ, who made himself of no reputation,
Phil. 2.7. but the Pope truly succeeds those whom the Apostle saw would come, that would be
covetous Boasters, and
[Page 79] proud Blasphemers, 2 Tim. 3.2. as doth appear by his preaching up himself, and his boasting of his great power and superiority, witness
Fox his Acts, the first Volume pag. 1023.
and so on; where you may read at large how several of the
Popes of
Rome have sufficiently declared themselves to be
covetous Boasters, and
proud Blasphemers, and have also laid themselves open enough to the view of all who have an eye to see, so that I need not produce any farther Argument to prove the
Pope a proud Blasphemer.
Then
[...]
A. S. in his third chapter undertakes to prove,
That neither all Sects, nor any one of them, is the true Church, &c. Whose Cause I am not engaged in, nor intend to plead, therefore I shall let that pass. But his fourth and fifth Chapters contains several Arguments, by which he undertakes farther to prove the Church of
Rome to be the true Church; together with some Queries propounded. To which I intend to return a brief and sober Answer.
1.
First, A. S. saith,
That which was once the true Church is now, &c. But the Roman
Pontificial was once the true Church, &c. I answer, I do not deny but that there was a true Church at
Rome in the Apostles dayes, but that the Church now at
Rome is therefore the true Church, that doth not follow; for as I have before proved, the true Church in the Apostles dayes was far different, both in Discipline and Practice from the Church of
Rome that now is.
But then
A. S. saith,
If the Roman
Pontificial did fall, what Church did she fall from? If she did fail, when, &c?
I answer,
Paul in the first Chapter in his Epistle to the Church of
Rome, spake of some, who
when
[...] God, did not glorifie him as God, but became vain in their imaginations,
[Page 70] and changed the glory of the incorruptible God, into an Image made like to corruptible man; and so not liking to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them up to a reprobate mind, and they were filled with unrighteousness, fornication, and wickedness, covetousness, envy, murder, &c. Rom. 1.21, 23, 28, 29. And is not this the very state of the Church of
Rome at this day? is she not now filled with these things? Surely yes; Thousands of thousands must acknowledge it, if they consider it, and speak the truth. Oh the murders acted by her, and the blood she hath drunk, as before hinted, and the Adulteries committed within her Borders. Indeed these, and many other her abominations, are innumerable, as she her self full well knows; therefore she is indeed faln, and deeply revolted from that pure Spirit, in which the true Church stood in the Apostles dayes: Thence she is faln, and the time when she fell, was, when she began to enter into these aforesaid abominations that is now found in her. Well,
2dly. But then
A. S. saith,
That if the true Church be infallible, she must have alwayes remained without interruption, since Christs time, to this day, &c.
I answer, although the true Church be infallible, yet it doth not absolutely follow, that she must have alwayes remained without interruption unto this day; for, as I have already proved, the true Church was interrupted by the Dragon, and was persecuted into the Wilderness, but she did not fail, but remained there, and had a being there, a place prepared of God for her; concerning which I shall have occasion to speak more fully shortly.
3dly. But
A. S. saith,
That no other Church on Earth hath remained unto this day without interruption, beside the Roman
Pontificial, and therefore she is the true Church.
[Page 81]I answer no, she is not therefore the true Church, but the Whore; for as I have already proved, the true Church was interrupted, and yet remained.
4. But then said A. S.
If any can say, that there hath remained any other Church on Earth, since Christs time unto this day without interruption, and error, let him tell what was she, or what is she? where was she? or where is she, what is her name? what Bishops, Pastors, and Believers had she, or yet hath she? what Emperors or Kings did adhere to her, or now do? what general Councils did she hold? what Hereticks did she condemn? what Academies did she erect or confirm; what Churches or Monastries did she build? &c. And then said he,
To these, and such like Interrogatories, all the Schismaticks, Sectaries, and Hereticks in the World cannot answer.
Answ. To which I answer, Although all the Sectaries in the World cannot answer those questions; yet there are many, who are Members of the true Church (not of the Church of
Rome) that can answer them; and first, I say there hath remained another Church since Christs time to this day (besides the
Roman Pontificial that now is) though not without interruption; yet the true Church (as before proved) was interrupted. And as to those questions,
(viz.) What was she, or what is she? &c.
I answer, she was in
Johns day
a wonder in Heaven, a Woman cloathed with the Sun (that and there she was)
and the Moon was under her Feet, and upon her Head a Crown of twelve Stars, Rev. 12.1. And having brought forth a man-child, that was to rule all Nations with his rod of Iron, the enmity of the Dragon then arose, who sought to devour the Man-child; but being by the Hand of God prevented of his purpose on the man-child,
ver. 5. he than cast out his flood of Persecution after the Woman,
ver. 15. (of whom this Ruler was born) and drove her into the
[Page 82] Wilderness whither she fled from him, to her place prepared of God, that they might feed her there
a thousand two hundred and threescore dayes, Rev. 12.6.14. (
To A. S. his Query (viz.) where was she?and there she hath been) and there she hath sitten as in a sollitary place, and in a Mourning State and Condition, out of which she
To, where is she? is now returning, and is now coming up out of the Wilderness, and is descending from God, as a Bride adorned for her Husband,
Rev. 21.2. and her
To A. S's query, what is her name? name is,
the Bride, the Lambs Wife, the holy City, ver. 9.
New Jerusalem. And now is
Jerusalem shaking her self from the Dust of the Earth (in which she hath been trodden of the Gentiles (and now is she putting on her beautiful Garments, and now doth the Solitary begin to rejoyce, and the barren that did not bear, begins to break forth into singing,
Isa. 54.1. And the things that many prophets desired to see, and could not see, is now seen and revealing; glory to God in the highest, The day is come which we have waited for, we will be glad and rejoyce in it; and now the Time, Times, and a half Time. is expired, in which the true Church hath been fed in the Wilderness; and now is the forty and two Moneths expired also, for which Time the holy City hath
been trodden under foot of the Gentiles, Rev. 11.2. in which Time the Beast had power given him to continue,
Rev. 13.5. and the whole World wondered after him, and worshipped him, and in that Time it was given unto him,
to make war with the Saints, and to overcome them; and he received power over all Kindreds, and Tongues and Nations, that all that dwelt upon the Earth should worship him, whose names were not written in the Book of Life, of the Lamb slain from the Foundation of the World; if any man have an Ear, let
[Page 83] him hear, Rev. 13.7, 8, 9. And this was the Time that the true Church was in her mourning state, which now begins to be over; Glory to God for ever, the day of rejoycing is come.
And for her
Bishops, Pastors, and Believers that she had.
I answer, Christ was, and is her Bishop and chief Pastor, 1
Pet. 2.25. And the rest (after the Apostles days) were they that fed her in the Wilderness; and her Believers were those that had the
Testimony of Jesus, Rev. 12.17. whose Blood the Whore drunk. And they are now her Believers, whose Blood the Whore thirsts after. And as to that question
(viz.) What Emperors or Kings did adhere to her, or now do?
Answ. I answer, On this wise did the Pharisees Query with those Officers whom they sent to take Jesus and bring him unto them, saying,
Have any of the Rulers, or of the Pharisees believed on him? Joh. 7.48. Well, what Emperors or Kings did adhere to him at that time? Was he not therefore the true Christ, because the Rulers of the World, and the Pharisees rejected him? And what said the Apostle to the true Church in his day?
You see your calling, Brethren, how that not many wise men after the Flesh, not many mighty, nor noble, &c.
but God hath chosen the foolish things of this World, to confound the wise, &c.
that Flesh might not glory in his Presence, 1 Cor. 1.26, 27. And further, the Apostle (who preacht Christ) said,
That he preached the Wisdom of God in a Mistery, which none of the Princes of the World know, &c. 1 Cor. 2.7, 8. By which it appeares, that none of the Princes of the World knew Christ, the Wisdom of God▪ 1
Cor. 1.24. And the true Church was in the World as Christ was; for the Apostle said, as
[...], so are we in this present World, 1
Joh. 4.17.
And
[...]
[Page 84] World knows as not, ver. 1.
because it knew not him. So that understanding the Princes of this World knew not Christ, when he was amongst them, and although the Rulers believed not in him, nor did adhere to him, when he was come; yet that did not argue, that he was not the true Christ. And notwithstanding it was so, that the true Church was unknown to the World, and was composed not of many wise men after the flesh, nor of the Nobles of the Earth, but was persecuted by them (as she is at this day) yet she was the true Church for all that.
And seeing it was so, that the Princes and Rulers did not adhere to her, in the time of her flourishing state (when she was cloathed with the Sun) how can it be expected that they should adhere to her in her persecuted state, and in her mourning Wilderness-state (for a
rich man shall very hardly enter the Kingdom,
Mat. 19.23. but there is more in them words) And moreover, seeing the Kings of the Earth committed Fornication with the great Whore, and went into her, how then can it possibly be expected that they should adhere to the true Church? Surely all who have a spiritual eye open, may be hereby satisfied as to this particular. And further, as to that Query
(viz.) What general Councils did she hold, and what Hereticks did she Condemn?
Answ. I answer, she hath not been in a capacity in her Wilderness-state to hold General Counsels, as in the time of her flourishing state; yet the mighty God hath alwayes been her wonderful Counsellor,
Isa. 9.6. and the Members of her hath stood in (and held to) his Counsel, according to the manifestation thereof received by them, not loving their lives unto death, as the Church of
Rome well knows, (who have drunk the blood of many of them) or shall know
[Page 85] to her sorrow and pangs. And as for the true Churches condemning Hereticks; the Church of
Rome knows, that those members of her, whose blood she hath drunk, did alwayes condemn those Heresies, that are healed, and the Idolatries acted in the Church of
Rome, and did always give Testimony against her Superstitious inventions, and denied to have Fellowship with her therein, and looked upon her as reprobated from the true Faith (as
Fox his
Acts copiously relates) and this was a great Condemnation, as the Spirit of Christ gave commission to the true Church to pass upon Hereticks.
Again, as to that question,
viz. What Academies did she erect.
Answ. I answer, A people Erecting of Academies, is not an Argument sufficient to prove them to be the true Church; for what Academies, or Universities did the Apostles erect or confirm, or attain the Knowledge of God in? Was it not the Light that shined in their Hearts, that gave them this knowledge? 2
Cor. 4.6. And was not this Light the Law, that was the Apostles Schoolmaster till Christ?
Gal. 3.24. And is not the Law which is Light,
Pro. 6.23. written in the hearts of all people? And is it not a sufficient Schoolmaster now, to bring people (who are taught by it) unto the knowledge of the Glory of God, in the Face of Christ, as it did the Apostles then? What need then is there of erecting Academies; for people cannot attain to the Knowledg of God by natural Learning, 1
Cor. 1.21. nor thereby be made true Ministers of Jesus Christ. Yet I am not against having an outward School-house, or some convenient place for the educating, or bringing up of children in Natural Learning, which is good in its place; but that any can thereby be brought to the Knowledge of God, or made true Ministers of Jesus Christ, that I cannot own. Neither was this way of making Ministers by Natural-Learning, or
[Page 86] setting of them up by man, in being, untill people had forsaken the right way, and went into
Cains way, and
Balaams, and then the envy and murder began amongst the profest Christians, and then they could not endure sound Doctrine, but heapt up to themselves Teachers according, to their own hearts lusts, who knew nothing but what they knew naturally, as bruit Beasts, &c. and this the Apostle
Paul foresaw; and wote of to
Timothy, 2.
Tim. 4.3. and
Peter prophesied of them also, 2
Pet. 2. and
John and
Jude saw them come; 1
John 2.18.
Jude 10.11. so that by natural learning, and ordination of man, no true Minister of Christ was ever made, or sent forth; but contrariwise, the Apostle
Paul was made a Minister,
(viz.) not of man, nor by men, nor yet by natural learning,
but by the Revelation of Jesus Christ, Gal. 1.1. so we do not understand that in the Apostles dayes they did erect Accademies, or that they had any need of them, and indeed I cannot but look upon it as an Ignorant question to be proposed by
A. S. upon this account. But to his next Query,
viz. What Churches and Monasteries did she build?
Answ. I answer, this is as Ignorant a question as the former, and great foolishness to ask, what Churches the Church built? however this I say, they who were Members of the true Church, did
build up one another in their most holy faith, Jude 20. And as for Monasteries, or Monk-houses, we hear of such thing that was in being in the Apostles dayes, neither do we believe that there is any need of them; for we do not read in the holy Scriptures, that ever the true Church, in any Generation, built such places; but we know, that many such places have been erected and built within the borders of the great City
Babylon, since the Apostacy began, and since the right
[Page 87] way was forsaken, and many other Superstitious inventions and Idolatries, as before hinted, hath been set up, relating to the Beasts and Dragons worship,
all which God hath determined to throw down; and when the Desolation of all these things cometh, and the seven Mountains upon which the Whore sits, comes to be laid waste, according as hath been prophesied in Ages past, Isa. 42.15.
And when the great Whore comes to drink the Cup of Gods fury, which is already filled into the hands of the Saints of the most High, to pour out unto her, Rev. 12. I say, then shall she knows that God hath spoken by me; and that I have herein declared the Truth according as I received it from, and by the Spirit of the Lord. And thus much as to his Queries.
But then he speaks of another Clear and Easie Way to find out the True Church, te try all Churches by the true Catechism, and see which of them all sayes it truly, believes it rightly, &c. and that which doth, is the true.
Answ. I answer, to try all Churches by their Doctrine, and Practice, and see which is most agreeable to the Principles, Doctrines, and Practice of the true Church in the Apostles dayes, is indeed a way that I do very well approve of; and if all controversies betwixt you and us might be decided after this manner, (laying aside all carnal Weapons, carnal Laws, Prisons, Fires, and the like, which hath been the Weapons that the Church of
Rome hath defended her self with, for many Ages past, and doth at this day) I say then it would be indeed well, and we shall be very willing to engage with you with spiritual Weapons, bring the best you can form or find out; but for carnal Weapons, we are redeemed from them, and the Weapons of our warfare are spiritual; so I say, upon equal terms we shall be very willing to dispute the matters with
[Page 88] you; that are in controversie betwixt us, and they who are found, either you or us, in Doctrine, Life, and Practice, to be most agreeable to the true Church in the primitive times, shall be owned, and acknowledged to be the true Church now at this day. And they who are detected to be in the Steps, Practises, and Doctrines of them, whom the holy Prophets, Christ, and his Apostles testified against, shall be concluded to be the false Church now at this day: and upon these termes, as I said before, we shall be very ready and willing to joyn issue with you, at any time or place, that you with us shall agree upon.
And whereas
A. S. saith,
That all the Schismaticks, Sectaries and Hereticks in the World, cannot truely say that Prayer that Christ taught his Disciples, viz. Our Father which art in Heaven &c. or, said he,
they are continually doing the Works of the Devil, and are his children, and consequently cannot truly call God Father.
I answer, therefore the Church of
Rome cannot call God Father, for she is, and long hath been, doing the works of the Devil, the Murderer, as before proved; therefore she is of her father the Devil, and cannot call God Father in Truth and in Righteousness. Then
A. S. rambles through several other particulars, in which he controverts with Sectaries, &c. whose cause I am not concerned to plead, only this small hint before I have given to prove the Church of
Rome one of those Sects, who cannot speak the fore-mentioned words truly, and so I shall leave the Sectaries, with whom
A. S. controverts, to plead their own cause; for the thing that was chiefly in my heart, when I took in hand to write this brief Reply, was to prove the Church of
Rome not to be the true Church; and the Chief Arguments by him Produced to prove
[Page 89] her the True Church, I have already in brief answered.
Again,
A. S. in his 6th Chapter, makes it his business to prove the Church to be the Judge of all controversies in matters of faith, and saith,
That not every man, nor human reason, nor the private Spirit, nor the Bible is this Judge; and to prove it, he quotes
Matth. 18.17. where Christ said,
tell the Church, &c.
Answ. To which I answer, That the Judgement of the true Church, of which Christ is Head, in matters of Faith, I do not deny; for being governed in all things by the Head Christ,
(to whom all Judgment is committed, John 5.20.) the Judgment thereof must of necessity be Ture, (for the Strength of
Israel cannot Lye) and ought for to be submitted unto by all; But the Church of
Rome being not the True Church, (she being not Governed by the invisible Head, Christ, to whom all Judgment is committed, as before proved) Therefore she is not Judge of Controversies in matters of Faith. And the True Church, to whom Christ said,
He that Heareth you, Heareth me, were such as heard Christ, and in whom the Spirit of the Father spake,
Mat. 10.20. But the Church of
Rome doth not hear Christ, as hereafter I shall prove; therefore they who hear the Church of
Rome, do not hear Christ. But surely when
A. S. began this work of deciding Controversies, he had forgotten that the Church was the only Judge in that particular, and not every man, nor the private spirit; for had he considered that, (he being but a particular man) would not have undertaken the Churches work; as appears by the Title of his Book he hath, for he calls it,
A brief Decider of all Controversies in matters of Faith, which Book we have cause to judge is his own only
[Page 90] work, and not the Churches; in which we find him condemning himself for the thing which he is doing; for, as appears by his aforesaid Title, himself undertakes to decide controversies; and in his 6th Chapter he affirmeth, 'That the Church is the only Judge, or decider of all controversies: But this is, that his confusion may the more appear, as it hath done in many other things, as may be seen in this small Treatise; and surely, if the Pope have no better Servants then
A. S. to do his work for him, he had better keep them idle, than to employ them in such a work; for in the end they will bring more shame to him than they will honour; for such like confusions, and other abominations, have already made the very name of the Pope an ill favour to all true Christians.
And one thing more in
A. S. his 6th Chapter, I cannot well omit to observe, where he said,
‘The spirit inspireth when he will, and you hear his voice, but cannot tell whence, from God or the Devil he doth come, or whither to Heaven or to Hell he doth go;’ and then saith,
‘So is every one that is born of the spirit;’ and to prove this, he quotes
Luke 9.55. where Christ said,
Ye know not what Spirit ye are of.
Now consider the blindness, and ignorance, or else the wilful wickedness, of
A. S. who jumbles a deal of Scriptures together, blasphemously wresting of them to his own destruction, or at least, to the destruction of his own work in hand, thinking thereby to blind the minds of people, and with his good words, (mixed with blasphemies) and fair speeches, to deceive the hearts of the simple, as his Predecessors have done in the long night of Apostacy, which hath been over all Nations since the Apostles days. But its in vain for him to strive to accomplish his end, for the Day is dawned unto many, and there is an eye opened
[Page 91] in many thousands in this Nation of
England, that gives them to see over, and beyond all this Babylonish or confused trumpery, and stuff, and have a feeling of that which was before
Babylon was, and shall out-last
Babylon, to the praise of God, and to the glory and honour of his Name, who is blessed for ever. Well,
Although it was so, that Christ said unto his Disciples,
You know not what spirit ye are of, yet consider the time when he spake these words; was it not before they were born of the Spirit? (although called to be Apostles) for Christ said unto them,
you must be born again, John. 3.7, 8.
and that he would send them the Spirit (of which he said they must be born)
which shall lead them into all Truth, John 16.13. and he did not say, as
A. S. doth, that they should not know whence (from God or the Devil) the Spirit came, or whither (to Heaven or to Hell) it went: Oh, horrid blasphemy in
A. S! who saith, so is every one that is born of the Spirit; as much as to say, that he that is born of the Spirits knows not whether he be from God, or the Devil; or whither he shall go, to Heaven or to Hell: Oh, wickedness indeed! Christ said no such things, as
A. S. doth, although that blessed worthy saying of our Saviour and Lord Christ, was, and is very true,
(viz.) Marvel not that I say unto you, that you must be born again; for the wind bloweth where it listeth, and men hears the sound thereof, but cannot tell from whence it cometh, nor whither it goeth; adding,
even so is every one that is born of the Spirit, John 3.7, 8. (Mark) they that were born of the Spirit, were unknown to the World; for said the Apostle (after they were born again)
the World knows us not. So, although they were in the World, and men saw them, yet the World knew them not, no more than they knew from whence the wind came, and wither it went, which they heard the sound of;
[Page 92] and indeed so is the state of the True Church in the World at this day.
And the Apostles did know from whence the Spirit came, and of what Spirit they were, after they received the Spirit of Truth, and were born of it, for Christ told them,
John 14.16.
That he would Pray the Father, and he should send them the Holy Ghost, the Conforter, John 16.7, 13.
Which should ABIDE with them for ever; and they did receive it, and were led by it into a Heavenly Habitation, Ephes. 1.3.
For they were made to sit together in Heavenly Places in Christ Jesus: So its hereby clear, that the Apostles knew from whence the Spirit came, and whither it led them; and its also plain, that
A. S. either wilfully or sottishly wrests the Words of Christ, and by his additious to them, would make them import another thing, than was intended by him, of purpose to divert People from being led by the Spirit of God, or to disswade them from adhering to the leadings of it, under pretence that they cannot tell whence, (from God or the Devil) it doth come, or whither (to Heaven or to Hell) it goeth, when indeed Christ's words in themselves importeth quite another thing, as above shewed.
Wherefore let all mind and obey the Spirit of Truth, which will lead into all Truth, and condemn sin in the Flesh, and will lead out of all Unrighteousness, and Errours, and Heresies, which the Church of
Rome is full of, and that Spirit which condemns the Abominations of the Whore, and all Sin and Unrighteousness, that is the Spirit of God, and comes from God, through the Son of his love, who is the Light of the World, that lighteth every man that cometh into the World, and
[Page 93] leadeth up unto God the Father, from whence it commeth, all who are Taught and Guided by it; but condemneth from God all who in Unbelief, or in Rebellion do dispight unto it, and disobey the Motions thereof.
But to return to the matter concerning the Churches being Judge.
First, I find
A. S. in the beginning of his seventh chapter saying,
Methinks I hear a Quaker
whispering, The Light that is in thee is the Judge of all Controversies, and the Law and Rule according to which thou must walk.
Answ. I answer, Yea, The People called
Quakers do believe and say, That the Light which every man is enlightened with, is the Law and Rule according to which every man ought to walk, and is the Judge in all Controversies in Matters of Faith; for (as before)
All Judgment is committed unto the Son, Joh. 5.22.
Who lighteth every man that cometh into the World; so all Judgment being committed to the Light, that lighteth every man, the Light that is in every man must of necessity be the Judge of all Controversies: And this I further add, That all who are Baptized into Christ, hath put on Christ, and all who are by one Spirit Baptized into one Body, (though they were sometimes Darkness) are made Light in the Lord, and so they being in him, and he in them, are all one, even as Christ and the Father is one, and he that sanctifieth, and they that are Sanctified, are all of one; by which its clear, that Christ in his Church, who is Light with him, is the onely Judge of all Controversies: and indeed this supernatural Light is the true Touch-stone, by which all spitits may be tried, whether they be of God, or not; for, as the Apostle said,
Whatsoever makes manifest,
[Page 94] is light, Ephesians 5.13. so that without this Touchstone, none can try spirits, because an evil spirit may speak good words.
Again, Christ is in all things to be the Example of all Believers;
and he lighteth every man that cometh into the World, John 1.9. so every man being enlightened with the light of his Spirit, who is to be our example in all things, it must of necessity be, that the Light that is in us is this Judge, and the Law and Rule according to which all ought to walk.
Secondly, But then
A. S. replyes,
That the Light that is in thee tells thee, that thou must hear Christ, and Christ tells thee, that thou must hear the Church, &c.
Answ. I answer, Yea, the Light that is in us teacheth us to hear Christ, who hath enlightened us, and also to hear his Church, with whom he dwells, and that hears him, and in whom his Spirit speaks; so, as I said before, I shall not go about to deny the Authority of the True Church; but the usurped authority of the Church of
Rome I do deny; usurp'd, I say, because she hath been, and here is, sufficiently proved not to be the true Church (to whom Christ gives power and authority both to bind and to loose) therefore her authority if usurp'd, and she is not to be heard, but to be turned away from.
Thirdly,
A. S. saith,
If you object, that the Spiritual judgeth all things; and the Spirituall is judged of no man. I answer, that the godly Spiritual judgeth all things, &c. But I deny that you, or any other Sectaries in the World, is Godly Spiritual, for, as St.
Augustine saith, they have not the Holy Ghost that are out of the Church.
[Page 95]
Reply, To which I say, that as
A. S. hath confessed,
That the spiritual man judgeth all things, its according to my own belief; but what doth this avail the Church of
Rome, who as I have proved is not godly spiritual; but is sensual and devilish, and is not the true Church, but the Whore; for although, as he saith, The godly spiritual is judged of none; yet the Whore is judged of all who are godly spiritual; and although
A.S. denyeth, that the Quakers are godly spiritual, yet he is never able to prove his affirmation; for though they have not the holy Ghost who are out of the Church; yet it doth not follow, that they have it not who are out of the Church of
Rome, except she could be proved to be the true Church.
The contrary whereof I have already proved; for the people called Quakers (though they are out of the Church of
Rome) are led by that Spirit which teacheth them to live soberly, righteously, and godly in this present World, as thousands of their Neighbours can bear witness; therefore the people called Quakers are godly Spiritual.
Again, That Prophet which is of God is godly spiritual,
Jer. 28.9. and that Prophet which speaketh a thing, and the thing come to pass, that Prophet is of God; But the people called Quakers have prophesied several things, as to the late overturn'd Powers of this Nation
Witness the Book Intituled, Good Counsel and Advice Rejected. (with divers other things) which accordingly came to pass, (as to their sorrow they were made to know) therefore they are of God, and godly spiritual.
Fourthly,
A. S. again said, If you say,
Know ye not your selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be Reprobates, 2.
Cor. 13.5.
[Page 96]I answer,
The true sence and meaning of this place is this, &c So here A. S. is again undertaking that which himself saith is the Churches work; for saith he in his eighth Chapter, the Church is the alone Interpreter of all Scriptures; and yet he himself, who is but a particular man, is here undertaking to give an interpretation or meaning, to the forementioned Scripture, by which it is plain, that he condemns himself in the things he is doing?
5. Again Fifthly, he saith,
That the Spirit of God saith, Hear the Church, but the spirit of the Devil contradicts, and saith, Hear not the Church, but Christ alone; for of Christ, saith he,
its written, This is my beloved Son, him hear ye: behold the Devil pleads for Christ, of purpose to deceive Christions, &c.
Answ. To which I answer, That I think I need not say much to convince all that reads but
A. S. his own words, that he is either grosly ignorant, or else abominably wilful and wicked; for who can believe that the Devil will plead for Christ, or perswade people to hear Christ, and disswade them from hearing of the Church? certainly, if he would perswade people to hear the greater, he would not disswade them from hearing the lesser: And how can people possibly be deceived, that hears Christ and obeys him? I cannot believe that its the spirit of the Devil that perswades people to hear Christ, but rather, that its the drawings of the Spirit of the Father, that invites them to come unto the Son, and to hear him, for Christ said,
None cometh unto me, except my Father, who hath sent me draw him, Joh. 6.44.
But
A. S. contrariwise (in effect) saith,
That the Devil draws people to come unto Christ, and to hear him; By which he hath manifestly shewed, that he is of a contrary spirit unto Christ; Therefore
A. S. is an Antichrist, and one that
[Page 97] puts Light for darkness, and darkness for light; against whom the woe is pronounced,
Isa. 5.20. And although
A. S. so much pleads for the Church (whom I know all will hear, that hears Christ) yet upon serious consideration, I find its of purpose to deceive Christians, and so he hath shewed himself as bad as the Devil he speaks of, being found doing the same work, of which he seems to accuse the Devil; for in his sixth Chapter I find him (as afore declared) in effect perswading people,
Not to adhere to the motions of the Spirit of Christ, under pretence that they cannot tell whence (from God or the Devil) it comes, or whither to (Heaven or Hell) it goeth, &c. And as above, he is again perswading people,
That its a dangerous thing to hear that Spirit that invites them to hear Christ; calling it the Devil, because it doth not invite them to hear the Church of
Rome also. But I never read or heard before, that any spirit did invite people to hear Christ, but the Spirit of the Father; and his Spirit said,
This is my beloved Son, him hear ye, Mat. 17.5. Therefore that Spirit that invites people to hear the Son of God, is not the Devil, but the Spirit of the Father, and ought to be heard and obeyed by all.
Sixtly, Again,
S. A. affirmeth, that the Spirit of God saith,
That Carpenters, Smiths, Masons, and other Tradesmen, must not meddle with Ecclesiastical things, as to Preach, or Teach, &c.
But, saith he,
the evil spirit affirmeth the quite contrary, by perswading them they may all prophesie one by one. But alas then, saith, A. S.
He deceiveth, for that place is understood of the real and True Prophets, of whose number all the Devils in Hell cannot prove all Tradesmen to be.
Answ. Here
A. S. seems to oppose that, which for my part I know none affirms; for who is there that saith all
[Page 98] Tradesmen have the Spirit of Prophesie? I know none. Yet although all Tradesmen have it not, it doth not therefore follow that no Tradesmen have it; neither did I ever read, that the Spirit of God did forbid Tradesmen to meddle with those things, nor doth that Scripture which
A. S. quotes confirm any such thing which he affirmes, but rather the contrary: And we do read in the Scriptures of Truth, that Christ did call some of several Tradesmen to Teach the Way of God, and to Preach the everlasting Gospel; witness St
Peter a Fisher-man, St
Paul a Tent-maker, with divers others that might be mentioned; so that though all Tradesmen have not the Spirit of Prophesie, yet we see that some had, and they were not forbidden, but commanded to Preach and Teach; and therefore they who have the Testimony of Jesus, which is the Spirit of Prophesie (although they be Tradesmen) they may Preach and Teach according to the Gift thereof received; for the Apostle said,
Every one as he hath received the Gift of the Spirit, so let him administer, 1 Pet. 4.10.
Seventhly, And saith
A. S. the Apostle said,
Women must not speak in the Church; but the Devil saith they may. For the Scripture averreth, saith he,
That your Sons and Daughters shall Prophesie; this Devil deceiveth the Women-Quakers.
But alas, that Scripture was fulfilled in the Apostles, and in the true Prophetesses in their times, as Anna, Luke 2.28.
and now is in such as have the True Spirit of Prophesie, which Quakers
Wives and Daughters can never prove themselves to have.
Answ. Here
A. S. hath confessed that there was Prophetesses in the Apostles dayes, and that there now is at this day also; and the Apostle spake of Women that were helpers with him in the Gospel,
Phil. 4.3. So then
[Page 99] its undeniable that Women did speak and Prophesie, and now may; though the Apostles did not Permit Busie-bodies and Tattlers, to be asking Questions in the Church, but said they should ask their Husbands at Home.
So the thing disputable is, whether or no
Quakers Wives and Daughters have the true Spirit of Prophesie? concerning which I say this, The Testimony of Jesus is the Spirit of Prophesie, and many Wives and Daughters of the people called
Quakers, have received the Testimony of Jesus, and knows the Life of Jesus manifested in them, as by their fruits of Love, Meekness, Gentleness, Patience, Long-suffering, &c. (which are fruits of the Spirit) doth appear unto those who have a knowledg of them; Therefore they have the Spirit of Prophesie.
And further, several of the Wives and Daughters amongst the people called
Quakers, have Prophesied of the desolation of the great Whore (the Church of
Rome) and when that comes to pass, it will be thereby proved, that they have the true Spirit of Prophesie; and then shall every Tongue confess to it, and in the mean time let none speak evil of the things they know not, lest they be found fighters against God.
Eightly, Again,
A. S. saith,
That the good Spirit saith, It is a Religious Act to Swear by God in a Just Cause; but the Evil-spirit contradicts; for its written, saith he, [Sware not at all.]
Behold the Puritanism of this impure spirit; but alas, he deludeth; for God expresly commands, Jer. 4.2.
Thou shalt Swear the Lord liveth in Truth, in Judgment, and in justice, &c.
Answ. I answer, although in the Law and Prophets, people were commanded to Swear in Truth and Righteousness, and to perform their Oaths to the Lord; yet
[Page 100] Christ (the new Covnant, whom God promised should not be according to the old) saith Sware not at all,
Jer. 31.31, 32. and though
Moses and the Prophets were to be heard, under the ministration of the first Covenant, yet they said when Christ the second Covenant was come, people must hear him; for said
Moses, a Prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you like unto me, him shall ye hear, Deut. 18.15. And the Prophet said, that Nation and people that will not serve thee, that Nation shall perish,
Isa. 60.12. So that although
Moses said thou shalt perform thy Oath to the Lord, yet Christ that Prophet who is the end of that Law, (and whom
Moses said the people must hear, or else be cut off) he said
Sware not at all; and although the Prophet said,
thou shalt Sware the Lord liveth, &c. yet Christ who is the end of the Prophets (& whom the Prophets said people must serve, or else perish, saith,
Sware not at all; and although it may be alledged that the Angels swore, yet Christ the first born amongst many Brethren (to whom all the Angels must bow) saith,
Sware not at all, and although it may be further alledged, that God himself swore, and therefore its lawful for Christians to Sware, yet God himself said, concerning Christ,
This is my beloved Son, hear ye him, Mat. 17.5. And this beloved Son of God, (whom all Christians ought to hear) saith,
Sware not at all. All which being rightly weighed, and considered, it plainly appears, that Swearing by any Oath whatsoever, was forbidden by Christ Jesus, who is the Law-giver unto all Christians, and therefore it is not lawful for Christians to Sware at all: And that spirit that tollerates Swearing or would set it up, as a Religious Act, is an Antichrist spirit, because it is against the command of Christ.
And although the Apostle might, or did call the Lord to witness concerning the Truth which he spake, yet that
[Page 101] doth not prove that the Apostle swore, as
A. S. affirmeth that he did, neither do we read that ever any of the Apostles did either propagate, or tollerate Swearing, since Christ forbid it; But contrariwise the Apostle
James saith,
Above all things my Brethren, Swear not; neither by Heaven, nor by the Earth, neither by any other Oath; but let your yea be yea, and your nay, nay, lest you fall into condemnation: So that although
A. S. would wrest the words of Christ to perswade people that his intent was they should not Swear but in Truth and in Righteousness, yet the words of Christ and the Apostle (whom all true Christians are to hear) doth clearly import that their intent was, that people should not Swear at all by any Oath whatsoever: But this Antichristian spirit which opposes the Doctrines and Commands of Christ and his Apostles, we have had large experience of, and we have ofttimes seen that it leads people to swear, and also to forswear themselves, both which are an
Abomination to the Lord, and in the Transgression against God and the new Covenant.
Ninthly, and
A. S. saith, the Apostle, said
salute one another, but the Devil saith, salute not one another, for Christ saith, he sending his Disciples, bid them salute no man by the way, Luke 10.4.
this Devil follows all Quakers,
but alas, Christ's meaning there was, that none should hinder them by the way, &c.
Answ. To which I answer here again
A. S. goes about to make us believe, that the Commands of Christ are the Impositions of the Devil, or at lest that the Devil stirs up people to keep the Commands of Christ; the first of which is Blasphemy in the highest degree, and the second is little less: for if the Devil would teach people to keep the Commands of Christ, then might they serve Christ and
Belial: but as Christ said, that cannot be. And indeed we do experimentally see & find, that the Devil always opposeth the keeping of Christs Commands: As now in
A.S. Who
[Page 201] would diswade them from it, under pretence that its the Devil that leads them to it: And as to his saying, this Devil follows all Quakers.
I answer, Its true; but alas its intentionally to destroy them; for it was said to the Serpent in the beginning, that the Seed of the Woman should bruise his Head, and he should bruise its Heel,
Gen. 3.15. And even so its now come to pass, for the Lord Jesus Christ the promised Seed,
Gal 3.16. being become the Leader of his people, and the Angel of Gods present going before them, the Devil, as
A. S. saith, comes after them, and follows them with his fiery darts of persecution, and Serpent-like is snarling at the Heel: But blessed be the Lord, he that goes before them, and is in them, is greater and mightier then the Devil that follows them, and he hath been their Preserver hitherto, and I doubt not, but he will unto the end perserve all who trust in him.
And as concerning Christs words, there needs no meaning to be given to them, for he meant as he spoke, but if they did according to
A. S's own conclusion, he is not the Interpreter, but the Church; Therefore
(A.S. being not the Church, but a particular man) according to his own Argument, his interpretation is not to be heeded. Again he saith,
Every man is not the Interpreter, for saith he,
Every man is a Lyar: And indeed he hath conformed unto us, that himself is a Lyar, because he hath belyed the intent of Christs words aforesaid, by giving his meaning to them.
Then saith
A. S. Yet these deluded Souls think that this their deluding Spirit is of God; and why forsooth, because it reprehends them of sin, &c.
and did not Judas
his spirit rebuke him of sin, and notwithstanding induce him to desperation, and to hang himself.
Answ. Here
A. S. is again putting Light for darkness, or calling the Spirit of Truth a deluding Spirit; for
[Page 103] is not that the Spirit of Truth that reproves the World of sin,
John 16.7, 8. Did not Christ say, that he would send the Comforter, that should reprove the World of sin, and we never read of any other Spirit that did reprove sin, but the Spirit of Truth, which
A. S. (blasphemously) calls a deluding Spirit; neither did I ever read, that a deluding Spirit was the Comforter, which that Spirit that reproves for sin is, as Christ said. And again, is it not clear that
A. S. puts Light for darkness, in calling that a deluding Spirit, which reproves sin; for the Apostle said, that whatsoever things are reproved, are made manifest by the Light, for whatsoever makes manifest is Light,
Eph. 5.13. and the deluding spirit is darkness it self; so that hereby it manifestly appears, that
A. S. cannot discern betwixt Light and darkness, so is a miserable Blind-Guide indeed. And though the Spirit of Truth did rebuke
Judas for his treachery, doth it therefore follow that it was the same that led him to hang himself; no, this is great Ignorance in
A. S. to affirm; for he might as well have said, That the same Spirit that led him to betray his Master, did afterwards rebuke him for it; but then his Ignorance would have somewhat more plainly appeared: But it was indeed the same spirit which led
Judas into that presumptuous act, as to betray his Master, that afterwards led him to desperation, and to hang himself; and that Spirit which let him see his wickedness which he had done, and rebuked him for it, was Light;
For whatsoever makes manifest is Light, Eph. 5.13.
Eleventhly, then lastly he saith,
Thus far have we digressed for the Conversion of Quakers, &c
Answ. To which I say, that if he hath no better way to convert
Quakers, nor no better Arguments to produce in order to their Conversion, then what he hath made use of
[Page 104] in his pretended reconsiler of Religions, he were better be silent and save his Labour, for I cannot believe that a thousand such Books will ever convert (or rather divert) one
Quaker, nay, nor convince them neither, except it be of his own gross Ignorance or wilful wickedness, of which there is enough appears, as before manifested.
Thus having briefly answered the most remarkable Arguments produced by
A. S. to prove the Church of
Rome, the true Church, and also the several particulars, by which he endeavoured to render the people called
Quakers, as a people led by a deluding Spirit: I find the rest of his Book consists of divers Arguments, in which he controverts with Sectaries, and their Bibles, and Ministers,
&c. whose cause (as aforesaid) I am not ingaged in, therefore it doth not concern me to answer his Charges against them, but shall leave them to answer for themselves.
Although there are indeed many things contained in the remaining part of his Book, from which I might lay open much of the deceit and Ignorance of
A. S. and the Abominations of the Church of
Rome; But the generality of people being alreadly so fully satisfied concerning her: and the confusion and ignorance of
A. S. also being herein so fully manifested already; I look upon it as superfluous at present to inlarge on this account; and indeed if never a word had been said, the very fruits brought forth by the Church of
Rome in the view of all Nations, are enough to foreware them of adhering to her, for can a man touch Pitch and not be defiled.
A hint towards the discovery of the true Church.But for all that hath been said, It may be some will say, that grand Question propounded by
A. S. in the second Chapter of his Book, Remains yet unanswered;
(viz) Which is the true Church, &c.
[Page 105]First, to which I answer; that is the true Church, (and no other (whose fruits make manifest that they are govern'd by the invisible head Christ, and that continue in the Doctrine of Christ and his Apostles, and that are found in the same order, or discipline in their Assemblies, that the true Church was in the primitive times; and that have the same way of ordaining Ministers, that the true Church had; and that lives soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present World, as the true Church did; But the people called
Quaekers are such as hereafter I shall prove; Therefore the people called
Quakers are the true Church.
Secondly, It is manifest by the fruits of the people call'd
Quakers, that they are governed by the invisible Head Christ; for Christ commands his Followers, not to swear at all, which command the aforesaid people observe and keep, as this Nation of
England full well knows.
Again, Christ came not to destroy mens lives, but to save them; and commanded his Followers to love their Enemies; And it is manifest that the people called
Quakers have the mind of Christ because they seek not the destruction of any, but the preservation and good of all, and that they love even their Enemies, who hate, and persecute them; because they are ready to assist, or be helpfull to them upon all occasions, or opportunities, in any thing that may tend to their present and future well-being; therefore, they are governed by the invisible Head Christ: Again, Christ commanded saying,
whatsoever ye would that men should do unto you, even so do ye unto them, Mat. 7.12. which command the aforesaid people observe and keep, as thousands can bear witness for them; Therefore they are governed by the invisible Head Christ, and are the True Church.
Thirdly, Again the people called
Quakers continue in the Doctrine of Christ and his Apostles; for Christ preacht
[Page 106] the Doctrine of Perfection, saying,
Be ye perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect, Math. 5.48. And the Apostle preacht the same Doctrine:
Heb. 6.1. and Laboured to persent every man perfect in Christ,
Col. 1.28. having received gifts for that very work,
Ephes. 4.11.12. And the people called
Quakers do preach the same Doctrine of Perfection, and Labour in the Power and Spirit of the Lord, to present people perfect in Christ, as the Apostles did, as thousands can bear Testimony; by which it sufficiently appears, that they continue in the Doctrine of Christ, and his Apostles; and therefore they are the true Church.
But this Christian Doctrine is opposed by all the Antichristian Ministers thoughout the whole
Christendom, or by all
Babylons Merchants in every part of her Teritories, who ignorantly produce many
good words to oppose this
Doctrine.
1. As First, they urge
Solomons words
(viz) There is not a just man upon the Earth that doth good, and sinneth not; Therefore say they, people cannot be perfect; But alas, they do not discern the signs of the times, neither do they consider the time and season when these words were spoken; for at that time all were gone out of the Way, and there was none that did good,
Psa. 14.3. and they had forsaken the Lord, and knew not so much of him, as the Oxe did of his Owner,
Isa. 1.3. and were in the transgression of Gods Covenant which he made with their Fathers,
Jer. 31.32. so that although there were none without sin at that time; yet it doth not follow the people can never be free from sin, no more then their being then ignorant of God, doth argue, that people should never come to the knowledg of him; the contrary of both which may be easily proved by plain Scripture; for at that time when
Israel were strangers unto God, and were all gone out of the way, and none amongst them did good, &c. even then did God promise that the day should come in
[Page 107] which he would make a new Covenant with the house of
Judah, and with the house of
Israel, (who were in the transgression, of the first Covenant
Jer. 31.31.) and that he would finish transgression, and make an end of sin,
Dan. 24. who had hid his face from them (and by which they were made Strangers to him,
Isa. 59.2.) and that he would remember their Iniquities no more, and that they
should all know him from the least, to the greatest, Jer. 31.34. by which it is evident, that (although in the Prophets days, they were all in transgression, and had not the Knowledge of God) the purpose of God was to bring them into a better state, which the true
Church in the Apostles dayes were Witnesses of, (for the Apostles said,
Heb. 11.46. God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us could not be made perfect,) and although some of them had been Idolators, and had lived in the pollutions of the World, yet they were washed and clensed, yea, and justified in the Name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God, 1
Cor. 6.10, 11. and so though they were sometimes ignorant of God, yet God caused the Light to shine out of darkness in their hearts, to give them the Light of the Knowledge of Gods Glory in the face of Christ, who dwelt in them, 2
Cor. 4.6.
Gal. 2.20. so that both sin and ignorance, was done away in them though the power and coming of the Lord Jesus, and so they did not always remain in their sin, but were freed from them, as the Apostle testified,
Rom. 18. & 1.2.
Secondly, But then Antichrist's Mimisters saith, That if they were free from sin, why did the Apostle say; That if we say we have no sin, we deceive our selves and the Truth is not in us, 1
John. 1.8.
I Answer he did not say so because people could not be made free from sin, but he said so that they might not sin, 1
John. 2.1. and consider who they were that he then
[Page 108] wrote to; for he sometimes wrote to Children, and somtimes to Young-men, and sometimes to Fathers in the truth, 1
Joh. 2.13. But when be spake those words
(viz▪) If we say we have no sin, &c. he then spake to Children; for said he,
my little Children, these things I write unto you, that you sin not, 1
John 2.1. Now if they had been already perfect, or fully fully freed from sin, then had they attained to the mans state, which the Apostle laboured to bring them to,
Col. 1.28. But they having not attained to that state, he would not have them to deceive themselves, (nor to think more highly of themselves then they ought to think,
Rom. 12.3.) which Children in understanding are subject to do, but with these little Children the Apostle
Travelled in birth, that Christ might be formed in them, Gal. 4.19. (who is
the one offering that perfects for ever, all them that are sanctified, Heb. 10.14.) and he laboured to build them up in the holy Faith which gives Victory through Christ, that so they might be borne up to a mans state, for said He, he that is born of God doth not sin, John 3.9.
Thirdly, But then, it may be some will object, that the Apostle spake not only of Children, but of himself also, saying, If we say, &c.
To which I Answer, that although the Apostle numbred himself with them, yet that doth not argue, that he was in their state, or that he was not set free from sin, no more then
James his numbring himself amongst the scattered Jews, (saying,
with the same mouth curse we men &c. Jam. 1.9) doth argue that he was one of them that did curse men, for its evident that the Apostle became as weak, to them that were weak, and to the strong, as strong, and to them that were under the Law, as under the Law, and to them that were without the Law, as without the Law, though not without Law to God, and
became all things unto all, that he
[Page 109] thereby might gain some; 1
Cor. 9.20, 21, 22. so although he did condescend to them that were weak, as Children or Babes in Christ, as to number himself amongst them, for the gaining of them to a farther state, yet that doth not at all argue, that he was, as they were, for the Apostle
Paul himself said,
that he was set free from the Law of sin and death, Rom. 8.2. all which being rightly weighed, it manifestly appears, that perfection or freedom from sin, is attainable according to the Doctrine of Christ and his Apostles, which by the people called
Quakers is preached and continued in, as before asserted, therefore they are the true Church.
4. Again, The Order and Discipline of the true Church in the Apostles time, was, That the Prophets might speak two or three, and the rest might judge; and if any thing was revealed to another that sate by, he might speak, and the first was to hold his peace, 1
Cor. 14.29, 30. and the same order the people called
Quakers have in their Assemblies, as is known to thousands, by which it appears that they are the true Church.
5. Again, The Ministers of Christ in the true Church in the primitive times (who turned people from darkness to light, and from Satans power, to the Power of God,
Gal. 1.1.) were Ordained and made Ministers, not of man, nor by man, nor of the letter, but of the Spirit, by the revelation of Jesus Christ, 2
Cor. 3.6. and so are the Ministers amongst the people called
Quakers, made Ministers of the Spirit, by the revelation of Jesus Christ, as the effects of their ministry doth testifie; for many are turned from darkness to light, and from iniquity to righteousness, and the spirits in Prison is by them ministred unto, and the dead are raised unto life, and the Captives are set at Liberty, as thousands can and must bear witness; Therefore the people called
Quakers are the true Church.
[Page 110]Sixthly, The true Church in the primitive times, was taught by the Grace of God,
that denying ungodliness, and worldly lusts, they should live soberly and righteously, and goodly in this present World, Tit. 2.11, 12. and the people called
Quakers, being taught by the same spirit of Grace, do deny ungodliness, and wordly lusts (as many in this Nation well knows) and doth live soberly, righteously, and godly in this present world, as thousands can testifie; Therefore the people called
Quakers are the true Church.
Thus I might produce many more Arguments to prove the aforesaid people to be the Church of true Christians, but much of this kind hath been by several of them already written; wherefore, I shall not inlarge at present; but for any that shall desire any farther satisfaction, let them come to the Assemblies of the aforesaid people, and hear their Doctrines, and behold their Discipline, &c. and, as the Apostle said,
Try all things, and hold fast that which is good, 1 Thess. 5.21.
A VINDICATION Of the Light Within, Against the Darkness, Error, and Blasphemy of
JOHN NEWMAN, in his Book, Entitul'd,
The Light Within, &c. Concerning •
The Scriptures , •
The Word of God. , •
The Only Rule. , •
The Light Within. , •
The True Saviour. , •
The Body of Jesus. ,
and •
The Spirit's Guidance.
THE main Controversie with
John Newman, being at this time,
Whether or no the Scriptures of the Old and New Testament (so called)
be not properly and principally called the Word of God, and that distinct from Christ, whose Name is called the Word? And whether the
[Page 270] Scriptures be not a perfect Rule for all men to walk by, and none other? Who, for the proving of the Affirmative, hath instanced several places of Scripture.
My Work at this time will be to shew, That those Scriptures, produced by him, do not any wise serve to prove his Affirmations, but rather the contrary; though he hath much wrong'd them, by wresting of them, as is usual with those, who labour to pervert the Right Way of the Lord, as
John Newman hath endeavour'd to do; which I doubt not, but I shall sufficiently shew hereafter.
The first Scripture that he produceth, as a Foundation, from whence to argue the Scriptures to be the Word of God, is
Luke 11.28. where Christ said,
Yea, rather Blessed are they, that hear the Word of God, and keep it.
‘Now (saith he in page three) whether it be Jesus Christ, which in Scripture is stil'd the Word of God; a Name which is given unto him, or whether the words, which God hath spoken by his holy Prophets, and Blessed Son, and Apostles, in the two Testaments of his Will, &c. be not the Word of God?’
Answer, Christ did not intend the Scriptures of the Old and New Testament at that time, when he so spoke; but he meant himself, who was the Word that was with God in the beginning,
John 1.1. whom they were to hear and obey, as the Father had given Commandment by the Mouthes of his Prophets, and also by Immediate Voice from Heaven; as by
Moses, who said,
A Prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you,
[Page 271] him shall ye hear, &c. And when this Prophet was rais'd, and was with his three Disciples in the Mount, the Immediate Voice from the Excellent Glory, said,
This is my Beloved SON, hear ye him, Mat. 17.5. This then is that Word, which they were blessed that heard, according to that Saying of Christ to his Disciples,
Blessed are your Ears, for they hear, &c. For, many that had Ears could not hear the Word, though they had the Scriptures (that were then in being) which testify'd of the Word: So its plain that Christ spoke of himself, when he said,
Blessed are they that hear the Word of God, &c.
And that he spoke not of the Scriptures of the Old and New Testament, there is not any thing can be more plain; because the Scriptures that are call'd the new Testament were not then written, nay, not any part thereof: So that its great Ignorance in
John Newman, to think that Christ spoke of the Scriptures, especially of the new Testament, and not of himself.
But then in page 4. he saith,
‘I shall undertake to prove, that the Scriptures of the two Testaments, &c. are properly and principally call'd the Word of God, &c.’ And his first Proof is,
Psal. 18.28, 30. where the Prophet said,
‘Thou wilt light my Candle; the Lord will enlighten my Darkness: And as for God, his Way is perfect; the Word of the Lord is try'd.’ And from hence argueth,
That the Scripture is the Word of God, which David
spake of; Because, saith he,
its the same that's call'd the Way of God: So takes it for granted, That the Scripture is the Way of God; and concludes, That it must needs follow, that the Scripture is the Word there spoken of, saying,
[Page 272]
‘It doth appear, that the Scriptures, or perfect Way of God, in which the Prophet walked, and by which he should be enlighten'd, is here called, the Word of the Lord.’
Answ. I cannot but Marvel, that men should be so wilfully blind, to go about to wrest the Scriptures after this manner; when never a word of
David, here inserted, so much as speaks of the Scriptures, much less of the Old and New Testament. But he here speaks, of what God, his Way, and Word was; and of what God, whom he said, was his Lamp, would do for him: Likewise, in the 29th verse (which
J. N. willingly omits) he declares, what God had done for him, or, what himself had done by the Lord (not by Scripture)
By thee, I have run through a Troop; and by my God, I have leapt over a Wall: And vers. 3
[...].
It is God that girdeth me with Strength, and maketh my Way perfect: [Mark] He did not say, That he made the Scripture a perfect Way for him; for the Scripture was not his Way, by which he run through the Troop: Nor did he say, That by the Scripture he would light his Candle, and enlighten his Darkness; but by Him, who is Light, by whom he run through a Troop. So that it appears, it was the Power and Strength of God, in which
David walked, and by which the Lord did those things for him, and not by Scripture: So that this serves nothing at all to prove the Scriptures the Word and Way of God; neither do I understand, that the Scriptures any where say, That they are the Way; but contrariwise, testifie, That Christ is the Way (whose Name is called, the Word of God) which was with God in the beginning, and in the Bosom of the Father from Everlasting
[Page 273]
John 1.18. nevertheless, the Law written in Tables of Stone, was, in the dispensation of time, the Rule, though not the Supream Rule, which they were to observe and do, until Christ the Seed came, who is the Way Everlasting.
The next Scripture, offer'd by
J. N. to prove the Scriptures the Word, is out of
Psalm 119.100, 105. where the Prophet saith,
Thy Word is a Lamp unto my Feet, and a Light unto my Path.
‘Now
(saith J. N.) what this Word is, he sheweth at large, in vers. 97, 98, & 101. where the Prophet plainly sheweth, That it was the holy Law of God, which was his Meditation day and night: And further, he saith,
Thou, through thy Commandments, hast made me wiser then my Enemies: And in vers. 101. to shew what this Way of God was, he saith,
I have refrain'd my Feet from every false way, that I might keep thy Word: And in vers. 106. he saith,
I have sworn, that I will perform it, that I may keep thy Judgments: From whence we may plainly see, That God's Word,
which was a Lanthorn unto his Feet, and
a Light unto his Path, which Word
he had sworn to keep; that it was the Commandments or Word of God, in which was contain'd the Will of God, in order to
David's Salvation. And it is plain, the Word here is not meant of Christ, because the Prophet calleth it,
The Word of God; and saith,
He had sworn to keep it. And it cannot in reason be understood, That
David, or any other man, did ever keep Christ; for all his Saints are kept by him; for we are kept by the Power of Christ, through Faith unto Salvation, &c.’
[Page 274]
Answ. How can a rational Person judge, but that
J. N. is willing to put out his own Eyes, lest he should see; and likewise to blind the Eyes of as many more as he can; who thus tears the Scriptures to pieces, that the import of them may not be understood; and then patch up a few bits together again, mixed with his own Imaginations and Meanings, to make them shew like what himself would have? Wherefore did he not instance the 99th verse also, as well as the 98th & 100th, where
David said,
I have more Understanding, then my Teachers? Was it not lest People should perceive, that surely
David had some farther Acquaintance and Community with God, then his Teachers had; and that God was his immediate Teacher, by his Word, which he sent, and healed them that were in distress,
Psal. 107.20. which
was a Light unto David
's Feet, and a Lanthorn to his Path? A thing, which his Teachers were not so acquainted with, though they well knew the Law outwardly (which
David also stricktly observed) as otherwise it cannot be rationally understood, that
David's Teachers did not well understand the Law, yet he had more understanding, then they; for, he was a Prophet of God, and knew the Word of the Lord, though it was (as he said)
forever settled in Heaven, vers.
[...]9. and said he,
In God I will praise thy Word, Psal. 56.
[...].
And thy Word hath quickened me, Psal. 119.50.
And I have hoped in thy Word, vers. 74. And when this Word was with-drawn out of his sight, he said,
Mine Eyes f
[...]il for thy Word, vers. 82.
Now, who can be so ignorant and blind, as to think, that he spoke of the Scriptures, when he said,
Thy Word is settled in Heaven: For, were the Scriptures settled in
[Page 275] Heaven?
And in God I will praise thy Word: Was it the Scripture that he would praise?
And I have hoped in thy Word: Was his Hope in the Scriptures, or in Christ, as in him that was to come?
And mine Eyes fail for thy Word: Was it the Scriptures that his Eyes fail'd for? Surely no; the Scripture (so much of it, as was then written, which were chiefly the Books of
Moses) was obvious enough to him, when the Word might be withdrawn out of his sight, for a Tryal unto him; as
David said concerning
Joseph, Psal. 105.18, 19.
Whose Feet they hurt with Fetters: Until the time that his Word came; the Word of the Lord try'd him.
And who dares deny (without Presumption) but that it was the same Word, which
David said,
Was a Light unto his Path, and a Lamp unto his Feet? So that all
J. N s. tearing assunder the Scriptures, with his additional Imaginations, will not prove, that it was the Scriptures
David spoke of, in this place; but was indeed the Word, by which
David (as a Prophet, to whom the Word of the Lord came) spoke forth that part of the Scriptures.
And although
David did meditate on the Law of God (which if I should grant it to be only the outward Law, that came by
Moses) yet that doth not prove, that he call'd it the Word; nor can it be understood, that he meant the Scripture, when he so spoke of the Word, for the Reasons afore given.
The Word was precious, or scarce, in those dayes, which came to the Prophets, saying,
So, and
so; and those Sayings are signified or contain'd in the Scriptures: But the Scriptures were not more scarce then, then at times before; though the Word was, of which there was a Famine.
[Page 276]And though the Scriptures may be heard now, which contain the Saying of the Word, which the Word demonstrated; yet all that hear them, cannot be said to hear the sound of the Word, as they did, who heard those sayings demonstrated, or sounded out of the Mouthes of the Prophets, by the Word that so spoke.
And although
J. N. saith,
‘Its plain, the Word here is not mean of Christ, because the Prophet calls it, the Word of God; and saith,
He had sworn to keep it: and it cannot in reason be understood, that
David, or any man, did ever keep Christ.’
Answ. I answer, Here
J. N. hath wrong'd the Prophet's word; for he did not say,
That he had sworn to keep the Word; but,
He had sworn to keep his Righteous Judgments; as if he should have said,
He would observe the Judgments of the Lord, to walk in the Paths thereof; or,
That he would walk according to the Spirit of Judgment: Yet, notwithstanding this, It is but the unreasonableness of
J.N. to conclude,
That David,
nor any man, did never keep Christ; for, they that keep in subjection to the Spirit of Christ, and dwell under his Government, may be properly said to keep the Word, which is Christ.
And there were in the Church of
Philadelphia, those that kept the Word, and such deny'd not his Name,
Rev. 3.8. [Mark that]
He that kept the Word, deny'd not his Name, which is call'd the Word: and in vers. 10. he said,
Because thou hast kept the Word of my Patience, I will keep thee, &c.
Now, can it reasonably be understood, That it was the Scriptures, that were here call'd the Word of Patience, which they kept; or that Scriptures were that
[Page 277] Name which they deny'd not, who kept the Word. Certainly I cannot rationally judge, that any should be so blind; but if they should, the very next verse will sufficiently clear the matter, where it is said,
Hold fast that thou hast, that none take away thy Crown. [Mark] He having kept the Word of Patience, was exhorted, to hold that fast which he had, that he might not lose his Crown.
And can any rationally conclude, That the Scripture was his Crown? Or else, Was it not the Word of Life (and of Patience) which was in the beginning, before the Scriptures were written; and would be his
Crown when Scriptures should be no more: For,
Paul exhorts
Timothy, To lay hold on Eternal Life, 1
Tim. 6.12. And must he not then lay hold on Christ, who is the Word, and the Life? 1
John 1.1. and
John 14.6. And they that had receiv'd him, who was the Word and the Life, and was to be their Crown, as before is shew'd, and were to keep, or hold fast that which they had receiv'd, May it not be properly said, That they kept Christ? Certainly none can be so ignorant, who understand the
Scripture, to conclude, that no Man did ever keep Christ; although all his are kept from the hour of Temptation, by him (who is the Power of God) through Faith unto Salvation? By all which it plainly appears, That the words of the Prophet, produc'd by
J. N. do not prove, nor intend to prove the
Scriptures to be the Word of God, that the Prophets and Holy Men of God kept: although I shall easily confess, that they do contain many sayings and words, that proceeded from the Mouth of the Lord; all which were, and are, according to the several Dispensations of time, to which they relate, to be observ'd also.
[Page 278]The next Scripture, produc'd by
J. Newman, to prove
Scripture the Word of God, is,
Isa. 28.9, 10, 13. where the Prophet said,
Whom shall I teach Knowledge? and whom shall I make to understand Doctrine, &c? Precept must be upon Precept, Line upon Line, &c. the Word of the Lord was to his People, Precept upon Precept, and Line upon Line, &c.
‘So that (
saith J. N.) its clear, the Word of God is that Doctrine, Teaching, and Precepts, that was given at large to God's People, &c. so its plain, &c. the
Scripture is properly and principally called the Word of God.’
Answ. To which I answer, This doth not at all prove the
Scriptures to be the Word, which the Prophet said, was
Line upon Line, and Precept upon Precept unto them; for, though he said,
Whom shall I make to understand Doctrine? and in order to it said,
The Word of the Lord must be Precept upon Precept: Yet that doth not prove, that the
Doctrine was the Word; but the Doctrine was of the Word; and by the Word, that came unto the Prophet, was the
Doctrine demonstrated; and they thereby made to understand it. And so the Word oft times came unto the Prophets (not the Scriptures) and bid them go, and speak, so, and so; and the
Doctrine, which they preached, could not be properly call'd the Word it self, that came to them; though the sound of the Word was heard in the delivery of that Doctrine: But their Doctrine proceeded from the Word, which bid them so speak; so that there was the Word, the Teacher, and the Doctrine thereof, the Teachings.
And this Word, so oft coming unto the Prophet, to bid him go and speak unto the People; it might well be
[Page 279] said,
That the Word of the Lord
was Line upon Line unto them: so that it plainly appears, that this Word (here spoken of) was not intended to be the Scripture; neither doth this at all prove the Scriptures to be properly and principally call'd the Word of God, as
J. Newman would have it.
Again, in pag. 7.
J. N. saith,
‘Another Proof to confirm this Truth, is,
Mark 7.13. where the Lord Christ doth affirm the Commands of God, in the first Testament, or Scriptures of the Prophets, to be the Word of God; because he said unto the
Pharisees, in the 9th verse,
Full well ye reject the Commandement of God, that you may keep your own Traditions: and in the thirteenth verse, he said, Making the Word of God of none effect, &c.’
Answ. This doth not at all prove, that Christ call'd the Scripture of the Prophets the Word of God; for it relates only to that particular Command of God, viz.
Honour thy Father and thy Mother: and
Matthew saith plainly, in chap. 15.6. speaking of the same thing,
Thus have ye made the Commandment of God of none effect, by your Traditions: Now the Question will be, whether
Matthew or
Mark gave the right relation of the words of
Christ; for, both theirs are but a Relation (in this matter) of what
Christ said to the
Jews? Or, whether the Translators did not wrong the
Evangelists, in making one appear to speak one thing, and the other another thing; seeing its plain, they both spoke of one thing which they had seen and heard of
Christ? And this one thing was the Commandment, as aforesaid, as
Matthew plainly calls it: and
Mark, in the 9th
[Page 280] verse, calls it, the
Commandment also; from which we may rationally conclude, that the Fault was in the Translator, to make the one differ from the other, in that Expression; but if he did indeed call that Commandment the Word, yet that doth not prove the Scriptures to be properly call'd the
Word of God; for that saying of Christ relates only to that one Command, which, with the rest of the Commandments, are call'd the words which God speak; as
Exod. 20.1.
God spake all these words, saying, &c.
And that the Scriptures do contain a Relation of the words, that at sundry times God speak, I shall easily acknowledge; but that they are properly and principally call'd the
Word of God, as
J. N. affirmeth, I do deny; neither hath he produc'd any Scripture, that doth prove it, as I hope, by these few Lines, will appear to the Impartial Reader.
And so
J. N. concluding; That he hath prov'd the Scriptures of the first Testament to be the
Word of God, he saith, he shall labour to prove, that the Scriptures of the New Testament are also call'd the Word: and in pag. 8. he saith,
‘The first Scripture for Proof hereof, is,
Acts 4.25, 26, 27. where
John and
Peter Preaching and Teaching Jesus Christ, out of the
Psalms, to the
Rulers, &c. pray d unto the Lord,
That they might Preach this Word with Boldness (And saith) 'Its plain from the scope of this place, that the Preaching and Teaching of Jesus Christ, according to the Scriptures of the New Testament, is properly and principally call'd the Word of God.’
Answ. How hath
J. N. besotted himself, with labouring
[Page 281] to pervert the Truth? First saith, he hath prov'd the Scriptures of the Old Testament to be properly call'd the
Word of God; and now saith, Its plain the Scriptures of the New Testament are principally call'd the Word: And sometimes saith, Christ is call'd the Word of God: [Mark]
Christ call d the Word, but
the Scriptures principally call'd the Word; so that he sets the Scriptures (as the Word) above Christ, by saying,
principally, &c.
And besides, How many Words of God he will make, or seem to make something he would have without, to be call'd the Word, to keep People from enclining to the Word in the heart, lest they should come to know
Christ manifested in them; which before he confesseth the Apostles preached, when they pray'd,
That they might speak the Word with Boldness: [Mark] If they preached
Christ, and prayed, that they might speak
that Word with Boldness; then
Christ was that Word, and not the
Scriptures; although their Preaching of him, and bearing Witness of his Appearance and Coming, was according to the Scriptures of the Prophets: For they shew'd the People out of
Moses and the Prophets,
that Jesus was Christ, Acts 28.23. Yet this doth not prove, that their Preachings and Teachings of him were by the Scriptures of the New Testament; for they were not then written: But they preached by vertue of the Word and Spirit that was in them, which they had handled of, 1
Joh.
[...].1. which through them demonstrated it self, according to the Pleasure of his Will, who wrought mightily in them, both to will and to do; so that it may be observ'd, that the Scriptures, which
J. N. produceth, to prove Scriptures to be the Word, do rather prove Christ to be the Word there spoken of, which
J. N. acknowledgeth
[Page 282] the Apostle preached, when he prayed,
That he might speak that Word with Boldness.
His next is pag. 9. to the same purpose, where he saith,
‘In
Acts 5.42. its said, the Apostle did daily Preach and Teach Jesus Christ; and this Preaching and Teaching of Jesus Christ, is in the 6th chapter, verse 4. called, The Ministry of the Word, &c.’
Answ. To which I Answer, Its true, they that preach Christ, they preach the Word; and they that preach the Word, they preach Christ; for Christ is the Word, as before shew'd, and hereafter shall be more largely demonstrated.
But then saith
J. N.
‘The Word of God inrceased, &c.’ (from whence in pag. 18. he argueth)
‘That none can in Reason imagine, that the Word of God, that so grew and multiply'd, can be understood of Christ’ (though he confesseth)
‘That the increase of the Word was so mighty, notwithstanding the Opposition that the preaching of Christ met with.’
Answ. What can be understood by the Multiplying, Increasing, or Prevailing of the Word of God, but the prevailency of Christ in that Work, which (in and by his Servants, the Apostles, according to the Pleasure of the Father's Will) he had undertaken, notwithstanding all the Opposition that he in them met withal, according to that Saying, in
Isa. 54.17.
Every Tongue that riseth up in Judgment against Thee, Thou shalt condemn: So that through the powerful Operation of the Word Christ,
Which in them
[Page 283] wrought mightily both towards the Circumcision, and Uncircumcision, Gal. 2.8. many were made to submit thereunto, and to confess thereunto; and thereby the Increase of his Government was known, which the Prophet said,
Should be without End, Isa. 9.7. And the number of the Disciples (or Believers on the Word) were multiply'd; so that the Word multiply'd the Disciples thereof; and grew in Dominion over its Opposers; and increas'd its Goverment in and among'st them: And this in Plainness and Simplicity, was the Growth, Multiplying, Increasing, and Prevailing of Christ the Word; and yet there was no more then one Christ prevailing, and increasing in his Government, and multiplying his Disciples; though
J. N. cannot see, but there must of necessity be more then one Christ, if by the increase of the Word be understood of Christ: so that although he concludeth, it must needs be the Doctrine, contain'd in the Scriptures, intended by the increase of the Word, yet here he may see his Ignorance therein
Again, In pag. 9. & 10.
J. N. saith,
‘That in
Acts 19.20. the Preaching and Teaching of Jesus Christ is call'd the Word of God.’
Answ. To this I have already answer'd, that the preaching of Jesus Christ is the Preaching of the Word; for his Name is call'd the Word: Yet is doth not follow, as
J. N. would have it, that all the Disputings, which the Apostle had for the space of three Moneths, was the Word: Its true, he disputed and perswaded the things of the Kingdom (according to the Scriptures of the Prophets) by Vertue of the Word that was in him; so that all they of
Asia heard the Word, or the sound thereof, when the
[Page 284] Doctrine thereof was by it self demonstrated;
For, from you sounded out the Word of the Lord, said the Apostle, 1
Thes. 1.8. But the Apostle did not call his Preachings and Disputings the Word; but that which he preached: For he preached Christ; but his Preachings were not Christ, but a Testimony of him; as Christ said concerning the Scriptures,
They are they that testifie of me, Joh. 5.39. By which it apprears, that Christ was the Word which he preached, and which they in
Asia heard the sound of, according to that Saying of Christ,
The Hour cometh, and now is, when the Dead shall hear the Voice of the Son, &c. And therefore this Argument is but like the rest, which make nothing to prove the Scriptures to be principally call d the Word of God.
‘Again,
(saith J.N.) I should have left prosecuting this Subject, but this Truth yet finding more Friends to plead its Cause, I am not willing to be a Hinderance, &c.’ And then quotes 2
Cor. 4.1, 2. where the Apostle said,
He had not handled the Word of God deceitfully.
‘Now
(saith J.N.) what Word of God was this, which he had not handled deceitfully, but the Ministry he had receiv'd, even the
Preaching and
Teaching of the Gospel of Jesus Christ, as is plain in the 3d, 4th. & 5th verses? For, what he calleth the Ministry in the 1st verse, in the 2d the Word of God, in the following he calleth it the Gospel, and the preaching of Christ according to the Gospel; so that its clear by this Witness also, that the Preaching and Teaching of Jesus Christ, according to the Scriptures of the New Testament, &c. is properly and principally call'd,
The Word of God.’
Answ. Truly
J. N. had need find better Friends, or
[Page 285] some that speak more pertinent to his business, then this which he hath here produced, or else he may labour (as before he said he should) long enough to prove Scripture the Word of God, and have all to do when he hath ended: For, if I should grant that he called his Ministry, or that of, and from which he ministred, the
Word; yet that doth not prove the
Scriptures to be the
Word; because, the Life and Spirit of his Ministry is not contain'd in the Scripture: Or, if I should acknowledge the
Gospel to be the
Word; yet that doth not prove the
Scriptures to be the
Word; For,
The Gospel is the Power of God, as the Apostle said,
Rom. 1.16. and so are not the Scriptures; and the Gospel is Everlasting, but the Scriptures are not so. But
J.N. would make the Scriptures to be the Word, the Gospel, the Ministry, and all; and jumbles all together, and then says,
The Apostle calls it so; when the Apostle saith no such thing; but speaks of his Ministry; and of the Gospel, which is the Power of God; and of the (Word, which endureth forever, which by the Gospel, the Power) was preached unto them, 1
Pet. 1.25.
And as to that Question,
‘What
Word of God was this that he had not handled Deceitfully?’
Answ. I answer, It was the
Word which was from the beginning, as
John said, 1
Joh. 1.1.
Which they had Seen and Handled; which were not the Scriptures; for they were not from the beginning: but the
Word was, which they had handled, and which they handled not deceitfully; but in Simplicity declar'd openly, what they receiv'd by its secret operation, and mighty working in them (according as Christ commanded them) without adding
[Page 286] thereto, or diminishing therefrom; and hence it was that they said,
They Handled it not Deceitfully.
‘Again,
(saith J. N.) The second VVitness, that appeareth to countenance this Truth, is in
Col. 1.25. where the Apostle calleth, the Preaching of the Gospel the Word of God: but for the better understanding of this VVitness, let us see vers. 23. where the Apostle useth these words to the Church,
If you continue in the Faith, grounded and settled, and not remov'd from the Hope of the Gospel, which you have heard, and which was preached to every Creature under Heaven: Whereof, he saith, in vers. 25.
I Paul
am made a Minister: But what to do? He answereth,
To fulfil the Word of God: Now, what Word of God was this that
Paul did fulfil, but only his Ministry, in Preaching and Teaching of Jesus Christ, according to the Gospel, which he here calleth the
Word of God? So that there is no Truth more plain then this, that the Scriptures of the New
Testament are properly and principally call'd the Word of God.’
Answ. Surely
J.N. hath a great Conceit of his blind Affirmations; it appears, as oft times I have seen it,
viz. That Ignorance in some is as great a Cause of Confidence, as sound Knowledge is in others: VVhat Reason hath
J. N. from the Scriptures before mention'd, to affirm the Scriptures of the
New Testament to be properly call'd the
Word of God? Or the Word there spoken of by the Apostle to be meant the Scriptures, which he said were given him to fulfil? For, in the next verse he declareth what that VVord was, viz.
The Mystery which hath been hid from Ages, and from Generations; but now made manifest in his
[Page 287] Saints: To whom (saith the Apostle)
God would make known what is the Riches of the Glory of his Mystery amongst the Gentiles,
which is, Christ in you the Hope of Glory. [Mark Reader] He saith, The VVord which he was to fulfil, was the Mystery, &c. and the Mystery was, Christ in them, &c. So that the VVitness, that
J. N. produceth, testifieth against his Affirmation as absolutely as may be, to the utter overthrow of his Cause, by which the Ignorance and Blindness of
J. N. appears.
But then he saith, in pag. 12.
‘I shall give but one Scripture more for the Proof of this
Truth, and that is,
Tit. 2.5.
Where the Apostle calleth the Doctrine of Christ, the Word of God: For
(saith he) let us see what the Apostle saith in the first verse, where he giveth
Titus a Charge, to preach sound Doctrine; and layeth down the particulars thereof, what he should preach, and the Persons distinctly to whom he should preach: and giveth them Instruction in the 5th verse, That they should walk to the Doctrine or Teaching answerably; and the Reason he gave was this,
Lest the word of God should be Blasphem'd: so that the Doctrine he gave in Charge to
Titus, with all the particulars of the Doctrine, the same in the 5th verse he calls,
The Word of God.’
Answ. That Conclusion is utterly false; he doth not say (nor in effect say) That the Doctrines, with all particulars of the Doctrines, are the Word: Nor can it rationally be concluded, That it was the Scripture, or the Doctrine, that he spoke of, when he said,
Lest the Word of God should be Blasphem'd: But rather, that worthy Name by which they were call'd (which Name, they who kept the Word deny'd not, as before shew'd) For, if they
[Page 288] should not walk according to the Doctrine of the VVord, which they taught; the Ignorant that were without, or they that watched for Iniquity, might be ready to judge, that there was a difficiency in the VVord, by which they were taught, or in the Name which they professed and walked in; and so be encourag'd to slight and speak evil of the same: and thereby the VVord (by which they were taught) might be blasphemed, through their not walking according to the Doctrine thereof, who made a Profession of it: so that the Apostle, in saying,
Lest the Word of God should be blasphem'd, doth not at all call the Doctrine the VVord; nor doth this in the least serve to prove the Scriptures to be properly call'd the
Word of God; although thereupon J. N. thus concludes,
That there is nothing more evident then this Glorious and saving Truth, That the Scriptures or two Testament, &c. are properly and principally call'd the Word of God. But what the Scriptures offer'd by him, with his Arguments thereupon (which I have before stated and answer'd) do make for his purpose, I shall leave to the truly Juditious and Impartial Reader to judge.
‘The next thing
(saith J.N.) I shall insist upon, are the Reasons, for the Confirmation of this Point, or gracious Truth, that I have asserted, &c. and I shall labour to shew that all those places, that I have brought to prove Scriptures to be the VVord of God, will stand firm, &c.’
Answ. All the Scriptures which he hath brought, I have already before examin'd and explain'd, and I cannot but look upon it as superfluous, to go twice over with one VVork, as
J. N. hath done; for that which is unsound,
[Page 289] or not right in the Ground, Bottom, or Foundation, can never be made sound or right by Repetitions: but the Subject before stated by
J.N. is unsound, and not true, as before prov'd; and therefore can never be made sound and true by Repetitions; for which cause (as also upon consideration, that this same Subject hath been already oft stated, and answer'd to, by several of us, as is notoriously evident by several
Books▪ now in Print) I look upon it (as I said before) superfluous, to go over with the Repetitions of
J. N. it being chiefly but a Repetition of the above sited Scriptures, paraphaised upon once more by him, which I have before examin'd, and spoken to: And therefore shall omit taking further notice thereof at this time; and proceed to his next Subject or Assertion, in the 22th and 23th pages of his Book, where he speaks as followeth.
Concerning Scriptures being a Perfect Rule for all Men, &c.
‘HAving thus prov'd the Scriptures to be the Word, &c. I shall therefore shew briefly, That the Scriptures, I have so prov'd to be the Word of God, that they are a Perfect Rule for all men to walk by, and no other; and this
(saith he) is clear from
Mat. 28.20. where Christ gives his Disciples Commission to preach the Gospel, and saith,
Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I command you: and so likewise in
Mark, where Christ confirmeth the same Commission, &c.
Mark 16.15, 16. Now this was not only to be preached for men
[Page 290] to hear the sound of, but also to believe and obey the same: And this Truth is confirm'd in
Acts 3.22. where its said,
A Prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you, of your Brethren, (saith Moses)
like unto me, him shall you hear in all things, whatsoever he shall say unto you: Observe that,
Him shall you hear in all things: From whence we may learn, That Christ gives no Licence to his People to pick and cull his Wayes▪ but to hear and obey him in all things, whatsoever he shall say unto them. And that the Scriptures are in force as a Perfect Rule, see
Rom. 16.25, 26. where the Apostle doth affirm the Authority thereof, and saith,
The Mystery that was kept secret since the World began, is now made manifest by the Scripture of the Prophets, according to the Commandment of the Everlasting God, and made known unto all Nations for the Obedience of Faith, &c.’
Answ. Reader, I would not be mis-taken in my Intentions, as though,
I went about to under-value the Scriptures of Truth; or,
as though I had slight esteem of them (for, I do in reallity own them; and do acknowledge them to contain many true Testimonies of him, whose Name is call'd the Word of God; who is the perfect Way to the Father; and the alone Guide, that leadeth unto Life eternal; a Leader and Commander unto his People, appointed of the Father: I say, I own the Scriptures to contain many true Testimonies concerning him, and concerning many other things; and that they ought to be believ'd, &c. But that they are therefore a Perfect Rule for all men to walk by, and none other, I cannot own; for, they no where testifie of, or concerning themselves: And if it were certainly so, That they were a Perfect Rule, and
[Page 291] no other (as
J. N. affirmeth) then it must of necessity follow, That they, who have not the Scriptures, are without a Perfect Rule; and that before the Scriptures were written, the Ancients and Worthies of God, as,
Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Noah, Lot, Enoch, &c. had no Perfect Rule to walk by; except he could prove, That the Rule by which they walked
(and by which Abraham
was to walk before God, and be Perfect) was no more to be a Rule, after the Scriptures were written; the which I no where find recorded in the Scriptures: But contrariwise, That same Rule, by which they walked, bore Witness unto the Scripture: And the Scriptures offer'd by
J. N. do not at all prove, that they are a Perfect Rule; except it could be prov'd, that they contain all things that Christ commanded his Apostles to preach and teach, which in reason none can conclude; for, although the Scriptures be a part of what they preacht and taught, yet there is but very little of what they taught and preacht declar'd in them; nor indeed, little at all of the Preachings and Teachings of the most part of the
Apostles; therefore, if their Preachings and Teachings be the Perfect Rule for all men to walk by, then the Scriptures are not indeed that Perfect Rule, they containing in them such a small part of what they preacht and taught.
Again, It cannot be understood, That the Scriptures were the Gospel that was preacht to every Creature under Heaven; for, a great part of the People under Heaven, never heard (nor heard of) the Scriptures:
But the Gospel was preached to, or in, every Creature under Heaven, Col. 1.23. Therefore the
Scripture is not the
Gospel.
And again, The Gospel that they preached, was, and is Everlasting: But the Scriptures cannot be rationally understood to be Everlasting, because they are things
[Page 292] that are seen, which are temporal; therefore the Scriptures are not the Everlasting Gospel, but the Power of God is,
Rom. 2.16.
And what doth that saying of
Moses avail, to prove the
Scriptures a perfect Rule for all men to walk by? For, if that Prophet was, and is to be heard in all things, then he is to be looked unto as a Guide, and Commander, and Ruler; and if a Ruler, then his Spirit, by which he rules, is the Perfect Rule above Scripture.
And as to his saying,
‘
The Apostle confirms the Scripture to be a Perfect Pule by these words, The Mystery that was kept secret since the World began, is now made manifest, and by the Scriptures of the Prophets, &c.’
Answ. What, though that great Mystery was made manifest, according to the
Scriptures of the Prophets, that doth not prove the Scriptures a Perfect Rule for all men to walk by; for, the Manifestation of that Mystery by the Scriptures of the Prophets, was no more but their perswading (or shewing) them out of
Moses and the Prophets concerning Jesus,
Acts 28.23. of whom all the Prophets bore Testimony: For this Jesus, concerning whom the Apostles (by Revelation and Commandment of the Everlasting God) perswaded the People, was the Mystery that had been hid, as the Apostle to the
Collosians, cap. 1. ver. 26, 27. declareth, saying,
The Mystery which hath been hid from Ages and Generations, but now is made manifest, &c. Which is Christ in you the Hope of Glory [Mark]
Is now made manifest: So here was the manifesting of that Mystery, by the Scriptures of the Prophets, even by perswading them, or shewing them out of the Prophets concerning Jesus: so that the Apostle doth not affirm (nor in effect
[Page 293] affirm) in the Scripture,
That the Scriptures are a Perfect Rule; but simply declares, That by the Commandment of the Everlasting God they made known that Mystery (or preached Jesus) by (or out of) the
Scriptures of the Prophets, who had testified of him that was to come, and was then come according to their Testimony, who is the Way, the Mystery, and the Word, which all are to hear, obey, and keep.
But then saith
J. N.
‘This is that Rule that Christ directeth unto in
Joh. 5.39, 40. where Christ saith,
Search the Scriptures, for in them ye think to have Eternal Life: and to take away all Objections, as if it were only their
thoughts, and not really so, he addeth these words,
And they are they which testifie of me: and by way of Reproof, because they did not so do, he again saith,
You will not come to me that you may have Life; by which he plainly sheweth, that there was Life therein, by dutiful Obedience by Faith in him; so that here the great Prophet and Teacher of his People sendeth us to the
Scriptures, as a Rule through Faith to come to Life.’
Answ. How wilfully blind this man seems to appear, or like one that would put out his own Eyes, and others also! to wrest and pervert the words of Christ in such a gross and shameful manner, by tearing of them in sunder, and mixing his own Imaginations therewith, to make them look quite another way, or to import another thing; for that which
J. N. argueth Christ confirmeth (
viz. Their thoughts of having Life in the
Scriptures) he indeed reproved, as the words in themselves without wresting clearly signifie; for some Translations render it thus,
Ye search the Scriptures, for in them ye think to have
[Page 294] Eternal Life; and they are they which testifie of Me; and ye will not come unto Me: Mark,
Ye search, &c. he tells them they did search; but why? because they thought to have Eternal Life in them, which were but a Testimony of him, who was the Life; and he (by way of Reproof to them, for not believing on him, in whom Life was, and of whom the
Scriptures (which they searched) did testifie) said,
Ye will not come unto me that ye may have Life: [Mark] his
Me here spoken of, that they would not come to for Life, was not the
Scriptures, but Christ Jesus, of whom the Scriptures testified: so that he did not plainly shew,
That there is Life in the Scriptures, as
J. N. (either wilfully or ignorantly) affirmeth; nor directs to them as
A Rule to come to Life: But reproves them because they did not come unto him for Life, of whom the
Scripture testified: so that the most
J. N. hath done by this Argument is, even manifested his perverse crooked spirit, by which he wrests and perverts the Scriptures, and would set them in the place of Christ, to give Life: But what is the End of the crooked
Serpent in this Work, but to keep people from coming unto Christ the
Power of God, through which Life Eternal is received by all that follow and obey him, who is the Truth, whose Spirit of Truth will lead into all Truth, as a certain Rule for all to walk by, and in, which Christ directed them to wait for, as a Guide to walk by; and the Apostle exhorted them to walk in the Spirit, saying,
There is no Condemnation to such, &c. Rom. 8.1.
Gal. 5.16.
Asts 1.4, 5. And all this the subtil
Serpent doth under pretence of Promoting (and not Perverting) the right Way of God, and Rule of Life; but this serves not (as before shewed) to prove, That Christ directed to the Scriptures, as a Rule to come to Life; but that he reproved
[Page 295] them for that they would not come to him, who was the the Life, that they might have Life.
But then saith
J. N.
‘This Truth is confirmed in
Paul's Epistle to
Timothy, chap. 3. vers. 15, 16, 17. where the Apostle sheweth, the Scriptures are able to make us wise unto Salvation through Faith in Christ Jesus’ (And from hence
J. N. argueth)
‘That if the Scriptures are able to make us wise to Salvation through Faith that is in Christ Jesus, then the Scriptures are a Perfect Rule for all men to walk by, and none other: But the Scriptures are able to made us wise unto Salvation through Faith that is in Christ Jesus; therefore the Scriptures are a Perfect Rule for all men to walk by, and none other.’
Answ. To which I answer, That Argument is falacious; for, though the Scriptures are able to make wise to Salvation through Faith that is in Christ Jesus; yet it doth not follow (according to the sequel of the major) that the Scriptures (the Faith in Christ Jesus being left out, as
J. N. hath done) are a Perfect Rule for all men to walk by, and none other; because its through that Faith which is in Christ Jesus, that they are able to make wise, &c. which Faith he makes no mention of in his Assumption and Conclusion, that they are a Perfect Rule, &c. by which the Falaciousness of his Argument appears.
And indeed its necessary, that all should understand how the Scriptures are able to make wise unto Salvation, through Faith, &c. for, the Scriptures here spoken of (and which Christ spoke of, when he said,
Ye search
[Page 296] the Scriptures, &c.) cannot be otherwise understood then the Scriptures of the old Testament, because the other was not then written: And those Scriptures of the Prophets were they that testified of Christ, who is the great Salvation of God: And God said by the Prophet,
He had given him a Covenant of Light to lighten the Gentiles,
to be for Salvation to the Ends of the Earth: And the Prophets likewise shewed the time when, and the place where this
Messiah should be born and brought forth in that Body which was prepar'd for him; in which old
Simeon beheld the Salvation, to wit,
The Light of the Gentiles,
and the Glory of Israel: so that the Scriptures of the Prophets, containing in them so many clear and infallible Testimonies of the great Salvation of God, and of the time and place of the Appearance thereof, they were able through Faith in Christ to make him wise, or to give an Understanding, that he was the great Salvation of God that was then appear'd, according to the Testimonies of the Prophets, which from a Child he had known: And so on this wise, coming to the Knowledge of the great Salvation of God by Faith in him, he in the same Faith did doubtless follow him, as a
Sheep that knew his Voice, that so he might receive Life Eternal (which he gives to his Followers) and become an Heir of that Salvation, which through Faith in Christ he was made wise unto; and so coming as a
Sheep to be a Follower of the true
Shepherd, he own'd him for his only Guide, and his Spirit as the only Zule to walk by, and to speak by, whose Preaching was thereby, even with words that it self taught, 1
Cor. 2.13.
And this is that Perfect Rule which cannot be corrupted, as the Scriptures may, as
J.N. confesseth; and
[Page 297] so cannot be said to be a Perfect Rule, if corrupted: And indeed
J.N. is one that greatly corrupts them (as he states them) thinking thereby to prove them a Perfect Rule, even as before shewed.
The next Argument to prove Scriptures a perfect Rule is,
‘That if the Scriptures be given by Inspiration, and are profitable for Doctrine, for Correction, for Instruction in Righteousness, that the Man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all
Good Works, then the Scriptures are an Absolute and a Perfect Rule for all men to walk by, and none other: but the Scriptures are, &c. therefore, &c’
Answ. That the Scriptures (though not all Scriptures) were given by Inspiration of God, I shall grant; and that they are profitable, as aforesaid, I shall acknowledge: but that they are therefore an absolute and a perfect Rule for all men to walk by, and none other, as
J.N. affirmeth, that I do not acknowledge, but deny; because that may be profitable to man in order to the persecting of him to all Good Works, which may not be an absolute and perfect Rule for him to walk by, and none other; as for instance, One man may be profitable to another in teaching and instructing of him by the Spirit of the Lord, to walk in the Light and Spirit of the Son of God, which the Father hath sent into the Heart, that so by that Spirit, and the Power of it, he may be able to deny all Unrighteousness, and be furnished thereby perfectly to perform all
Good Wooks; herein I say one man may be profitable to another, and yet it cannot therefore be said, That that man, who is so profitable &c. is an absolute and perfect
[Page 298] Rule for all men to walk by, and no other; for it were ridiculous: so that although the Scriptures be profitable, as aforesaid; it doth not at all follow (as
J. N. concludeth) that they are therefore a Perfect Rule, and no other.
But that Word, Light, or Spirit of Truth in the inward parts, from whence the Scriptures proceeded, and which by the Scriptures we are instructed to walk in, to hear, and obey (which cannot be corrupted, as the Scriptures may) that is the alone, absolute, and perfect Rule, all men ought to walk by, and none other, as saith the Scripture,
Nehemiah 9.20.
I gave them my Good Spirit to instruct them. And this is that Rule or Leader which Christ directeth to,
Even the Spirit of Truth, which will lead into all Truth, Joh. 16.13. the same the Apostle directeth to, saying,
Walk in the Spirit, and you shall not fulfil the Lusts of the Flesh [Mark] What more Perfect Rule can be then that which keeps from the fulfilling the Lusts which bring forth sin; for if the Lusts be not obey'd and fulfilled, the sin is not acted; therefore said the Apostle,
He that abideth in him sinneth not; by all which it appears that
J.N. hath not proved that the Scriptures are a Perfect Rule, and none other: Neither do the Scriptures any where testifie of themselves, as a Perfect Rule, excluding all other: But frequently bear Testimony unto that one antient standing RULE, which was from rhe beginning, from which the Scriptures were given forth, and which they direct unto.
‘Again, (saith
J. N. pag. 26.) For further Confirmation of this Truth I shall add some few Arguments more, that the New Testament Way is a Perfect
[Page 299] Rule for all men to walk by, and none other.’
Answ. This wholly alters the Case; for it is not the New Testament Way being a Perfect
Rule, &c. that we are contending against; neither will his proving the new Testament Way to be a perfect Rule, at all prove the Scriptures to be a perfect
Rule; except he could first prove the Scriptures to be the New Testament Way, which he is never able to do; for its declared in the Scriptures called the New Testament, That Christ, who is God's Covenant of Light, said,
I am the Way, the Truth, and the Life, Joh. 14.6.
Abide in me, &c. cap. 15.4.
And my Sheep bear my Voyce, and they follow me, and I give to them Eternal Life, Joh. 10.27, 28.
Another New Testament Way or Perfect
Rule then this, for men to walk in, and by, I no where read of in the Scripture of Truth; but this Way (as the New and Living Way) which leads to the Holiest of all, is frequently borne witness of in the Scriptures, which (as before I have said) contain many Testimonies concerning this Just One, who is the Way, the Word, the Truth, &c.
And indeed, the whole scope or drift of the Scriptures, or of what is contained therein, is to direct and enduce people to walk in him, and according to him, who is the Way, the true
Shepherd, that carries his Lambs in his Arms (Mark, if his Lambs are in his Arm, then he is essentially present with them.)
And I do no where read in the Scriptures that they are called the New Testament, or the New Testament Way; but they testifie of the New Testament, that it is the Spirit that giveth Life, as in 2
Cor. 3.6. the Apostle
[Page 300] saith,
Who hath made us able Ministers of the New Testament, not of the Letter, but of the Spirit; for the Letter killeth, but the Spirit giveth Life: And they testifie of the Way, that it is Christ,; so that the Way of the Spirit (which is the New Covenant) is Christ, and they that are led by the Spirit, they walk in Christ the New Testament Way; so that if
J. N. had proved the New Testament Way to be a perfect Rule, &c. it had served nothing for his purpose to prove the Scriptures a perfect Rule, they being proved not to be the New Testament; as also said the Angel unto
John, cap. 19. vers. 10.
The Testimony of Jesus is the Spirit of Prophesie: though I do acknowledge, as before, That this New Testament, or New Covenant, or Testimony of Jesus is testified of in the Scriptures of Truth; yet they are not the thing, nor do they contain the thing in them which they testifie of, as
J. Newman seems to imply they do, as hereafter may be signified.
But instead of proving the New Testament Way a
perfect Rule, he goeth about to prove the Scriptures a
perfect Rule, but never proves (nor goes about to prove) them to be the New Testament Way; but takes that for granted (as far as I perceive) although that is the principal matter wherein the Controvesie lies betwixt us, which I plainly perceive
J.N. doth not understand, though he hath so deeply engag'd himself: For, if he could have proved the Scriptures, called the
New Testament, to be the
New Testament Way, I should not have put Pen to Paper to have contended against their being a
perfect Rule for all men to walk by: But herein is the great Mistake amongst many (as also in this man) They put the Dead Letter for the Living Word, and the Scriptures for the Way, and so would set them in the stead of the thing which they do
[Page 301] but testifie of; and thereby keep people alwayes learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the Truth, which sanctifieth and setteth free, 2
Tim. 3.7.
Joh. 8.32.
Joh. 17.17.
Then
J. N. like a man fighting with the Wind (or like one that sets up a Poppit of his own, and supposeth it to be anothers, and then lies fighting with it, when he has done) rumbles over a great deal of stuff (like one that wanteth Work) contending against a Third Covenant, or a Third Testament Way, arguing in the 26th page of his Book,
‘That if a Third Covenant, or a Third Testament Way hath not been any where promised of God, then the Second is still in force, for all men to walk by, and none other.’ And for my part, I know none that assert a Third Covenant, or a Third Testament Way; nor yet any that deny the Second to be in force: so that
J.N. hath busied himself to no purpose; as I said before, like one beating of the Air; but I do not intend so to busie my self, to contend against him about things in which I am not concern'd: For, as I said, I own no other Covenant nor Testament Way, but the
Second Covenant, which God promised by the Mouthes of his Prophets, saying,
Jer. 31.33.
This shall be the Covenant that I will make, &c. I will put my Law in their Inward Parts, and write it in their Hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my People: And they shall no more teach every man his Neighbour, saying,
Know the Lord; for they shall all know me, &c. And in
Isa. 59.21. he said,
This is my Covenant with them, saith the Lord, my Spirit which is upon thee, and my Words which I have put into thy Mouth shall not depart out of thy Mouth, nor out of the Mouth of thy Seed, nor out of the Mouth of thy Seed's Seed, saith the Lord, from hence forth and for evermore. [Mark] This Law and Spirit within,
[Page 302] the New Covenant, the New Testament Way, testified of in the Scriptures of Truth, to be an Everlasting Covenant; this we own to be a Perfect Rule for all men to walk by, unto the End of the World, and none other. And for a third Covenant, or third Testament Way, I know none assert it; therefore I shall not trouble my self to contend about it; but shall leave that part of his Book for those whom it concern, if there be any; though I cannot well but observe, that he hath offer'd many foolish, falacious and ignorant Arguments; pretending thereby to prove the New Testament Way still in force, and to be so to the End, which I have already granted (and shall be ready so to do at all times) but still he mistakes the matter, by putting the Dead Letter in the place of the Quickning Spirit; and directeth people to the Letter for Life, when its only the Spirit that giveth Life, as before is signified; and so he stumbleth at the Stumbling-Stone; a Rock, which many have run against, and have been split.
And so after he hath rumbled over divers sylogistical Argments, which serve to signifie, that he loves to hear himself talk
Logick; thereby still labouring to prove,
That no Third Covenant, or third Testament Way is to be expected, for which cause the Second is to stand in force unto the End, &c. He then, in page 42. of his Book, comes to lay down some sad Consequences,
‘Which will
(as he saith) follow by denying the Scriptures to be the Word of God, and by making them insufficient as a Rule in order to Man's Salvation; and first,
(saith he) It taketh away the general Ground of Faith from all men. 2dly, It denyeth the Ground of Faith for the Remission of sins. 3dly, It maketh void the Exercises of Faith in the precious Promises of God; for what hath Faith to exercise it self in, but
[Page 303] only the Promises of God in the Scriptures? 4thly, It denieth the Comforts of Faith; for all the Comforts that Faith can bring to the soul, must be brought from the precious Promises of God in the Scripture. 5thly, It Destroyeth the Support and Supplyes of Grace to the Soul in a time of Affliction; and to deny the Scripture to be the Word of God, is to deny the Fountain and Well-spring of Comforts to the Soul. 6thly, It denieth the Knowledge of Acceptance with God. 7thly, If the Scriptures be denied to be the Word of God, and thereby made insufficient as a Rule, &c. then all men are left in the dark; for no man is able to know that God will save any, but by his Word, which is contain'd in the Scriptures; for this is the Word of Salvation, or that which directeth to the Means by which we shall obtain Life. 8thly, Without this (meaning Scripture) we know not that there is any God, or Christ, or Salvation by God in Christ, &c. Lastly, It leaveth men to walk by Fancy or Imagination, &c.’
Answ. To all which I shall answer, That for as much as we (the People of God called
Quakers) do not assert or own a third
Testament Way, which
J.N. seems to fight against and oppose; it would be as superfluous for me to reply to his Sylogisms, as it hath been in him to offer them; and I should (therein) but answer a
Fool according to his
Folly, and so become like unto him, which I am no way enclined to do; but shall proceed to examine, whether or no those dreadful Consequences, asserted by
J. N. will follow the denying of the Scriptures to be the Word of God, and a Perfect Rule for all men to walk by, and none other.
[Page 304]
First, How doth it take away the general ground of Faith from all men, to deny the Scriptures to be the Word, and Rule, &c. seeing the Word is still owned to be in beeing, and to be heard, which was the Ground and Author of the Faith of
Abraham, and the Holy Men of God, who believed before the Scriptures were written?
2
Cor. 4.13. And because they believed, therefore they spoke forth the Scriptures: by which it appears, That the Faith, that was once deliver'd to the Saints (which we are earnestly to contend for) was received by them through hearing of the Word, before the Scriptures were written; and therefore the Scriptures were not the Ground of their Faith: so that to deny the Scriptures to be the Word of God, is not to deny or take away the Ground of that Faith, which by the Spirit or Word was once deliver'd to the Saints: For the Apostle, in 1
Cor. 12.
[...]. declares the Ground of the Faith which the Church had receiv'd (and which he labour'd in the Word (which wrought mightily in him) for the building of them up in) to be the Spirit, when he spoke of the diversity of Gifts which they had receiv'd; he said,
To another is given Faith by the same Spirit: And this doth not at all oppose or contradict that Scripture which saith,
Faith comes by Hearing, and Hearing by the Word of God; because the Father, Word, and Spirit are one Substance, and are not divided (but the Scripture is not one Substance with the Father and Spirit) so that he who heareth the Word heareth the Father and the Quickening Spirit also.
And this Author of Faith (as I said before) was heard and believed before the Scriptures were written; and remains the same this day as yesterday, and the same forever,
[Page 305] a Foundation of Faith that standeth sure, and is not a far off from every one,
but is nigh, even the Word nigh thee, in thy Heart and in thy Mouth; and this is the Word of Faith which the Apostle preached, and which we preach, by the hearing of which Faith cometh: so that denying the Scriptures to be the Word is not to deny the Ground and Foundation of true Faith; neither is it in the least to under-value the holy Scriptures, which so frequently testifie of the Ground, and Foundation; and Author of the true Faith.
Secondly, And as for his affirming,
‘That to deny the Scriptures to be the Word, is to deny the Ground of Faith for the Remission of sins.’
Answ. I answer No; if the Word be the Ground (as most true it is) the Ground is not deny'd by denying Scriptures to be the Word; because the
Scriptures, which testifie of the Word, are before proved not to be the Word.
And they which had the Seal of Acceptance with God, had (without Controversie) the Seal of Remission of sins; because, without Remission there can be no Acceptance, But the Servants of God had the
Seal or Testimony of Acceptance with God, even some before any part of the
Scriptures were written, as
Abel, Enoch, Abraham, &c. therefore the Scriptures were not the Ground of Faith for the Remission of sins, but the Word which was before the
Scriptures were written: so that to deny the
Scriptures to be the Word of God, is not to deny the Ground of Faith for the Remission of sins.
And the Prophet
David, who sometime complained,
Psal. 38.4.
That his Iniquities were gone over his head as a
[Page 306] Burden too heavy for him to bear; afterwards declar'd,
Psal. 103.12.
That as far as the East is from the West, so far had the Lord removed his Transgressions from him: Now where did the
Scriptures tell him that his Iniquities were put so far from him? Or how were they the Ground of this Faith by which he thus spoke, and by which he had this Evidence of the Remission or Removing of his sins? Was not the Word, which was settled in the Heavens, and which was a Light to his Feet, &c. the Ground of this Faith: Which Word healed him when he was in Distress, and when his Wounds stunk because of his Folly; which Word still remaineth, and is owned as the Ground of Faith for the Remission of sins, though the
Scriptures be not acknowledged to be the Word.
Thirdly, And for his saying,
‘It maketh void the Exercises of Faith in the precious Promises of God; for, what hath Faith to exercise it self, but only the Promises of God in
Scripture, &c.’
Answ. I answer, The true Faith, which Christ is the Author of, hath the Power of God (in which it stands) to exercise it self in, as the Objects thereof; through which Power of God (which is the Gospel) Life and Immortality is brought to Light, 2
Tim. 1.10. as Fruit of that Faith which stands in Christ the Power; so that Vertue and Knowledge is thereby added to the Faith, by which the true Believer is built up in his Holy Faith: so that denying the
Scriptures to be the Word doth not make void the Exercises of Faith, nor take away the Ground in which true Faith standeth, as
J. N. vainly imagineth; because the Scripture is not the
Power of God, in which
[Page 307] the true Faith standeth: Neither doth it follow, as
J. N. asserteth,
That Faith must be exercis'd in Scripture, or else upon Fancy and Imagination; because it may be exercised in the Power of God, as in the true Ground thereof, which is neither Scripture, nor Imagination, nor Fancy; for the Apostle said,
That his Speech and Preaching was not with enticing words of man's Wisdom, but in Demonstration of the Spirit and of Power, that their Faith might not stand in the Wisdom of Man, but in the Power of God, 1
Cor. 2.4, 5. And in this are the Exercises of that true Faith, which (by the Spirit or Word) was once deliver'd to the Saints, and which we now earnestly contend for. But
J. N. by this Assertion signifies that he is a
Stranger to the Power of God, in which true Faith standeth, and therefore we may rationally conclude, That he is also Reprobate concerning that Faith which Christ the Power of God is the Author and Object of.
Fourthly, He saith,
‘It denyeth the Comforts of Faith; for all Comforts that Faith can bring to the soul, must be brought from the Promises of God, according as they are laid down in the Scripture, &c.’
Answ. Here
J.N. absolutely limits God, without any
Ground or Reason, or Warrant for so doing; as though
God, who is the Fountain of all true
Comfort, could not convey true
Comfort to the
soul of a Believer by his Faith, but he must first fetch it from the
Scripture; and so in effect the
Scripture must be set above
God, or at least, in the Place of
God.
But what
Scripture J. N. hath to prove this his absurd Affirmation, I know not; he hath produced none to prove
[Page 308] that, nor indeed any of the sad Consequences, which he saith will follow the denying the
Scriptures to be the
Word of God, and
Perfect Rule, &c. we have only his bare word for it; but whether that be of sufficient authority to enduce us to believe his Assertions, I leave to the juditious Reader to judge; seeing that Christ said to the Woman of
Samaria, That the Water that he would give, should be in him that received it as a Well springing up to Eternal Life, Joh. 4.14. & again, Joh. 7.38, 39. said,
He that believeth on Me, as the Scripture hath said, out of his Belly shall flow Rivers of Living Water: But this spake-he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive. [Mark Reader] The Spirit that they should receive that believed on him (and whose Faith stood in the
Power of God) was that Living Water that should be in them springing up unto Eternal Life, or that should flow up in them through Faith; and this
Comfort their Faith did not fetch from
Scripture, but by their Faith was known to dwell in them,
as their Everlasting Comforter, that was to abide with them forever, even the Spirit of Truth, according as Christ promised,
Jo. 14.16, 17. so that to deny the Scripture to be the Word, is not to deny the
Comforts of Faith, because that the
true Comforter was known by Faith, and is known by Faith to remain though the Scripture may be taken away; and yet it doth not deny the
Comfort of the Scripture neither, unto those who have the understanding thereof.
Fifthly, J. N. saith,
‘It destroyes the Support and Supplies of Grace to the soul in a time of Affliction, &c. and to deny the Scriptures to be the
Word of God, is to deny the very Foundation and Well-spring of
Comforts to the soul in Affliction, which is brought out of
[Page 309] the Promises in the
Scriptures to the soul, &c.’
Answ. This Assertion is like the former, only the last part thereof somewhat more gross Blasphemy, without any
Scripture Argument to prove any part thereof, only his own Assertion, as in the rest, though full contrary to the Testimony of the Prophet, who speaking of the Affliction of the soul said,
When the Enemy shall come in like a Flood the Spirit of the Lord shall lift up a Standard against him: That was the Support and Relief of the soul in the time of its Affliction, according to the Prophets Testimony; and the same
Support the Children of Light do still witness, whose Faith stands in the
Power of God, and whose Trust is in that Name which is a
strong Tower.
And for his calling the
Scriptures the very Fountain and Well-spring of
Comforts, &c. Its gross Blasphemy, and a Robbing of God, who is a Spirit, and who is the Fountain of all
Good, whose Spirit (as before shewed) is in them that believe as a Well springing up unto Eternal Life; for the
Scriptures no where call themselves the Fountain, nor have the holy Men of
God so called them; but they testifie of him-who is the
Fountain of all Good: Neither are they in them selves any where called the
Well-spring of Comforts; but they testifie of the Spirit of Truth, the
Comforter, that it shall be in them that believe, a Well springing up unto Eternal Life: so that
J. Newman to make good his Argument, if he could, Blasphemously putteth the Dead Letter in the place of God, and in the place of the Living Spirit.
Sixthly, He saith,
‘It denieth the Knowledge of Acceptance with God; for if the
Scriptures be deny'd to be
[Page 310] the
Word of God, then who knoweth what God will accept, &c? and who knoweth what God counteth sin and wickedness, &c.’
Answ. To which I answer, This is in part answer'd already; for
Enoch, &c. had this Testimony,
That he pleased God, Heb. 11.5. before the
Scriptures were written; and that Testimony was the
Seal of Acceptance with
God, which I dare affirm every true Believer will acknowledge; and this Testimony of Acceptance he did not receive from
Scripture; for there was none; but he obtain'd it by Faith, which the Word (that was in the Beginning) was the Author of, as the Apostle said,
He that believes hath the Witness in himself, 1
Joh. 5.10. by which it appears, That the Knowledge of Acceptance, or the
Seal of being Well-pleasing unto God, is not the
Scriptures, but the Spirit of Faith.
But that
J. N. and others, may see the
Confusion that he runs into while he is fighting against the Truth, I insert his own words in the 77th page of his
Book, and compare them with this Assertion; he saith,
‘I shall freely own the giving forth of his blessed Spirit into the Hearts of his Children, whereby they are directed into his Most Holy Will, by the enlightening of their spirits by that Holy Spirit of Promise, by which they know their Adoption; and also, by the same Spirit can own God to be their Father, &c.’
Thus far are his own words, by which the Reader may easily judge whether or no
J-N. doth not speak absolutely contrary to the Belief or Perswasion of his mind, in saying,
‘If the
Scriptures be deny'd to be the
Word of God, it denieth the Knowledge of Acceptance; and who then
[Page 311] knoweth what
God accounteth sin and wickedness, &c.’ I say, let the Reader but compare his
Confession concerning the Spirit with his Assertion concerning the
Scripture, and he shall see his
Contradition sufficiently; for, if the giving forth of the Spirit directeth into the Knowledge of the Most Holy Will of the Father, then by the same Spirit, what is contrary to that must absolutely be known also; and how then can it be said, that without Scriptures be owned to be the
Word of God, the Ground of the Knowledge of Acceptance with God is deny'd; seeing that which manifests the will of the Father, manifests that which is acceptable to him, and thereby its known? And all this may be known by the Spirit, as
J. N. confesseth, to the wounding of his own Work. And indeed, What he hath acknowledged is to be known by the Spirit, is even enough for any man to know, or enough to give Satisfaction to every
Soul, who breathes after the Knowledge of Acceptance with God: For what can give more satisfaction to a man, then to know the holy Will of God by his Spirit, and to know his Adoption, and to know that God is his Father? Certainly there is no cause for him that hath this Knowledge to question his Acceptance with God: And this may be known without Scripture, even by the holy Spirit of Promise, as
J.N. confesseth: therefore to deny the Scriptures to be the
Word of God, doth not deny the Knowledge of Acceptance with God; and thus out of his own Mouth he is judged.
Seventhly, He saith,
‘If the Scriptures be denied to be the Word of God, &c. then all men are left in the dark, &c. for no man is able to know that God will save any, but by his Word, which is contain'd in the Scriptures;
[Page 312] for this is the Word of Salvation, or that which directeth to the Means by which we shall obtain Life, &c.’
Answ. That none are able to know that God will save any, but by this Word, that I shall easily acknowledgd; because its the Word only that is able to save: but that the Scriptures are this Word, or alone able to save, that I do not acknowledge, but deny; and
J. N. hath produced no
Proof for his Assertion, but only his own Affirmation, nor indeed can he: although he boldly saith,
They are the Word of Salvation, yet they no where say so of themselves; but they testifie of the Word of Salvation, and
That it was sent unto the Children of Abraham,
and unto all amongst them that feared God, Acts 13.26. [Mark] This was not the
Scriptures that were sent amongst them; but the
Word of Salvation, or that Word which is able to save,
Jam. 1.21. which the Apostle there besought the Children of
Abraham to receive with Meekness, calling it the
Ingrafted Word, or as some
English Translations have it,
The Word that is grafted in you: so this is the
Word that is able to save, the
Word of Salvation, the
Word of Faith in the Heart, &c. which
Word was in the Beginning, the Author of the Faith of the Fathers; by which
Jacob knew that God would save, even before
Scriptures were written, which made him say (
Gen. 49.18.)
O Lord, I have waited for thy Salvation: By all which it appears, That to deny the
Scriptures to be the
Word of God, doth not leave men so in the dark, as
J. N. affirmeth, but that they are still in a capacity to know that God will save; and also to see the Salvation of God, which is promised to them that order their
Conversation aright.
And whereas he saith,
‘That the Scriptures direct
[Page 313] to the Means by which we shall obtain Life.’
I Answer, I shall easily acknowledge that; for, as I have before said, they contain many true Testimonies of him, who is the alone Leader unto Life; and they are profitable for Doctrine, for Instruction, &c. that people may be directed to Christ the Way, which they testifie of; and that they may be turned from Darkness to the Light, which discovers the Darkness; and that they may come to receive with Meekness the ingrafted Word, or the word which is grafted in them, by it to be taught, and led unto the Possession of Life; for this is the Means by which Life is obtain'd, which the Scriptures testifie of, and direct unto; and for this Work we own the
Scriptures to be profitable.
But this doth not run paralel with the Affirmation of
J. N. in the 24th page of his
Book, where he affirmeth,
‘That Life was in the Scriptures; for its one thing to say, that there is Life therein; and another thing to say, they direct to the Means by which Life is obtain'd.’ If
John Newman asserted no other thing then the latter, there had been no Controversie about this Point; for, so far we own the
Scriptures: But his Confusion sheweth what his spirit is, oft-tmes contradicting and opposing himself, as is usual with those that oppose the Unchangeable Truth.
But I perceive, an Objection may arise in the Ignorant concerning this thing,
That if the Word which is able to save, be grafted in people, and be nigh unto all, even in the Heart and Mouth; why then are not all saved? or, why do not all see the Salvation of God? or, why did the Apostle Exhort them to receive it with Meekness, if it were in them already?
[Page 314]I Answer, though the Word, or Spirit, (which is one) was in them, yet they being disobedient thereunto, did not receive it, or had not received it; but had alwayes resisted it, as the Apostle tells them,
Acts 7.51. and so were like unto those that
Job spoke of, saying;
They are of them that rebel against the Light, who know not the Way of it, &c.
Job 24.13. so that although the Word, or Light, or Spirit be in a people, and they rebel against it, or resist the reproofs and Instructions thereof, or do dispite to the strivings thereof; how can such be said to have received it, for they only receive the Word, and the Spirit, that receive the Reproofs and Instructions thereof, and in them it is known to be a Spirit, or Prince of Peace, and a Word of Life, and Consolation, and such know their Beloved to lye all might betwixt their Brests; but although he be nigh even in the hearts of many, they cannot be said to receive him, while they rebel against him; and therefore they are not saved, but condemned by him;
For this is the condemnation that Light is come, and men love Darkness rather then Light, Joh. 3.19. and though he lighteth every man that comes into the World; yet its only they that receive him, (the Light) that he gives Power unto,
Joh. 1.12. by which it appears that all that were englightned by him, did not receive him, so that the Light, the Word; the Spirit, may be in people, and yet they that received it, but reject it in its Reproofs, Counsels, and Instructions, and therefore they are not saved by it, but condemned; for which cause it was needful for the Apostle to Labour to turn them from Darkness to the Light, wherewith they were enlightned, & to Exhort them to receive with meekness, the engrafted Word, or to submit unto the operation
[Page 315] of the Word that was in them, that by it they might be saved; for none experimentally knows its ability to save, but they, who receive the Reproofs, and Instructions of it, and are Doers, or Obeyers thereof; and such are taught thereby (as by the Universal Grace, which hath appeared unto all men, which bringeth salvation) to order their Conversation aright, through which they come to see the great Salvation of God.
Eighthly, Now I come to the eighth, sad Consequence that
J. N. saith will follow denying the Scripture to be the Word of God,
‘Without this (saith he) we know not that there is any God, or Christ, &c. neither do we know what God counteth unclean, or what he counteth holy, &c.’
Answ. If by what God counteth Unclean, and what Holy, he meaneth the things appertaining to the Life and Conversation of People, then the denial of
Scripture to be the
Word of God doth not hinder People from knowing what is Unclean and what is Holy: Notwithstanding, we cannot own the
Scriptures to be the Word; yet we own that to be unclean which is so accounted in the
Scriptures of Truth in the Gospel Dispensation, and that to be holy which in them is so accounted, and that the one ought to be chosen and the other refused: but if there were no
Scriptures in beeing, yet are people in the same capacity to receive the Knowledge of those things, as they were before the
Scriptures were written; or as the
Gentiles were, who had not the outward Law, yet in Life and Conversation shewed forth the Works of the Law that was written in their Hearts; and if those
Gentiles were now here,
[Page 316] they would condemn the Ignorance of
J. N. who saith,
Without Scripture none know whether there be a God, or what he counteth Unclean, and what Holy: For all the
Heathen Poets and
Philosophers, who had not the Scriptures, generally acknowledged a Supream Power and Beeing, which all were to be subject to, some calling of it by one name, and some another; but while they acknowledged the thing, it is sufficient to signifie, that if the Scriptures were not in beeing, yet People might know that there is a
God: And they are not only in the capacity that the
Gentiles were, who knew and confessed,
That there was a God, and shew'd forth the Works of the Law written in their Hearts; but also, in the capacity that the Fathers of old were; who did not only know that there was a
God, but knew the only true
God, and were the acceptable Worshippers of him before Scriptures were written.
And these things I speak not in the least to under-value the Scriptures, or out of a slight esteem of them; for they are very profitable for Instruction, &c. and so I own them, and have great esteem of them; yet if people have no more Knowledge then what they carnally receive therefrom, I may say as the Apostle said,
That what they know, they know naturally, as bruit Beasts; and indeed, knew nothing as they ought to know: And those that he thus spake to had the
Scriptures, that were then in beeing; yet had not the Knowledge of God, which he spoke to their shame, 1
Cor. 15.34. So that the End of my thus speaking is, to enduce people not to rest in a
Notional or
Traditional Knowledge concerning
God, which is fecht into the Comprehension out of
Scripture by the Wisdom that is from below; but that all may encline unto the Inspiration of the Almighty, which giveth Knowledge, and
[Page 317] wait in the Light which shineth in the Darkness; or take heed unto the Word in the Heart, as unto a Light that shines in a Dark place, until the Day-star arise there, that will expel the Darkness, by which the Understanding hath been clouded; and until the Light shine out of the Darkness, which gives the Knowledge of the glory God in the Face of Christ Jesus: And this is that Knowledge which is saving, and is of concernment for all to come to; because (whatsoever notional Knowledge they have) they that have not the Knowledge of God, shall be punished with Everlasting Destruction from his Presence, 2
Thes. 1.8, 9.
Ninthly, And Lastly,
J. N. saith,
‘That to deny the Scriptures to be the
Word of God, &c. is to leave men to walk by Fancy or Imagination, leaving that holy Rule, wherein Life and Salvation is declar'd, &c.’
Answ. This is but like the rest
(viz.) His own Assertion, without farther Proof: But whether denying the Scriptures to be the
Word of God, be to deny them to be believed, as containing true Testimonies concerning the Word (for so I have alwayes owned them) I may leave to the Reader to judge; and how it leaves men to walk by Fancy or Imagination (while
J. N. himself saith,
That the Blessed Spirit directeth into the Knowledge of the most holy Will of the Father, and that thereby the Adoption is known, and God owned, &c.) seems very strange; for, the Light and Spirit reproves all Imaginations and Fancies, and leads into all Truth those who receive the Reproofs and Instructions thereof: And therefore the denying of the Scripture to be the Word, while the Word in the Heart (which the
[Page 318] Scripture testifieth of) is owned; people are not left to walk by Imagination, but by the Word, which is a Light to the Feet of those who take heed unto their Wayes, according to the leadings of it: And the Help and Comfort that is to be found in the Scriptures People are not depriv'd of neither, though they are not owned to be the Word: So that
J. N. hereby and others, may see plainly that those sad consequences do not follow the denying the Scriptures to be the Word of God, and Rule, &c. as
J. N. vainly imagin'd, and boldly without Proof affirmed: And what do all those Affirmations signifie more then this, That
J. Newman (for all his large Profession of Knowledge and Understanding) is ignorant of the Holy Spirit, Power and Word of God, without which none can be born again? And so himself is found in the Unregenerate-state, and worshipping according to the oldness of the Letter; a Blind Leader of the Blind, which all are to beware of; for its such that lead people captive laden with Sins and divers Lusts, alwayes learning, but never able to come to the Knowledge of the Truth, which sets free, and which sanctifieth, which is the Word, as Christ said,
John 17.17. but labours to keep them from enclining to the sanctifying Word, which the Prophet declared should be their Teacher, which their Ears would hear behind, saying,
This is the Way, walk in it; when they turn to the Right-Hand, or to the left,
Isa. 30.21.
And thus having briefly gone through with the principal Scriptures and Arguments produced by him, to prove the Scriptures to the
Word of God, and
Perfect Rule, &c. and with the sad Consequences which he affirmed would follow by denying of them so to be: I shall leave it to the
[Page 319] Reader to judge, 1st, Whether the Word, so oft spoken of, as before, may be understood to be the Scripture? or 2dly, Whether that Word may not be understood to be that which was before the Scriptures were written, which so oft-times came unto the Prophets, by vertue of which they gave forth the Scriptures? and 3dly, Whether the Rule of the New Covenant be the Scriptures, called the New Testament? or 4thly, Whether the Rule of the New Testament be not the Law written in the Heart, even the Law of that Spirit which the Apostle said was the New Testament? and 5thly, Whether those sad Consequences do follow by denying the Scriptures to be the Word, or no, as
J. N. hath affirmed?
Concerning Christ being the Word of God.
AND now I shall come to the next thing which he insists upon, which is,
Christ being the Word of God; in which I observe he will own,
That he is call'd so, but he is not really so, pag. 49.
and that he is call'd by many Names comparatively, as a Door, a Vine, an Ensign, a Star, a Lamb, &c. but yet he is not really any of these, pag. 50.
Answ. What absurdities are here? might not
J. N. as well have said that though Christ is called Christ, yet he is not really so? and although he is called a Saviour, yet he is not really so? hath he not the same ground for the one, as the other? If Christ be not really what he said he was, is it not to make him a Lyar? whether is it more safe to believe what Christ said himself was, or to believe what
[Page 320]
John Newman saith he was? For
J. N. altogether contradicts Christ's sayings in Scripture concerning himself; for Christ saith,
Joh. 15.1.
I am the True Vine; But
J. N. saith, in the 50. Pag of his Book:
he is not a Vine. Certainly the greatest Truth that I can perceive demonstrated in this matter, is,
That J. N. is no Branch of the True Vine, nor yet grafted into it; for if he had been a Branch in the Vine (or a member in the Body that holds the Head) he would have known that Christ is really a Vine; and he would have also known that he is really all those things which he said of himself, and which they that knew what he was to them, said of him; and that it is by the diversities of the Operations of this one Lord, that he is known to be really all those things, but
J. N. hath sufficiently declared himself to be a stranger to the diversities of the operations of this one Lord, by denying him to be really what he affirmeth himself to be; and so hath given Christ the Lye, of which let him repent, before it be to late.
But what's the cause that he thus works, and shuffles, and denys Christ before men, to be what he said he was, and what they that knew the diversities of his operations declar'd him to be? is it not to take away the Key of Knowledg, to hinder them from going in at this Door, that are entering? is it not to keep people from believing, that the operation of the Word in the Heart (which is a Hammer knocking for resception) is the appearance of Christ, lest they should be converted thereto, by its own operation, and thereby be healed of all their putrifying sores? and is not this to do the Divel's work, to shut Christ and his saving Power out of his People, as though he whom the Apostle said,
ascended far above all Heavens that he might fill all things, could be circumscribed onely to a Body of Flesh?
[Page 321] [Mark] he did not only say, that
he ascended into Heaven; neither do I deny, (but acknowledge) that
he sits at the right Hand of God in Heaven: But he also said,
that he ascended far above all Heavens, that he might fill all things: And because he fills all things, therefore
None need say, who shall ascend into Heaven to fetch Christ from above, or who shall descend into the deep to fetch him up, &c? for the Word is nigh unto thee in thy Mouth; and in thy Heart, which is incomprehensible, and filleth all things; so that all may look unto him and be saved, even to the Word, which is really the Word, and is able to save the Soul even to the uttermost from all iniquity whatsoever; but
J. N. would not have this Word to be properly Christ, by any means, but shifts, and shuffles, and wrests the Scripture; and brings in his Meanings, as though they were of more credit, then the plain words of Scripture; and would fain put out our Eyes with his Atoms: But in the true Light, which makes all things manifest, he is seen, comprehended and denyed to be any true Follower of Christ, or Branch of the true Vine, or spiritual Worshipper.
But then (in the 50. Page of his Book) where he affirmeth,
‘that Christ is not really the Word; though so called
(he saith) there is an objection brought against this Truth in
Joh. 1.1. where the Evangelist saith;
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the word was God; from whence
(saith he) they object, and say,
That Christ was the Word from the beginning; which thing
(saith he) I cannot grant; for this place doth not prove, Christ, as Christ, to be the Word from the beginning; but it proveth the Word to be God from the beginning, for Christ was not Christ in the beginning, but the Word was God in the beginning; but Christ was in time, when the God head had taken Flesh to it self, and not before, &c.’
[Page 322] And in pag. 51. he saith,
‘It cannot be understood, that Christ, as Christ, should be the Word of God, from, or in the beginning; or yet called the Word of God; for he was not Christ till he took to himself Flesh in the Womb of
Mary; therefore Christ, as Christ, could not be the Word of God from the beginning.’
Answ. Mark Reader, whether or no the Affirmations of
J. N. do not frequenly contradict the Testimonies of Christ and his Servants; for the
Apostle, speaking of the spiritual
Rock, which follow'd
Israel, of which they all drunk, said,
That Rock was Christ, 1
Cor. 10.4. But
J. N. affirms,
That Christ was not Christ till he took to himself Flesh, &c. Therefore he contradicts the
Apostle's Testimony, who said,
That Rock was Christ; and therefore is not to be received.
Again, The Apostle said (by vertue of the Revelation of the Father)
That Christ was the Son of God, Mat. 16.16, 17.
Thou art the Son of God: And this Christ the Son of God,
was glorified with the Father before the World was: For that was Christ that said,
Glorifie thy Son with the same Glory that he had with thee, &c. Therefore Christ was Christ before the World was, and before he took to himself Flesh.
And whereas
J. N. saith;
He cannot grant that Christ was the Word from the Beginning.
Answ. That doth not at all weaken the Testimony of
John, who said,
The Word was with God in the Beginning; for his Testimony doth as much prove,
That Christ was the Word in the Beginning, as it doth,
That the Word was God; and
J. N. in effect confesseth it; but that he is blinded,
[Page 323] being a
Stranger to the Spirit that giveth Understanding, and being gone from the
Scriptures (which elsewhere he seems so much to applaud) into his own Imaginations and Fancies; for saith he,
He was not Christ till he took to himself Flesh; and he that took to himself Flesh, he acknowledgeth
to be the Word, by which he confessed,
Christ was the Word before he took Flesh; by which also in effect he acknowledgeth,
That the Flesh that he took in the Womb of the Virgin, was not Christ, but the Flesh that Christ took; thus much his own words import; but I know he will not like to hear of it, because it so deeply woundeth his own Cause.
And so after
J. N. hath rumbled through many Non-sensical Arguments, labouring thereby to prove,
That Christ is not really the Word of God, but only comparatively so call'd, &c. he findeth another Objection in p. 56. brought against his Affirmation,
‘And is (saith he) in 1
Pet. 1.23. where the Apostle saith,
Being born again, not of corruptible, but of incorruptible, by the Word of God which liveth and abideth forever: Which
Word, saith the Objector, is Christ; and the great Reason that is urged, is,
Because it liveth and abideth forever: But
(saith he) these words make nothing to prove this
Word here to be Christ; for
(saith he) the Apostle saith in vers. 25.
The Word of the Lord endureth forever; and this is the Word which by the Gospel is preached unto you.’
(And from hence J. N.
argueth)
‘That the Preachings of the Apostles according to the
Gospel, was that
Word by which they were born again, and which endureth forever.’
Answ. To which I answer, as sometime before upon
[Page 324]
occasion have said, There is a difference betwixt the the Thing Preached, and the Preachings of the Thing; and betwixt the Thing Witnessed or Testified of, and the Testimony or Witness concerning the Thing: So that although the
Apostle, by the
Gospel, (which is the Power of God) preached the Word, and preached Christ; yet the Preachings or Declarations of the
Apostle cannot properly be called Christ,
who is without beginning of Dayes or end of Life; nor can they properly be call'd the
Word, which abideth forever; and so cannot be concluded to be that by which they were born again: This Shift will not serve the turn of
J. N. to perswade us,
That the Word which the Apostle preached was not Christ, or that Christ was not that Word by which they were born again; for, when ever he preached the
Word he preach'd Christ; and yet his Preachings were neither the
Word preached, nor yet Christ; but Christ preached was the
Word by which they were born again, which liveth and abideth forever, as is evident by the Scripture before mention'd, which proves a Block too heavy for
J. N. to remove out of his way.
Again, In pag. 57. he saith,
‘This Word cannot be understood of Christ, because it is here called the Seed.’
Answ. Yet it may be understood of Christ, and cannot otherwise be rightly understood of Christ; because, as the
Apostle said,
Gal. 3.16.
The Seed is Christ.
Again, In pag. 58. he saith thus,
‘Neither do I go about to rob Christ of his Title, but do acknowledge him to be called the
Word of God comparatively, as
[Page 325] he is the Father's Mouth, and speaketh the Father's words, &c.’
Answ. Hereby we may perceive that
J. N. will not own Christ to be the
Word, no more then in effect he owns the Prophets and Apostles to be the Word; for he owns Christ to be the Word but comparatively, and not really so, and but as he is the Father's Mouth to speak the Father Words, and so were the Prophets and Apostles the Father's Mouth, and spoke his words, as the Spirit gave them utterance: So that if he was called the Word only because of that, every one of the Prophets may be as well called the Word also, because they were his Mouth, and spoke his words.
But what Absurdities are these, that
J. N. runs into, to make Christ not to be the Word, really so? I must needs acknowledge he exceeds (in one thing) all sorts of People professing Christianity, that ever I spoke with, or heard of; for I never heard of any, nor spoke with any, but would acknowledge Christ to be really the Substantial Word, though they will (many of them) plead for the Scripture to be the
Word (or as some stile it,
the Material Word) also: But
J. N. affirms the Scriptures to be properly and principally the
Word, and Christ but comparatively the
Word, and not really so: So that he out-strips all (in promoting the Scriptures, and in under-valuing Christ) that ever I heard of; and it is not his wresting of Scriptures, and jumbling his own Intepretations and Imaginations amongst them, that will effect his Design, or will prove Christ not to be the
Word of God, really so; nor yet to be Christ before he took Flesh, &c. For the Testimonies of himself, and of his Servants concerning him, (which
J. N. by his Imaginations labours to make of
[Page 326] none effect) will stand valuable and credible,
viz. That Christ, who (as
J. Newman confesseth) took Flesh in the Womb of the Virgin, was the
Word with God in the Beginning; and that the
Rock which follow'd
Israel was Christ, before he took Flesh; and that this
Word which by the
Gospel the Apostle preached, was Christ which he preached; and that the preachings, declarations, or words of the Apostles were not the Word preached; and that the
Word preached (and not the Preachings of it) was that by which they were born again, and which lived forever; and that the true Christ was the Son glorified with the Father before the
World was, and is without Beginning of Dayes or End of Life; the
Root of
David, and his
Off-spring also; the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End, and the Joy of many Generations; the Quickening Spirit that dwells in his People; the express Image of the Father's Substance, whom the Heaven of Heavens cannot contain, who is ascended far above all Heavens that he might fill
all things, who is the
Light of the
Gentiles, and the
Glory of
Israel: This is my Beloved, and this is my Friend; and he that hath an Ear to hear, let him hear.
Concerning Christ Within being the true Saviour.
THe next thing he undertakes, is, (pag. 60.) to prove that the true Christ doth not dwell in any man, as he is Christ, but instead of so doing, he goes about to prove, that the Body of the true Christ, that he took upon him, and in which he suffered, rose again out of the
[Page 327] Sepulchre, and that it doth not dwell in man; and so (as in divers things before) he appears like one that beats the air, or that loves to hear himself talk; for he opposeth that, which I know none affirm; and affirms that, which none, that I know of, deny; for I know none that deny that his Body was raised out of the Sepulchre; nor none that affirm that Body to dwell in man; so that I am not concerned to take farther notice of those things; though the true Christ, which was the
Rock, that followed
Israel in the Wilderness, and that was the Son glorified with the Father before the World was, for whom that Body was prepared to do the Father's Will in, who is ascended where he was before, and is again glorify'd with the same
Glory that he had with the Father in the Beginning; who is ascended far above all Heavens, that he might fill all things: This true Christ (I say) I must own to be a Quickening Spirit, and to dwell in man; and this is that Intercessor which the Apostle spoke of, saying,
Rom. 8.26, 27.
But the Spirit it self maketh Intercession for us with Groanings, which cannot be utter'd: And he that searcheth the Heart knoweth the mind of the Spirit; because he maketh Intercession for the Saints, according to the Will of God.
And although it be asserted by
J. N.
‘That Christ is with the Father, and sits at the Right-hand of the Father in Heaven with a
Body of Flesh; and therefore cannot be in man.’
Answ. I answer, I do not deny that he sits at the Right-hand of the Father in Heaven, with that very Flesh and Blood which gives Life Eternal to all that partake thereof: but
J. N. hath no
Proof for his being there with an
[Page 328]
Humane Body of Flesh and Blood, that cannot inherit the Kingdom.
But what! Doth his being at the Right-hand of God in Heaven hinder his
In-dwelling in man, more then it hinders his being in the
Bosom of the Father? Might he not as well have said,
That he cannot be in the Bosom of the Father (as
John testified, cap. 1. vers. 18.)
because he sits at his Right-hand, as say, he cannot be in man, because he is there? Or might he not as well have said, He cannot be at the Right-hand of the Father, because he is in the Father's
Bosom? For, by what he hath said, he appears to exclude him out of his People (who is the Image of the Father, which the Heaven of Heavens cannot contain) and to confine him only to a
Body of Flesh; though the Apostle said plainly,
That he ascended far above all Heavens, that he might fill all things, Eph. 4.10. by which it may plainly be understood, That his being at the Right-hand of the Father, and in the
Bosom of the Father, doth no way hinder his being in man; but as he is at the Right-hand of the Father, and in the
Bosom of the Father, so he is in man also: And they that know not this Christ in them, they are Reprobates, as the
Apostle said, 2
Cor. 13.5.
Again, In pag. 65. of his
Book he saith thus,
‘If he did ascend as Jesus, or a Saviour, then he had a
Body of Flesh; for he was not Jesus, or a Saviour, as he was God, but as he was Man’
Answ. That he ascended as he was Jesus and a Saviour, I own; but it doth not therefore follow,
That God was not a Saviour; for, although
J. N. boldly and blasphemously
[Page 329] affirmeth (without any
Proof, as his usual manner is) that he was not a Saviour as he was God, but as he was man: Yet it is easie to prove the contrary; because the Word which was with God in the beginning, and which was God, is able to save; and therefore is a Saviour as he is God, and also as the Word manifested in the Flesh (the Man Christ Jesus, who is God's Salvation) for the diversity of Names doth not add to his Ability, but to express his Dignity, and the diversity of his Operations, the diversity of Names hath been given him; and yet still is the same Lord under either of these Names, or in either of his Operations, whom the Prophet said should come forth of
Bethlehem Ephratah, to be Ruler in
Israel, VVhose Goings forth (saith he)
have been from of Old, from Everlasting, Mich. 5.2. [Mark] Is not Christ he that is to be Ruler in
Israel? And is it not he that is the Saviour? Then the Goings-forth of the Saviour have been from of Old, even from Everlasting; therefore he is a Saviour as he is God, and was so before he took Flesh.
And if this be too little to give satisfaction, That he is a Saviour as he is God, or that he was a Saviour before he took upon him Flesh, then take farther the sayings of God himself by his Prophets (and if you will not hear them, you will not hear though one arise from the Dead) Hosea 13.4.
Thou shalt know no God but Me; for there is no Saviour besides Me: And again, In
Isa. 43.11. he saith,
I, even I, am the Lord; and besides Me there is no Saviour: By all which it appears sufficiently that he is a Saviour, as he is God; and that his ascending as a Saviour doth not prove that either the Spirit (or God) was not the Saviour, or that the Flesh simply was the Saviour; because it appears he was a Saviour before he took Flesh upon him; and is Christ the same this day as yesterday, and the same forever,
[Page 330] the Spirit that quickeneth;
For the Flesh profiteth nothing, as Christ himself said, and therefore can be no Saviour, Joh. 6.63.
And
Isa. 45.21, 22. he saith,
There is no God else besides me, a just God, and a Saviour; look unto me, and be ye saved, &c. [Mark Reader,] beside the
Saviour there is
no God, as saith God himself by the Prophet; so that if the affimation of
J. N. and other such Professors be true;
That the body of Flesh that Christ took (which in Scripture is called the body of Jesus) be the onely Saviour; then the Prophets Words must be false, or else, there must be no God, but the
Body of Flesh, because,
there is no God else but the Saviour, as said God; But to say,
There is no God, but that body of Flesh that the Word took, would be gross and horrid Blasphemy; but such is the effect of the Affirmation of
J. N. by which he may see his Ignorance, Presumption and Blasphemy; and this may suffice forever to stop the Mouthes of those who affirm
the body of Flesh that Christ took, to be the Saviour, and do deny him to be
a Saviour as he is God.
And that all may be informed where to look unto him (according to the exhortation of the Prophet) and be saved, observe what the Prophet
Amos saith, Chap. 4. vers. 13.
he that declareth unto man what is his thought, the God of Hosts is his Name, and (Jer. 17.10.)
I the Lord search the Heart, &c. by which thou mayest understand that this is God the Saviour, and Christ the quickening Spirit (
for Christ is God, Rom. 9.5.) that searcheth thy Heart, and sheweth thee thy thoughts; though thou hast thought him to be such an one as thy self, and hast set him at a distance in thy Imaginations; yet he is near at Hand unto thee, (the Word in thy Heart, who is a Searcher thereof; and a Discerner of thy thoughts, which he shews unto thee)
[Page 331] that so thou mayst look unto him, to be led and instructed by his good Spirit of Grace,
which bringeth Salvation unto Light in all who are taught thereby to order their Conversation aright, Psal. 50.13. and this is that free Grace
which hath appeared unto all men, Tit. 2.11, 12. by which the primative
Christians were taught (as by a standing Rule, according to which they walked) And by which,
through Faith they were saved, as the Apostle testified
Eph. 2.8. though many turned from this Grace into Wantonness, and did dispite to the Spirit thereof, as they do at this day; And those are they that Rebel against the Light wherewith every one is enlightned, and labours to render it insufficient to save; not considering that this is that Grace that hath appeared to all, and by which they were saved, and which God said unto
Paul, was Sufficient for him; and so they trample under foot, that blood of the everlasting Covenant, which is Drink indeed, by which they that walk in the Light are clensed from all sin.
But then he saith (in page 68.)
‘There is an Objection brought against him from 2
Cor. 5. where
Paul saith,
Though he had known Christ after the Flesh, yet henceforth know I him so no more.’ But in page 70. he saith.
‘The
Apostle is so far from denying to know Christ in a
Body of Flesh, though Glorified, that he doth affirm the same to the Church of the
Ephesians, Eph. 5.30. where he saith,
We are Flesh of his Flesh, and Bone of his Bone: but
(saith he) the
Apostle did not intend to know Christ in the Flesh attended with all those Infirmities as he was subject to in his suffering Estate.’
Answ. If by the Body of Flesh that Christ had, he means the Church which the
Apostle speaks of, which was
[Page 332] the
Body of which
Christ (the
Power and
Word) was Head, and they Members of, then I am one with him; for, his having that
Body (after his Ascention) I never denyed, nor intend to do so: but that
Body could not be call'd the Saviour; for
Christ was the Saviour of that
Body, of which they were Members, was yet on Earth: And the
Apostle was not without expectation of the same Sufferings (in measure) to attend
Christ in those Members of his
Body, as had attended him before; for, in
Col. 1.24. he saith thus,
Who now Rejoyce in my Suffering for you, and fill up that which is behind of the Afflictions of Christ in my flesh, for his Body's sake, which is the Church; by which it appears, that Afflictions did still attend those Members of
Christ's Body, who (as J. N. confesseth)
was Flesh of his Flesh, and Bone of his Bone: And such a
Body we own
Christ had after his Ascension, and still hath, though not free (as yet) from suffering Afflictions; yet his
Body shall be fashioned like unto his glorious
Body; which is not so confined, as he vainly imagins they were Flesh of his Flesh, &c. This doth not in the least prove that Christ is not in man, but rather the contrary; for can it be rationally concluded, that he should be at a distance from the Members of his own
Body? No certainly: If the
Body be divided from the
Head, it is no more a perfect
Body, but dead
Members: So that Christ, the Head (the Quickening Spirit) having men to be Members of his
Body, of his
Flesh, and of his
Bone, we may rationally conclude (if we had no other Evidence) That he is not at a distance from his
Body, but present with them, and therefore in them, as himself said, Joh. 14.17.
He is with you, and
shall be in you: And in verse 20.
At that day you shall know that I am in my Father [Mark, in the Bosom of the Father]
and you in me, and I in you.
[Page 333]Well Reader, There are many things remaining in this
Book of
J. N's concerning Christ's being in man, and also out of him; to which an Answer might be return'd, to manifest his Ignorance and Confusion, which for brevity-sake I shall omit; for it would fill too large a Volumn to publish to the World at this time; especially, because those same things have been answer'd by us again & again: yet I cannot well but observe some few things more, that his Confusion and Opposing of himself may further appear.
Concerning the Spirit's Guidance.
IN pag. 84. speaking of the Spirit being given to the Saints, he saith,
‘It is of the same Beeing of the Father and Son; and also of the same Nature, Power and Tendency of both. And in pag. 54. he said, 'That Spirit is God.’
Answ. If the Spirit given to the Saints, be of the same Beeing of the Father and Son, as
J. N. in this place truly affirmeth; then it is of the same Substance of the
Father and Son; for the same Beeing is the same Substance, and the same Substance or Beeing is not divided into several Beeings; therefore if the Spirit, which is of the same Beeing of the Father and Son be in man, then the
Father and
Son is (according to the measure thereof) in men also.
And herein
J. N. hath contradicted his own sayings in pag. 78. where he tells us of a distinct Beeing of
God and
Christ out of all men;
For if a part of the same Beeing of them be in man, how can it rationally be concluded that they are a distinct Beeing from their own Beeing in Man?
[Mark Reader] I would not be mistaken, but rightly
understood in this matter, it being a matter of the greatest
[Page 334] weight and moment: I do not oppose the Beeing of God and Christ out of man, in the
highest Heavens, nor in the
lowest Hell, because Infinite and Incorruptible; but his so being distinct, as to exclude his Nature and Presence from man, thereby denying his In-dwelling, is the thing which I oppose (and which
J. N. hath confounded himself about) because the
Beeing of God (who is a Spirit) and
Christ, who is the Quickening Spirit, cannot be divided [and
J. N. in pag. 62. also saith,
Christ cannot be divided.] And the Spirit of God, which is in man being of the same
Beeing or
Substance with the
Father and
Son: All which is that
Infinite Beeing or
Substance, which the Heaven of Heavens cannot contain; it cannot be said, they have not a
Beeing in man; but a measure of the same
Beeing or
Substance (which is not divided) ought as properly to said in man, as in the highest Heavens: And this is that
God, who is Light, 1
Joh. 1.5. who is in all, through all, and over all blessed forever, whom the
World by wisdom can never attain to the
knowledg of.
Again, If the Spirit be God, as
J. N. in pag. 54. affirms, which is certainly true (because God is a Spirit) and the Spirit be in the Saints, and in Man, leading into his most holy Will (as J. N. also confesseth in pag. 77, & 84.) Then how can it be said, That
God that fills Heaven and Earth, who is a Spirit,
dwells not in man, as he elsewhere saith? Unless he will conclude the Spirit of God to be divided into several Beeings, which cannot be; therefore his
Beeing is not only afar off, but near at hand, even in man; but that lofty One, that dwells in the high and holy place, is known also with him that is
poor, &c. and his Delight is with the
Sons of men.
Again, If the Spirit in the Saints be (as J. N. to the wounding of his
own Cause, saith) of the same
nature, tendency and
power with the
Father and
Son; then there is a sufficient Saviour
[Page 335] in man; for the
Tendency of the
Son is to save, as J.N. himself (I dare say) will acknowledge; and his
Nature is to save which was the end of his coming, and he is of power to save;
For all Power in Heaven and Earth is given to the Son; and the
Nature of the
Father is to save, as I have befor shewed out of the
Prophets; therefore the Spirit, that is given into the hearts of People (which
reproves them for sin) being of the same
nature, power and tendence with the
Father and
Son, is sufficient to save; else it cannot be said to be of the same
nature, tendency and
power: so that none need go far, or
look to the Hills and Mountains for a Saviour; but look unto him that is nigh
(who is of power to save) even to the
Light or
Grace, that hath appear'd as a Reprover of the deeds of Darkness; and this will
lead into all Truth, and save out of all Unrighteousness; and unto them that walk here, in Christ the Light (not after the Motions of the Flesh) but after the Leadings of the Spirit, there will be no Condemnation. And although this
God who is Light, and is a Spirit,
be a God afar off also, as being that
Infinite Incomprehensible Fulness that fills all things; yet all that can be
known of him by any man, is manifested within man,
Rom. 1.19.
And thus the Confusions and Contractions of
J. N. appears, who thereby declares, that he hath not the knowledg of Christ nor of God, to exercise his Faith in; nor yet doth he keep to Scripture neither, to exercise his Faith therein; but is seen and discovered to have his mind and his Faith exercised in Fancies and Imaginations, which is the cause of his thus contradicting himself, & of his affirming so many Absurdities, and Blasphemies, without sound reason or Scripture Arguments, sometimes dividing Christ and his Spirit, and sometimes acknowledging them to be of one and the same beeing, and sometimes joyn the Spirit and Scriptures, and arguing that they cannot be separated; and
[Page 336] the reasons he gives is, because the Scriptures are the givings forth of the Spirit; and yet notwithstanding will say,
Christ hath a distinct beeing from his Spirit, which is of his givings forth; and thus, as fancy leads him, he affirms things, as in Page 43. he saith,
If Scripture be denyed to be the Word of God, it maketh void the exercise of Faith, for Faith must be exercised in the Scriptures or else upon fancy and imagination; and in Page 73. he saith,
if there be no personal beeing of Christ, then there is no Christ to exercise Faith in▪ so by this kind of Arguments of
J. N. if Faith be exercised in
a personal being of Christ, its exercised upon
fancy and imagination, (which is very true) for a personal beeing of Christ is not Scripture, and he saith,
Faith must be exercised in Scripture or else upon fancy and imagination, But the truth is, he cannot tell what the true Faith is nor what it is exercised in, sometimes
Scripture is the only thing; and another while
a personal beeing of Christ; and what will it be next,
but even what his Fancy and Imaginations bring forth? which he appears full of, like one that knows not Christ the Power of God, (manifested in him) who is the
Author of true Faith, or the
begetter thereof; and is also the
object thereof, in which it is exercised, and in whom it stands, whom all must hear, that receive the true Faith, which is the victory that overcometh the World, and which giveth access unto God; in which Faith, there is Peace, and Joy unspeakable, and full of Glory.
Again, in Page 87. mentioning that Scripture which seems as a Block in his way, which I perceive he would fain remove, (Gal. 4.19)
till Christ be formed in you; and therefore gives this meaning, viz.
This forming of Christ in the Saints, was but to bring them forth into a Gospel-Purity, &c. this is his Interpretation of that Scripture, and a very favorable one too; but whereby should they be brought forth into a Gospel Purity? Was it not by the Spirit's operation that
[Page 337] was in them, which they received by the hearing of Faith
Gal. 3.2. which
J. N. acknowledged to be of the same beeing of the Father and the Son? If so, then was not Christ, according to Measure, (who fills all things) really in them, who hath diversity of operations, who came for judgment, and to send Fire on the Earth; and were they not to be brought forth into that Gospel Purity (that
J. N. speaks of) by his Spirit of judgment and of burning which they had received, who came for judgment, and to send Fire; seeing God signified by his Prophet, that
the Filth of the Daughter of Sion
should be purged away with the Spirit of judgment and of burning? Isa. 4.4. and this was that Spirit, by which the Saints were washed, cleansed, sanctified, and justified, when the Apostle told them they were so, in the Name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God, 1 Cor. 6.11. and they that were thus washed, and brought forth into this Gospel Purity, they were made a Habitation for God (who as
J. N. Confesseth, is that Spirit) even through the Spirit's operations, which is of the same Being or Substance with Christ, so that the filth being purged away; there was room for him to dwell there, and so was really in them formed; and they brought forth in his own Image by his own operation, with whom the Apostles were Co-workers, and therefore travelled for this forming of Christ in them, or for the subjecting them in the Faith, wholly unto Christ's Goverment, that he might raign in them over all, who is God Blessed forever.
One thing more (which I find in the close of his
Book, which he entitules,
A Caution to all) I cannot well pass by with silence, where he saith,
‘Seeing God has cast
[Page 338] us into a day, wherein there is such a spirit running
too and
fro in this Nation, that will seemingly own
Truth, and yet will draw all into a Mystery within man, denying Truth according to Truth's Intent; let us therefore labour with our
God for his blessed Spirit, to
guide us into all Truth.’
Answ. [Mark Reader] Is it contrary to Truth's intent, to own the
Truth to be a
Mystery within man? Doth not
God love to have Truth manifested in the inward parts? Is not Christ the
Truth, which the
Apostle declared to be the Mystery within, saying,
Christ in you the Hope of Glory? How then can it be said, That that Spirit, that owns Truth to be a
Mystery within, does not own it according to Truth's intent? Surely
J. N. hath besotted his Understanding, else he would not thus speak.
And whereas he saith,
Let us labour with God, for his blessed Spirit, to guide us in all Truth. He therein seems to own
Truth to be a Mystery within also; for if the Spirit be to be receiv'd, it must be within; and the Spirit is Truth, because (as
J. N. elsewhere confesseth)
It is of the same beeing, nature, power and tendency with God, who is Truth, and with Christ, who is the Truth. And the Spirit is the Unction, which was received from the
Holy One, which was
True, and not a
Lye; so here he seems to own
Truth a Mystery within (the Spirit being Mystery) which before he said, was contrary to Truth's Intent; and thus his
Confusion appears from time to time: And moreover, if in such a dangerous time, as he supposes this to be,
the Spirit be the only Thing to be labour'd for, as a Guide to lead in all Truth; wherefore then does he so much cry against the
Quakers; whose Principle it is, and also their Practice,
To labour with people, to wait for the Spirit's Operation, that by it (as the most certain Guide) they may be led into all Truth? Hath he not also
oppos'd himself hereby, who not long before
[Page 339] asserted,
the Scriptures to be the only Rule, which do but testifie of the Spirit, which now he would have people
labour for, as a Guide in all
Truth, which indeed is the only Guide, without which the
Scriptures cannot be known, (because they are things of
God; and the things of God know no man but the Spirit of God, and he to whom the Spirit of God reveals them?
‘And
he saith, Let us not be hasty to receive an
Opinion, before we have weighed the same by
the Law and
Testimony; seeing there
are many false spirits gone out into
the world.’
Answ. That there are many false spirits gone out into the
World, I grant; and that is a
false babilonish spirit that contradicts it self, as the spirit of
J.N. has done, as before shew'd: And that is the true Spirit of
Grace, which teacheth to live God-like in this
present World: but that which leads into
Confusion, is not God-like; but such is the spirit of
J.N. therefore not to be receiv'd. And that all Opinions and Spirits are to be try'd by the Law and Testimony, I own; but what is this Law and Testimony? is it not the Light and Spirit in the inward parts? for
Solomon said,
The Law is Light; and the
Angel said,
The Testimony of Jesus is the Spirit of Prophesie, Pro. 6.23.
Rev. 19.11. So here is the Law and Testimony declar'd, which I dare say
J.N. never intended to direct people to, as a Touch-stone to try Opinions by, as he call them: And is not this Light the Law of the Spirit, which the Apostle speaks of, and which he sometimes called,
The perfect Law of Liberty? Jam. 1.25. And by this Law indeed
Paul said,
He was set free from the Law of sin and death: So as the Prophet said,
Let all to the Law and to the Testimony; or, as the
Apostle said,
Look into the perfect Law of Liberty; the Law of the Spirit, or Light thereof, in the inward parts; for this is that perfect Rule that leads in the
Way, in which a
Wayfaring-man, though a Fool, cannot err: And without this
[Page 340] there are none able to understand the Scriptures, nor to practise them; because of our selves we can do nothing; yet we are willing to having our Doctrines, Principles and Practices try'd by the Scriptures of Truth.
‘But (then saith
J.N.) the most dangerous spirit is this, that draws all the Happiness of this Life, and that which is to come, into man,
and finishes all the Glory of man at the brink of the Grave.’
Answ. If by the
Glory of man, he means
the Glory of Man, as simply a Creature; then I do say,
all that is to be finish'd at the brink of the Grave; for its
but the glory of Flesh, which,
as the Flower of the Grass, passeth away: But if by the
Glory of man, he means that which the Wise in Heart shall inherit (
Prov. 3.35.) and which is the Reward of those, before whom the Righteousness of God goeth; then I know none (except
Athiests and
Ranters) that
affirm or
assert any such thing; and I say also,
that is the most dangerous spirit
of all, and to be shun'd by all: But that spirit which would keep people out of an Expectation of seeing and beholding that Glory that is endless, while on
this side the Grave, is not much inferior (as to the Ill-consequences of it) to the other; for that would deprive people of the chief Happiness of this Life, and of the happy Enjoyment of that Glory which their
Peace and
Joy is full of in believing, while they remain on this side the
Grave; and may also endanger to deprive them of the enjoyment of that which is to be receiv'd in the Life that is to come: For, if the Earnest of the incorruptible Inheritance (which is a part thereof) be not receiv'd in this Life, what true Comfort can there be enjoy'd in this Life? So then that Spirit of Grace, or Word of Grace, which manifests its Light and Strength in the Inward Parts, by its own Operation, for the begetting of Faith in, and concerning it self, in all
[Page 341] that hear and receive it; this, I say, is not to be shunn'd, but adhered unto by all,
as unto the Author of true Faith; seeing
Faith cometh by Hearing, and hearing by the Word of God; and the Word is nigh thee, in thy Heart, and in thy Mouth, Rom. 10.17. and the Spirit is in the inward parts (which with the Word is one) by which Faith is given.
And all that hear this Word, and obey this Spirit of Faith, shall doubtless behold the
Glory of the Word, as the Apostles did, even as the
Glory of the only Begotten of the Father, full of Grace and Truth; and shall doubtless know that Faith, in which is Peace and Joy unspeakable, and full of Glory; and this will be unto them an Earnest of the Everlasting Inheritance, that never fades, by which they will be assured of the full Possession thereof, when time shall be no more.
And thus having examin'd the principal matters in this Book,
viz. Concerning the Scriptures being the Word of God, and the perfect Rule, and the sad Consequences which (he saith)
will follow the denying of them so to be; and concerning Christ being the Word really so, and (as he saith)
but comparatively so; and concerning Christ being a Saviour as he is God, or a Saviour only, as he hath a Body of Flesh; and concerning his being in Heaven with the Father, at his Right-hand, and his being in man really so; I say, having gone through with these things, and spoken as to them; I shall leave them to the Judgement of the Judicious Reader; desiring of God, by his own Spirit to give a right Understanding unto all that desire after him, that they may know him that is true to be manifested in them, that they may by his spirit be baptized into him to live and have their
Beeing in him; that so they may understand the things that appertain to his Kingdom, and to their own everlasting Peace;
that in the Faith of the Unchangable
[Page 342] Truth, they may stand as Mount Sion,
that cannot be moved.
And the rest of his
Book, consisting of a large pretended Answer to six
Queries, that were sent to him by a certain Person, whom I do not well know; I shall not much concern my self therein at this time, though I do acknowledge, that divers things therein contained, do concern the Truth, which I profess, and therein I am concerned; but it consists chiefly of things that I have already spoken to: so that what I have written, may serve for an Answer to all; for it would be superfluous to reiterate that, which in substance I have already gone over.